New speakers or 552?

I would definitely look at your speaker cables and interconnects, maybe SL full loom?  and as you have opportunity to hear the kudos 707, give them an audition first.

Boxes first. If you go for the 552 you would have the same system as me (apart from the speakers). I've tried the 252 before going for the 552. The difference is huge. 

Urm - I don't know the Kefs but the 707 would be great match with the 300 but would require an extensive home demo          

You can be pretty well certain that the 552 will be a paradigm shift and could buy without demo although still not ideal.  

Regards,

Lindsay

Given the calibre and balance of your electronics, higher grade speakers do make sense. And yes, I have also had Kef 205.2 speakers at home.

Kudos 707 are a good choice to put on your shortlist. I would be worth a call to Derek Dunlop at ART, to see which of their speakers he would recommend. I ended up buying ART speakers over the Kudos Titan T88.

Finally, the B&W 803 D3 and Wilson Sabrina are also very good indeed and well worth a listen.

re 552 vs. speakers, you will win either way. The 552 is a great pre-amp but all of the speakers mentioned above are also a noticeable step up from your much loved Kef 205.2.

Hope this helps, FT

Many thanks for your feedback, my gut feeling tell me that I should find another speaker first. The Kefs sound very good, but they are getting old and I believe that  newer speakers sound better. 552 may come later and this pre amp are hard to find on second hand market. At least in my country.

You will get both eventually.  At this level the speakers will always be the weak link.    There are dozens of speaker upgrades.   Why rush into it?   Settle on the electronics and then the speaker can be auditioned with confidence.   There is only one 552.   I kept my Merlins with my 500 system and they were a total mismatch but they sounded better than ever.   Now I have the Proac D40R and it is still the weak link.  

oldneil posted:

I'm planning one upgrade this autumn, but can't decide whitch!

It's very tempting to get rid of my Kef Ref 205.2. I have used them for 7 years so maybe it's time to sell them and try something else.

Must say that the new Kudos 707 look nice and it's possible for me to try them at home before I put the cash on the table.

Of course, there are other speaker brands, but I have heard Proac and Neat and think my Kef's sound better to my ears.

I don't think it's possible to borrow the 552 at my remote place, so I just have to trust other people's ears.

Mt system: NDS/555DR - 252DR - 300DR. (Hiline and NACA5).

it is also important to know the dimensions of your room.....

Mye room is 4.5 x 8 meters, The speakers on the short side. 

Don't mention the blasted 552. I was labouring under the misapprehension that it could cure Brexit woes; fix Donald Trump's hair and make North Korea play nice.

See this related thread for further entertainment/confusion.

John.

oldneil posted:

Mye room is 4.5 x 8 meters, The speakers on the short side. 

so maybe wilson sabrina, vivid k1, or sonus faber amati.....

The 552 does present music far more emphatically that the 252 .... it would give your speakers a real good kick up the ass. All areas would improve....however it could go as far as upsetting your perceived balance....the sound could end up being a bit more forward. My experience is that for me it was a good thing .... Naim really pushed things with this design....its a gloves off job...in a good way. The 252 is a much more relaxed approach....in a good way.

it's simple, 552.

Speakers are many in the market, but there is only one 552 in the world. Only bettered by Naim S1 preamp.

Let's get real - I've seen Metallica live, and my Naim/Dynaudio system gives me that thrill on Metallica recordings, renders that raw energy very well. 

That is what a 552 is about, live music in the home. 

Richieroo posted:

The 552 does present music far more emphatically that the 252 .... it would give your speakers a real good kick up the ass. All areas would improve....however it could go as far as upsetting your perceived balance....the sound could end up being a bit more forward. My experience is that for me it was a good thing .... Naim really pushed things with this design....its a gloves off job...in a good way. The 252 is a much more relaxed approach....in a good way.

I love to have the energy of a live rock concert at home.

552 delivers on this.

Not sure about 252. I've heard it twice, but I have doubts. 

552 on the other hand, no doubts at all.

J.N. posted:

Don't mention the blasted 552. I was labouring under the misapprehension that it could cure Brexit woes; fix Donald Trump's hair and make North Korea play nice.

See this related thread for further entertainment/confusion.

John.

John, you are getting confused. Only a Chord dac can do those things. 

woooww i just check that 552 is 15 years old....

there is no 15 year old electronic product  commanding this kind of price with a cult like followers... 

i must admit i am considering one despite my logic says no...

