Re. Swapping over to N272-NAP200/250Dr

The Strat (Fender) posted:

Finkfan posted:

I still have my SN1 and 272/250DR. They are different. As to which outperforms the other would be down to personal taste I think. For me the 272/250DR combo is clearly better. Far more detailed and realistic in every way. The SN sounds deeper, but slower and veiled in comparison, to my ears. Adding a HCDR gave the SN a welcome boost in clarity, detail and the bass tightened up. Compare that combo to the bare 272/250DR and the SN/HCDR still sounds like it goes lower but it's still no match for the 272 in detail. Add an XPSDR to the 272 and it's done the clear winner in every way, again to my ears. 

But the SN2 is a considerably different beast to the SN2.  

Now I really am confused!

I guess it depends on were the 1 or 2 goes after the correction on the SN post, anyway 272/250Dr is in a different class to any Nait.

Artferg, whatever you choose ,please keep in mind this:streaming your music successfully starts well before the streaming device.

Don't underestimate proper streaming cables(there's quite a difference between this and a generic IT one) such a s chord or other alternatives, your router and/or switch and the way it is powered. The server and ,again, how it's nourished (I'm starting saving for a CORE as it DOES make the difference how music is served) ,the format(Wav being the best with Naim ,something I reckon should be dealt in the Streaming section) . So as you see not exactly a plain plan ). Ultimately do not ever believe those who tell you these are endless paranoia, but only trust your ears and do check yourself!!

SN1 and SN2 are totally different sounding amps, at least as much as the 250-2 to the 250-2 DR is!!!!

nigelb posted:

The Strat (Fender) posted:

Finkfan posted:

I still have my SN1 and 272/250DR. They are different. As to which outperforms the other would be down to personal taste I think. For me the 272/250DR combo is clearly better. Far more detailed and realistic in every way. The SN sounds deeper, but slower and veiled in comparison, to my ears. Adding a HCDR gave the SN a welcome boost in clarity, detail and the bass tightened up. Compare that combo to the bare 272/250DR and the SN/HCDR still sounds like it goes lower but it's still no match for the 272 in detail. Add an XPSDR to the 272 and it's done the clear winner in every way, again to my ears. 

But the SN2 is a considerably different beast to the SN2.  

Now I really am confused!

Wel of course I meant the SN1.  The functionality is considerably stripped down and by "removing the digital electronics has allowed us to enhance the pre-amp stage".   The words said to me by a Naim engineer on a factory visit in late 2014. 

HiFiman posted:

I guess it depends on were the 1 or 2 goes after the correction on the SN post, anyway 272/250Dr is in a different class to any Nait.

Not quite, just did a home demo not too long ago, if you use a 282 instead it might be in a different class, really more of a different presentation, but all the Naim fundamentals are there is spades with the SN2, but not so much with the 272. Sorry! Not to these ears at least!

Artferg20 posted:

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Couldn't afford an NDX tbh. I'm currently using a Vortexbox server into my Hugo and found the SQ not that great to my ears, I plugged my MacBook Pro yesterday and the SQ was much improved. My plan was either to look at an Auralic aries mini or Bluesound Node 2 both priced around the £500 price mark into the Hugo. My limit is £500 for anything done.

With the equipment I have now, there should be plenty to cover any change, if looking at the N272/NAP200route.

Plus an additional £500 i was going to spend on a streamer with what I have now.

I'm not sure I understand the maths here! Selling your Supernait and buying 272/200DR is surely going to cost more than £500. I can't imagine the overall cost would be much different to buying an NDX. This also allows you to integrate your Hugo into the system, which you can't do with a 272.

On a separate note, if you go for a 272/200, there is little or nothing to be gained from a new 200DR compared to a good used non-DR 200, which you could probably get for half the price. The DR spec of the 200 refers only to it's preamp PSU, which the 272 does not use.

ChrisSU posted:

Artferg20 posted:

[@mention:36201736949470193]

[@mention:51970829741422995]

[@mention:36201736971392588]

Couldn't afford an NDX tbh. I'm currently using a Vortexbox server into my Hugo and found the SQ not that great to my ears, I plugged my MacBook Pro yesterday and the SQ was much improved. My plan was either to look at an Auralic aries mini or Bluesound Node 2 both priced around the £500 price mark into the Hugo. My limit is £500 for anything done.

