Re. Swapping over to N272-NAP200/250Dr

Artferg20 posted:

No quarter posted:

I used to own a UQ2 as a streamer into a hugo 1,into a SN2,I upgraded to a 272/250dr and it is like live music,compared to good hifi,much better.If I were you though,I would hang onto the Hugo 2,and save for a Core to feed it...I really don't think you are getting the best out of it.

Does the core have any other features bar ripping and serving such as internet radio etc?

Not sure if the core would suit my needs tbh. As good as it's supposed to be, there are other solutions I'd look at with a sum of £1800.

Dave***t posted:

Raspberry Pi, HifiBerry Digi+, optical into Hugo 2. Streaming done to a high standard for about £100 and a bit of reading up. That's what I think I'd do.

Small outlay, much of which I'd imagine could be recouped should you move on, and lets you try streaming as a serious proposition while figuring out what to do in the longer term (if anything).

I've thought about this before. If the SQ is very good, this is certainly an option I'd consider.

Halloween Man posted:

You might want to make do with what you have until Chord have released their streamer add on for hugo 2, it could be a nice solution for you. It could be a year coming though.

I have read that Hugo 2 designer Rob Watts considers anything other than stock usb cable to be a waste of money as it will not improve sound quality and could even do harm to the signal. I simply use Belkin usb certified cable. Most audiophile cables are not usb certified and do not comply with usb protocols. I also use custom wired Chord Shawline RCA to XLR and think it's tremendous value for money and ticks all the right boxes (silver plated copper conductors, teflon dielectric, screened, silver solder, silver plated terminations, tuned aray).

Well, the stock USB cable is too short (the one supplied with Mojo).

Not sure if the one with Hugo is more usable.

I can report very good results musically, on my Chord Dave and Chord Mojo with Vertere DFI USB cable.

Audioquest Carbon USB cable is also good, but I preferred Vertere.

No quarter posted:

I used to own a UQ2 as a streamer into a hugo 1,into a SN2,I upgraded to a 272/250dr and it is like live music,compared to good hifi,much better.If I were you though,I would hang onto the Hugo 2,and save for a Core to feed it...I really don't think you are getting the best out of it.

I'm afraid no, won't happen as well through the path you propose.

CORE needs a streamer to perform at its best. Have a look at the eye-opener 3D: 'Pensioner....etc.' our OP found out it he preferred CORE/ NDX/XPS over nDAC/555 which are much better than the former. That happens when signal is not handled with care as would a streamer do. Much better to go that way or  CORE/ND5xs/ with either his own dac or nDAC and later add PSU as I successfully did.

Artferg20 posted:

No quarter posted:

I used to own a UQ2 as a streamer into a hugo 1,into a SN2,I upgraded to a 272/250dr and it is like live music,compared to good hifi,much better.If I were you though,I would hang onto the Hugo 2,and save for a Core to feed it...I really don't think you are getting the best out of it.

Does the core have any other features bar ripping and serving such as internet radio etc?

Sorry for the late reply,HH answered your question,the point is,the Hugo 2 is supposed to be really good,but needs a quality signal fed to it,which the Core should do,but there are cheaper ways to get there.

As with all high resolution DACs such as the NDAC and the Hugo they really do need top flight amplification to get the full benefit from them, and perhaps more importantly precision clocked ultra low noise digital transports ... otherwise I suggest it is not really worth using these types of  standalone DACs as the end result could be rather meh and you'd be better off focussing elsewhere or looking at all-in-ones where there is a better matched synergy.

I simply use a new generation entry level macbook as streamer. Running on batteries it is fully isolated from mains, is highly energy efficient and has no moving parts such as fans (ultra low noise), is completely silent, offers isochronous asynchronous usb (Hugo 2 supplies the timing to the laptop, precision clocked) and offers bit perfect playback. Can be had for £1500. The humble laptop is what Hugo 2 designer uses as streamer/source.

I have to say though that Hugo 2 + laptop is not as elegant solution as Naim 272 or Naim's new all in ones. As to which sounds the best, that is up to the earholder.

same here I use my IPhone or my MacBook pro as a source into my Mojo and Dave.

Have to say again though, even though Rob Watts says don't spend too much money on a USB cable, vertere DFI USB cable made quite a difference. To make sure I am not imagining it, I swapped back to the generic Anker USB cables, and others, the vertere USB wins by a country mile, just more clarity, less hash, basically more music.

I can't justify the expense of an NDX into my Chord Dave, it will have to be my laptop, well especially since that is what Rob Watts uses

as for top flight amplification, hmm yes of course, but the benefits of Mojo, Hugo, Dave or NDAC/DAC V1 are quite obvious on my Yamaha Home theatre amplifier and KEF 2005.1 speakers. They all (and also DAC V1) really trounce the internal DAC of the Yamaha....