Emre, just because it's an oldish design doesn't diminish its capability... there is clearly a difference between a quality designed and constructed example of analogue electronics and Moore's law and mass consumer electronic production in China.

Rather than rely on your logic, assuming you can afford it, have a listen and decide whether it's for you and it brings to the table what you are after... I did... certainly don't rely on the cult like hyperbole on this forum about it

the 552 isn't a 15 year old electronic product.

It's the second best preamp in the world .

If a manufacturer has a perfect design (or in practical terms the nearest to perfection that can be achieved without a huge step up in price) why should they ever change it? Of course, manufacturers often do, because the public seemingly always demands new things and if other manufacturers bring out new models then after a while the one that doesn't loses sales because of mass belief that newer must be better, etc., etc. I often wonder if blind comparisons were to be made between products today and their nearest equivalents from 20, 30 or even 40 years ago, whether people would really hear a difference, and if they did, which they would prefer (especially if it were possible to obtain in original genuinely as-new condition, and of course excluding rapidly developing technology like digital).

edit: deleted rest because I realised I was in the wrong thread!

Simon-in-Suffolk posted:

Emre, just because it's an oldish design doesn't diminish its capability... there is clearly a difference between a quality designed and constructed example of analogue electronics and Moore's law and mass consumer electronic production in China.

Rather than rely on your logic, assuming you can afford it, have a listen and decide whether it's for you and it brings to the table what you are after... I did... certainly don't rely on the cult like hyperbole on this forum about it

i listened once, it was very good but it was such a system i can not identify the 552.... i wish i had chance to listen it with 300dr 

i am at the worst point, can afford it but at a great cost of savings / holidays of that year... also once you buy the 552 you will start to look at NAP500, it never ends...

my logic says to stay away and enjoy my 1 hour per day music time with my 272, i got two young boys jumping on my head till 8:30-9:00 PM... then i start to snooze because i wake up at 05:30 am to go to work, avoiding traffic....

Fair point...re home balance, the 272 with a good psu is very good .... Naim juggled the compromises so well..... having said that you only live once.  :-)))

552.

analogmusic posted:

it's simple, 552.

Speakers are many in the market, but there is only one 552 in the world. Only bettered by Naim S1 preamp.

Let's get real - I've seen Metallica live, and my Naim/Dynaudio system gives me that thrill on Metallica recordings, renders that raw energy very well. 

That is what a 552 is about, live music in the home. 

You've upgraded to a 552 alalogmusic, congratulations! How long have you had it? Great pre amp. I really enjoy mine, too.

Having initially listened to Kudos 707s fronted by a 252, I'm not so sure I'd go for the 552 first. Yes, ultimately I would have one, but if you already had the funds in place for a 552 and if you bought the 707s first, you'd have  £7-8k towards your future 552 and your current system would be sounding pretty sweet.

The Strat (Fender) posted:

Urm - I don't know the Kefs but the 707 would be great match with the 300 ......          

 

Interesting. I've heard the 707s with a NAC552 / NAP500 and I've been thinking maybe a Kandid and a NAP500 should be first - not that I can afford either 

Dave J posted:

analogmusic posted:

it's simple, 552.

Speakers are many in the market, but there is only one 552 in the world. Only bettered by Naim S1 preamp.

Let's get real - I've seen Metallica live, and my Naim/Dynaudio system gives me that thrill on Metallica recordings, renders that raw energy very well. 

That is what a 552 is about, live music in the home. 

You've upgraded to a 552 alalogmusic, congratulations! How long have you had it? Great pre amp. I really enjoy mine, too.

Having initially listened to Kudos 707s fronted by a 252, I'm not so sure I'd go for the 552 first. Yes, ultimately I would have one, but if you already had the funds in place for a 552 and if you bought the 707s first, you'd have  £7-8k towards your future 552 and your current system would be sounding pretty sweet.

One of my close friends owns a 552 and I'm very familiar with how it sounds as I've heard it countless times now.

I'm not lucky enough to own one, so I am enjoying my 282...... with a Chord Dave.

Sorry for late answer and thanks to you all for advice, seems that most people go for 552 first, but I don't think many of you actually have heard the Kef's (?).

They sound very, very good on good recordings (like ECM and ACT) and classical, but show their shortage when it comes to poor engineered records, albums from the seventies or much of indieband's recordings. Their treble can really hurt sometimes and I have to turn the volume down.

Therefore I sell them now and will come back to 552 later. If a used 552 is showing up in my own country I will be tempted, but I don't think there are more than one or two in my country, and they probably never will be sold..

Thanks again!