Super Lumina trial

Harry posted:

If Naim didn't exist I wouldn't have any trouble living with and loving a Linn streaming system. The only thing that consistently leaves me cool about Linn is the neatness of the presentation. It seems to come with a bow tied around it. Even playing badly recorded Punk, it is easy for me to envisage a conductor waving a baton in the studio. Maybe I think this because I am now so used to how Naim seems to get into the guts of things.

I can relate to that!

Introduced to Linn in the Late 80's, just joined Naimland in the Fall of 2014.

Harry posted:

analogmusic posted:

There is. 

Otherwise why buy Naim at all ?

Because of the insight, the communication, the realism.

There is no Naim sound. If there was, everything would sound the same. 

           {The Evolving Naim Sound}

CB>Olive>Black Box> SL/Black Box

Allante93!

PS. Stop it Mr. Blackmorec!

That makes to much Sense! 

I heard that super lumina was a naim version of vertere is this right????

Not at all

they sound very different 

Richieroo posted:

I heard that super lumina was a naim version of vertere is this right????

made by vertere for naim....

Thought so.....

Says who ???

I have read it in a few places .... then I looked on their web site and it guess what it does look suspiciously similar .....  Mr rooster can you shine any light on this???

Are all of the super lumina cables manufactured by Vertere?  If so, are they bespoke for Naim's requirements or simply rebadged standard vertere cables?

Peter

Richieroo posted:

I have read it in a few places .... then I looked on their web site and it guess what it does look suspiciously similar .....  Mr rooster can you shine any light on this???

i have read many times this , and just tried to find this information on google, but without success.  I hope i have not read wrong information....

as both companies won't answer the question, I did my homework

The vertere cables have their own house sound, very dynamic, lively, but they do have a sound of their own - which actually I do happen to like a lot. Put a Vertere cable in a Naim chain, you can hear that right way, and it does not have the relaxed but Dynamic at the same time of a SL interconnect, it is just a very lively, "Live sound" cable.  

I think they say it better "Sit back, relax, and feel the impact of real musicians in the comfort of your home."

Superlumina is very much a Naim sounding cable, in fact me and a close friend burst out laughing whenever we put SL cables back next to Vertere, as it really got the Naim sound,  (hint - the midrange is very typically Naim - and actually sounds like most Chord interconnects too - like the old Chyrsalis - the huge midrange)

They are made of different materials : Vertere is Gold plated connectors, Superlumina Silver plated ones.

The Naim interconnects have the patented Naim air plugs, the Vertere don't.

So - NO, Naim are not taking Vertere cables and re-badging them. ( I think Naim would be be very offended at the suggestion). 

I am not suggesting it is a rebadge job .... however, Naim do not manufacture cable wire .... I suspect that the cable is sourced and then terminated with their bespoke plugs. Also naim will have tested loads of cable types before selecting. Thus is nothing to be ashamed of ..... 

........ and neither have denied it as far as I know. So on the balance of probability I think a connection  is likely. 

The insulation is different too.

Vertere used Teflon - Naim apparently does not - on the only review of SL on their own website, it says the insulation of polyolefin. 

So no they aren't the same cables, even if they use the same basic idea. 

And very strange- Vertere cables need no running in at all, and sound great out of the box

SL - on the other hand - needs 200 hours running time.

How could they be the same cables?

analogmusic posted:

as both companies won't answer the question, I did my homework

The vertere cables have their own house sound, very dynamic, lively, but they do have a sound of their own - which actually I do happen to like a lot. Put a Vertere cable in a Naim chain, you can hear that right way, and it does not have the relaxed but Dynamic at the same time of a SL interconnect, it is just a very lively, "Live sound" cable.  

Superlumina is very much a Naim sounding cable, in fact me and a close friend burst out laughing whenever we put SL cables back next to Vertere, as it really got the Naim sound,  (hint - the midrange is very typically Naim) 

They are made of different materials : Vertere is Gold plated connectors, Superlumina Silver plated ones.

The Naim interconnects have the patented Naim air plugs, the Vertere don't.

So - NO, Naim are not taking Vertere cables and re-badging them. ( I think Naim would be be very offended at the suggestion).