As I had motorbike accident two weeks ago, I have a bit of time on my hands at the moment. So decided to borrowed a Bluesound Node 2 from my dealer this morning.

 I've connected it into the Hugo 2 Via Coax. It has an impressive array of features and options with several music services, SQ isn't too bad at all, when I initially heard it, must admit I wasn't that impressed. Listening to now it as type, enjoying it a little more but can't quite put my finger on it, but not totally convinced.

As a difficult product to demo, I decided to take a punt this afternoon and ordered a SotM SMS-200 network player which should be with me on Friday.

Artferg20 posted:

As I had motorbike accident two weeks ago, I have a bit of time on my hands at the moment. So decided to borrowed a Bluesound Node 2 from my dealer this morning.

 I've connected it into the Hugo 2 Via Coax. It has an impressive array of features and options with several music services, SQ isn't too bad at all, when I initially heard it, must admit I wasn't that impressed. Listening to now it as type, enjoying it a little more but can't quite put my finger on it, but not totally convinced.

As a difficult product to demo, I decided to take a punt this afternoon and ordered a SotM SMS-200 network player which should be with me on Friday.

 

I would be very interested in your thoughts of the SOTM SMS-200,connected to the Hugo 2.I just talked to my dealer to arrange a demo of the Hugo 2 in a few weeks,my plan is to feed it from the Naim Core,and compare that with feeding the Core directly into my 272.I have read very good things about the SOTM,I sold my Hugo 1 to a friend,and he is looking at the SOTM to use with it,or a Micro Rendu.My other problem is,my dealer is taking his sweet time ordering my Core...I am getting a bit annoyed actually.

No quarter posted:

Artferg20 posted:

As I had motorbike accident two weeks ago, I have a bit of time on my hands at the moment. So decided to borrowed a Bluesound Node 2 from my dealer this morning.

 I've connected it into the Hugo 2 Via Coax. It has an impressive array of features and options with several music services, SQ isn't too bad at all, when I initially heard it, must admit I wasn't that impressed. Listening to now it as type, enjoying it a little more but can't quite put my finger on it, but not totally convinced.

As a difficult product to demo, I decided to take a punt this afternoon and ordered a SotM SMS-200 network player which should be with me on Friday.

 

I would be very interested in your thoughts of the SOTM SMS-200,connected to the Hugo 2.I just talked to my dealer to arrange a demo of the Hugo 2 in a few weeks,my plan is to feed it from the Naim Core,and compare that with feeding the Core directly into my 272.I have read very good things about the SOTM,I sold my Hugo 1 to a friend,and he is looking at the SOTM to use with it,or a Micro Rendu.My other problem is,my dealer is taking his sweet time ordering my Core...I am getting a bit annoyed actually.

No problem wiill do!

Would like to have ordered a PSU at the same time as I understand this improves the performance dramatically. If I find that I'll  enjoy it and keep it, will look to add this on at a latter date.

I think you'll like the Hugo 2, its a fantastic DAC with the right source etc and a easier listen in my opinion than the 2Qute I had before it,

Before getting deciding on DAC, it was either a choice of the uniti core or Hugo 2 and obviously chose the latter. With better system planning in the first instance and hindsight now.

 If I could start again would have chosen a N272....

I'm glad I got what I did when I had to make the choice two years ago. I just wanted three boxes that did everything, no dacs, nodes, reclockers, funny power supplies and sundry gizmos. If you want the 272, get it. Go with the heart. Cancel the sotm, whatever it is, and simplify your life. 

If you are bored and want to hear it in action, let me know. 

Uniti nova is imminent, will be interesting to discover how it will compare to 272

Hungryhalibut posted:

I'm glad I got what I did when I had to make the choice two years ago. I just wanted three boxes that did everything, no dacs, nodes, reclockers, funny power supplies and sundry gizmos. If you want the 272, get it. Go with the heart. Cancel the sotm, whatever it is, and simplify your life. 

If you are bored and want to hear it in action, let me know. 

Thank you HH

The 272 is my favourite naim product ever

G

Halloween Man posted:

Uniti nova is imminent, will be interesting to discover how it will compare to 272

It will be not easy, Which of these would you be interested in?

Uniti Nova VS 272 + 200 

Uniti Nova VS 272+ psu + 200 

Uniti Nova VS 272 + 200DR 

Uniti Nova VS 272 + 250.2 

Uniti Nova VS 272 + psu + 250 

Uniti Nova VS 272 + psu + 250DR

Uniti Nova VS 272 + 300 .....

...........

I think Nova should be compared with a superuniti and not against separate 

In terms of prices a n272 is £3469 and the Nova is £4099, so £630 difference. Add the nap 250 at £3680 to the n272 then it's not a fair comparison. I could argue comparing the Nova + nap250 with the n272+nap250 is slightly fairer, though still not financially the same value.