With the equipment I have now, there should be plenty to cover any change, if looking at the N272/NAP200route.

Plus an additional £500 i was going to spend on a streamer with what I have now.

I'm not sure I understand the maths here! Selling your Supernait and buying 272/200DR is surely going to cost more than £500. I can't imagine the overall cost would be much different to buying an NDX. This also allows you to integrate your Hugo into the system, which you can't do with a 272.

On a separate note, if you go for a 272/200, there is little or nothing to be gained from a new 200DR compared to a good used non-DR 200, which you could probably get for half the price. The DR spec of the 200 refers only to it's preamp PSU, which the 272 does not use.

The N272 is an ex demo unit, and the NAP200DR would be be offered with a discount. If a used NAP200 were available with my dealer this would be my choice.

If I were to go this route I have a Hugo 2, SN2 and Hi cap DR which would cover the cost alone plus £500 I have available.

An NDX used would be a minimum of at £2K plus.

Fair enough, I didn't realise you were thinking of you selling the Hugo too. Enjoy your lisrening session.

The Strat (Fender) posted:

nigelb posted:

The Strat (Fender) posted:

Finkfan posted:

I still have my SN1 and 272/250DR. They are different. As to which outperforms the other would be down to personal taste I think. For me the 272/250DR combo is clearly better. Far more detailed and realistic in every way. The SN sounds deeper, but slower and veiled in comparison, to my ears. Adding a HCDR gave the SN a welcome boost in clarity, detail and the bass tightened up. Compare that combo to the bare 272/250DR and the SN/HCDR still sounds like it goes lower but it's still no match for the 272 in detail. Add an XPSDR to the 272 and it's done the clear winner in every way, again to my ears. 

But the SN2 is a considerably different beast to the SN2.  

Now I really am confused!

Wel of course I meant the SN1.  The functionality is considerably stripped down and by "removing the digital electronics has allowed us to enhance the pre-amp stage".   The words said to me by a Naim engineer on a factory visit in late 2014. 

 

Sorry Lindsay, I couldn't help myself. Should've remembered my mother's words - sarcasm is the lowest form of wit. 

Cutting through all the speculation...Listen and decide for yourself. Bear in mind the 200DR is only using DR to power a pre. 

G

GraemeH posted:

Cutting through all the speculation...Listen and decide for yourself. Bear in mind the 200DR is only using DR to power a pre. 

G

Thanks Graeme 

Forget NDX/ND5 just get the MicroRendu and use USB--> Hugo 2. The Naim streamers are really very expensive when used merely as a streamer. I have a NDX and the only benefit it has is the system automation with my SN2. Wouldn't buy one today...

Artferg20 posted:

ChrisSU posted:

Artferg20 posted:

[@mention:36201736949470193]

[@mention:51970829741422995]

[@mention:36201736971392588]

Couldn't afford an NDX tbh. I'm currently using a Vortexbox server into my Hugo and found the SQ not that great to my ears, I plugged my MacBook Pro yesterday and the SQ was much improved. My plan was either to look at an Auralic aries mini or Bluesound Node 2 both priced around the £500 price mark into the Hugo. My limit is £500 for anything done.

With the equipment I have now, there should be plenty to cover any change, if looking at the N272/NAP200route.

Plus an additional £500 i was going to spend on a streamer with what I have now.

I'm not sure I understand the maths here! Selling your Supernait and buying 272/200DR is surely going to cost more than £500. I can't imagine the overall cost would be much different to buying an NDX. This also allows you to integrate your Hugo into the system, which you can't do with a 272.

On a separate note, if you go for a 272/200, there is little or nothing to be gained from a new 200DR compared to a good used non-DR 200, which you could probably get for half the price. The DR spec of the 200 refers only to it's preamp PSU, which the 272 does not use.

The N272 is an ex demo unit, and the NAP200DR would be be offered with a discount. If a used NAP200 were available with my dealer this would be my choice.