 

 

 

vertere and superlumina don't apparently sound the same, but it is not a proof that vertere audio don't make these superlumina with naim specifications.  I would like to find the information again....

I also read and my dealer confirmed me, that powerline is made by furutech.    Maybe someone here will confirm or not this superlumina mistery....

Richieroo posted:

I am not suggesting it is a rebadge job .... however, Naim do not manufacture cable wire .... I suspect that the cable is sourced and then terminated with their bespoke plugs. Also naim will have tested loads of cable types before selecting. Thus is nothing to be ashamed of ..... 

This may be true, But I think I know a Company that is familiar with Naim:

"The Chord Company was formed in 1984. It all started over dinner one night in Salisbury, when a group of visiting Naim Audio USA retailers asked Naim Audio UK for a good-quality DIN-to-RCA interconnect.  At the table, was one Sally Gibb, then married to a Naim Audio executive, who made the (historic) suggestion that she make the cables and start a business. With the blessing of Naim Audio, the journey to make cables for America began.... ""

Enjoy your Music!

Oops!

Allante93!

And indeed the chord chrysalis sounds and looks almost identical to the naim standard RCA to Din !

With USA referring to cables as ‘cords’, the name The Chord Company, with its obvious musical connotations, seemed perfect and it quickly stuck. Sally drew a logo, designed the packaging and started testing prototypes. Completely British design and construction, although difficult to source at the time, was paramount and days of searching eventually led to suppliers of sufficient quality. Friends at Naim Audio provided expertise and advice, with many of them helping to build the cables.

The first prototype was named “Chrysalis Cable” and the Americans swiftly returned with an initial order of 250! Cables were built, tested, packed and taken along to the Post Office.  Invoices were typed on a typewriter! After two steady years, The Chord Company got its first press review (by Malcolm Steward) and then the phone started to ring…

One thing for sure is Naim do not make cables. They obviously have it supplied to their spec and do the terminations. I wonder how many hi fi cable manufacturers actually make their own cables. 

Point being if you like what you hear!

Well....

Allante93!

Drewy posted:

One thing for sure is Naim do not make cables. They obviously have it supplied to their spec and do the terminations. I wonder how many hi fi cable manufacturers actually make their own cables. 

the cables are a huge part of the "naim sound"

It was very obvious to me when I changed from a generic RCA to DIN cable from eBay to a real Naim one.

WOW ! - it was a day and night difference.  

I was a cable unbeliever till then, now a total cable believer.

Yeah I was the same .... Super Lumina has seriously impressed me....

I do get upset sometimes. I love my name gear I love the standard interconnects. I enjoyed the difference a hi line made. I was gobsmacked at the difference a chord indigo made.  The reason I get upset is the same people that said standard interconnects and  naca5 are great and no other cable is the same are now the same people that have been brainwashed because now maim say they make a difference. It's just marketing. If you have a full loom of anything it will have synergy whether that be witch hat chord or naim.

The only lt thing you can guarentee when purchasing the sl is that you are hearing what animal want you to hear. 

It's amazing all the standard cables were good enough until naim jumped on the bandwagon. 

. 

I do get upset sometimes. I love my name gear I love the standard interconnects. I enjoyed the difference a hi line made. I was gobsmacked at the difference a chord indigo made.  The reason I get upset is the same people that said standard interconnects and  naca5 are great and no other cable is the same are now the same people that have been brainwashed because now maim say they make a difference. It's just marketing. If you have a full loom of anything it will have synergy whether that be witch hat chord or naim.

The only lt thing you can guarentee when purchasing the sl is that you are hearing what naim  want you to hear. 

It's amazing all the standard cables were good enough until naim jumped on the bandwagon. 

. 

no - Chord have been making very good upgrade cables for a long time

and Vertere since 2012.

Both companies upgrade cables are tangible and audible upgrades.

On a slightly different point - and something I have always wondered about. Where do the Burndy cables sit in all this 'loom' discussion. I have Chord Signature TA IC's between my CDX2 and 252 and between my SC and 250. They made a pleasing difference - but the Burndy between the 252 and SC would remain a constant no matter how esoteric (expensive) I went. Is it not a bottleneck - or is what Naim wire it with so good it will always keep pace?