Op already has amp. Nap100 and 272 has comparable price to nova. Even so, price is irrelevant, sound quality is what matters. In the world of streaming and digital to analogue conversion, technology and progress moves fast and advancements will improve sound quality. Nova is Naim's new generation so I would fully expect it to give a 272 a run for its money.

Over a year or so ago I purchased a Chord Hugo TT at around £3K. I sold it recently to buy a Hugo 2 for £1800. The Hugo 2 is a step above Hugo TT for sound quality imo.

Hi. Since a streamer is the area for change, and you already have an excellent dac, I would also look into a SOTM-sms-200. I have one with NDAC-XPS-T.spdf/usb. For me, with the expensive but excellent ROON into hqplayer it is better than NDX, as I remember it and much cheaper. 

Fred

Halloween Man posted:

...
Nova is Naim's new generation so I would fully expect it to give a 272 a run for its money.
...

Not necessarily:  The Nova has a power-amp and that compromises the power supply; the 272 doesn't have that problem.

You might be right, I guess it depends on Naim's design and implementation of nova power supply, the proof will be in the listening. I would want to hear both before making my mind up.

SotM arrived this morning! Out of the box, feels like a very solid and well built tiny device, not much bigger than the Hugo 2 in size, but obviously taller.

Set up was a breeze, simply connecting to the Hugo via USB and Ethernet cable to the router and enter the IP address on your browser, this will take you to the device settings and player options.  As I'm a Roon user, this was the player option I selected and attached my USB drive, which indexing my library took no more than 15-20 mins.

I started with a few tracks from various genres I know well and had a good on listen to on the Node 2 from Jazz Matthew Halsall/ George Benson the ghetto, cinematic orchestra to Kate Bush and Dire straits. 

If I'm honest I wasn't expecting too much and had set my expectations very low, in fact the day before I was actually going to cancel it. Glad I didn't! must say from the off, I was completely blown away by the sound In a big way. Much more open and airy in the midrange in comparison to the Node 2, Its signature is very clean, detailed and fast, some may find it a touch clinical or I'd say transparent but this balances well off the Hugo in my opinion, 

Across a mixture of music this little device really does deliver in spades, it's extremely capable and musical. As I understand with the addition of a PSU the sound can be improved further, as it stands I'm a very happy bunny and at 11:45pm I'm still using it as we speak.

At last I'm enjoying the Hugo 2 and the system from a streaming perspective!

Artferg20 posted:

SotM arrived this morning! Out of the box, feels like a very solid and well built tiny device, not much bigger than the Hugo 2 in size, but obviously taller.

Set up was a breeze, simply connecting to the Hugo via USB and Ethernet cable to the router and enter the IP address on your browser, this will take you to the device settings and player options.  As I'm a Roon user, this was the player option I selected and attached my USB drive, which indexing my library took no more than 15-20 mins.

I started with a few tracks from various genres I know well and had a good on listen to on the Node 2 from Jazz Matthew Halsall/ George Benson the ghetto, cinematic orchestra to Kate Bush and Dire straits. 

If I'm honest I wasn't expecting too much and had set my expectations very low, in fact the day before I was actually going to cancel it. Glad I didn't! must say from the off, I was completely blown away by the sound In a big way. Much more open and airy in the midrange in comparison to the Node 2, Its signature is very clean, detailed and fast, some may find it a touch clinical or I'd say transparent but this balances well off the Hugo in my opinion, 

Across a mixture of music this little device really does deliver in spades, it's extremely capable and musical. As I understand with the addition of a PSU the sound can be improved further, as it stands I'm a very happy bunny and at 11:45pm I'm still using it as we speak.

At last I'm enjoying the Hugo 2 and the system from a streaming perspective!

 

 

Good to hear,thanks for that update...I had a feeling you were not hearing what the Hugo 2 is capable of.You know your next move has to be the power supply,keep the updates coming.

Kevin Richardson posted:

Forget NDX/ND5 just get the MicroRendu and use USB--> Hugo 2. The Naim streamers are really very expensive when used merely as a streamer. I have a NDX and the only benefit it has is the system automation with my SN2. Wouldn't buy one today...

I agree, Kevin.

The SOTM-sms-200 is said to beat the Microrendu: https://www.audiostream.com/content/sotm-sms-200-mini-network-player-and-sotm-mbps-d2s-intelligent-battery-power-supply

Fred

I will not pretend to know anything about software,but I find it interesting that the SOTM-SMS-200,the Naim Core,and Antipodes music servers all use Linux software,and are all considered very good sources into external DAC's. Maybe someone with more knowledge of this software might have a theory as to why Linux might be beneficial.Antipodes are praised as excellent sounding servers.