If I were to go this route I have a Hugo 2, SN2 and Hi cap DR which would cover the cost alone plus £500 I have available.

An NDX used would be a minimum of at £2K plus.

 

 

Don't do it... No way a bare 272 is even close to Hugo2. Also NDX isn't even close to Hugo 1.

The van dame rca to din is ok good clarity but a chord, vertere or Naim interconnect  will be more tuneful and rhythmic

the Supra USB is good, but the vertere is an end game USB cable 

you get what you pay for. 

At the end your expensive Hugo 2 is at the mercy of the cables you buy

Haven't really tried any aftermarket USB cables. The one that I have (Wireworld Ultraviolet) was included as a free gift when I purchased the Musical Fidelity M1 DAC about 5 years ago. I didn't find any appreciable difference between the Wireworld and generic USB cable when I swapped the cables. Perhaps there were differences but my ears could not pick them up. Will give it another go, some other time.

Kevin Richardson posted:

Forget NDX/ND5 just get the MicroRendu and use USB--> Hugo 2. The Naim streamers are really very expensive when used merely as a streamer. I have a NDX and the only benefit it has is the system automation with my SN2. Wouldn't buy one today...

I don't think so at all . They're great streaming devices as well. Same as uniti or 272 etc. Actually I do think the streaming side is very if not the strongest in all as they massively improve from either separate psu or very performing external dacs True they're not cheap but I'm pretty sure looking elsewhere often results in false economy. Naim dac for example has never sounded so good ,actually before those were issued ,this implies they are very good at that.

I didn't get to hear the N272/NAP200 as planned. Speaking with my dealer today aswell as lots of deliberation yesterday evening whilst enjoying vinyl. I decided I'd be foolish to make any form of change as I'm essentially very happy with things bar streaming.

The best course of action will be to put my attention to finding a decent source/streamer to feed my DAC and also upgrade my cabling USB/interconnects etc.

I have budget of around £500ish to spend now on a source or will save up and consider looking for a used ND5XS into Hugo 2.

Many thanks for input!

[@mention:36201736971392588]: Had a Logitech Harmony 650, which I've never bothered to use. Whilst my kids were at school today got to programme it to my means. Not perfect but works well enough!

Thanks

Sounds like a good decision to me. Optimising your system now with things like a good rack, dedicated mains, decent cabling etc. is always a good move. 

ChrisSU posted:

Sounds like a good decision to me. Optimising your system now with things like a good rack, dedicated mains, decent cabling etc. is always a good move. 

Thanks ChrisSu

You might want to make do with what you have until Chord have released their streamer add on for hugo 2, it could be a nice solution for you. It could be a year coming though.

I have read that Hugo 2 designer Rob Watts considers anything other than stock usb cable to be a waste of money as it will not improve sound quality and could even do harm to the signal. I simply use Belkin usb certified cable. Most audiophile cables are not usb certified and do not comply with usb protocols. I also use custom wired Chord Shawline RCA to XLR and think it's tremendous value for money and ticks all the right boxes (silver plated copper conductors, teflon dielectric, screened, silver solder, silver plated terminations, tuned aray).

I used to own a UQ2 as a streamer into a hugo 1,into a SN2,I upgraded to a 272/250dr and it is like live music,compared to good hifi,much better.If I were you though,I would hang onto the Hugo 2,and save for a Core to feed it...I really don't think you are getting the best out of it.

Raspberry Pi, HifiBerry Digi+, optical into Hugo 2. Streaming done to a high standard for about £100 and a bit of reading up. That's what I think I'd do.

Small outlay, much of which I'd imagine could be recouped should you move on, and lets you try streaming as a serious proposition while figuring out what to do in the longer term (if anything).

No quarter posted:

I used to own a UQ2 as a streamer into a hugo 1,into a SN2,I upgraded to a 272/250dr and it is like live music,compared to good hifi,much better.If I were you though,I would hang onto the Hugo 2,and save for a Core to feed it...I really don't think you are getting the best out of it.

Does the core have any other features bar ripping and serving such as internet radio etc?

No.