Small speakers for Nap 300

Ovator S200's (which were never released)

That’s really helpful, like suggesting a unicorn as a pet. 

Ardbeg10y posted:

Ovator S200's (which were never released)

No, so how about a nice pair of n-Sats instead.  Oh, I see that HH has got there before me.  Still, I have greatly enjoyed n-Sats on the end of a big system.  Propelled by a CD555, NAC552, and NAP500 they really sing, although seismic low bass is off the menu.

If you are considering 2nd hand speakers, then carefully consider whether they are:

a) still in production

b) if not, still have support for driver rebuilds

We tend to keep speakers for a very long time, and cones/suspensions etc wear out. I have recently rebuilt my DBLs bass units because ATC can still rebuild the drivers. But there are no mid-range units from Naim. If something breaks, I'll have to think about Kudos 808 or something

Bit more serious posting this time (sorry, HH, I cannot be helpful al the time).

I currently have BW CM1's and CM5's. No highend hifi, but good enough for my Supernait 1.

Now and then the idea pops up in my mind to replace them by BW PM1's. PM1's are not produced anymore, must be bought second hand but could be the budget you have - contrary to more recent 805's.

Halloween Man posted:

French Rooster posted

i have asked the same question as you some months ago: for precise and accurate sound, but maybe a bit cold:  atc scm 11 or 19.  More “ natural” but a bit soft: harbeth hl5 or sonus faber stand month.    If i had the cash, i would go for the tad.....

Accurate, yes. I've never considered ATC cold, they simply reflect the music, if the music is warm then they are warm, if the music is cold then they are cold.

it is just my feeling, subjective i know....I just found them too neutral, a bit thin and not enough warm. But i understand that some like this sound.   Proac and bw are a bit fat , not enough airy with naim amps.  Harbeth and sonus faber are more on the warm side, but not enough fast for me.   Just my inner experience.

Harbeth P3ESR may fit the bill. I use them in a second system with a 250DR and i'm very happy although they definitely excel with acoustic / jazz / classical as they have a mid range to die for .. they are perhaps a little slow / warm with more upbeat electronic stuff though

andrew jameson posted:

Harbeth P3ESR may fit the bill. I use them in a second system with a 250DR and i'm very happy although they definitely excel with acoustic / jazz / classical as they have a mid range to die for .. they are perhaps a little slow / warm with more upbeat electronic stuff though

Harbeth is rather different to Dynaudio -- the OP's current speakers. I very much agree with our French friend that the Harbeth are somewhat slow -- quite a different animal to Dynaudio... Unless the OP wants a totally different speaker, ATC and ProAc might be safer choices... Or maybe an older Contour from Dynaudio if this was possible within budget?

i know Harbeth have their fans, and there is no doubt that the products are beautifully built. And I dont want to knock a solid UK company -- its hard running a business (I know, I have two)

But I quite like the musical timing of the bass to be in the same week as the drumkit... Just sayin...

Interested to see the ATCs being suggested. I have a pair of SCM 19 and was wondering if they would be outclassed if I ever upgraded to an NAP 300. I had a pair of more expensive audiovector floorstanders previously  but changed to standmounts as I had so many problems with bass boom. The cheaper ATCs are considerably better in my room. Clean and neutral sound. 

Will be interested to hear what you decide to do and how you get on!

French Rooster posted:

it is just my feeling, subjective i know....I just found them too neutral, a bit thin and not enough warm. But i understand that some like this sound.   Proac and bw are a bit fat , not enough airy with naim amps.  Harbeth and sonus faber are more on the warm side, but not enough fast for me.   Just my inner experience.

I agree they are neutral and don't sugar the pill but that's a good thing 

If the music or source is thin then they will reflect that, likewise fat or warm.

Bob, I suspect a nap 300 will drive most small speakers on the market.  It is more a question of your room and preferences, as you have Dynaudio speakers you might whant to look at their stand mount versions. Contour 1.3 mk2 and 1.3 SE should be within budget. A friend has mk2s which We tried in my system with great result and 1.3 SE I used to own before my Naim days, very good! 

Thank you for all your help so far my motivation for this thread is that my current Dynaudio X32's although a great speaker seem to be struggling a bit when playing loud since I added the 300,  I think that they just need a bigger room  when played louder whilst I had my 200 this wasn't a problem and I didn't have the 250-2 long enough to worry about it.  So my thinking is get a good fast stand mounted speaker that likes a bit of power and can play loud without falling a part.

I really, really loved the extra bass a bigger speaker brings but I don't think my small living room can handle it so perhaps back to stand mounts and a little sub.                                         

Halloween Man posted:

French Rooster posted:

it is just my feeling, subjective i know....I just found them too neutral, a bit thin and not enough warm. But i understand that some like this sound.   Proac and bw are a bit fat , not enough airy with naim amps.  Harbeth and sonus faber are more on the warm side, but not enough fast for me.   Just my inner experience.

I agree they are neutral and don't sugar the pill but that's a good thing 

If the music or source is thin then they will reflect that, likewise fat or warm.

i prefer a little bit sugar to very neutral sound, because the neutral sound tends to sound bright or agressive with some recordings. I don’t want to listen only to audiophile recordings.

The other point with accurate and neutral is that it can be boring too.  Atc are very accurate but not very colorful, not rich in tone colors...I prefer to run them with a powerful tube amp personally, like audio research.

My ideal sound with naim amps are sonus faber like speakers, but faster.....( i choose apertura)

Bob the Builder posted:

Thank you for all your help so far my motivation for this thread is that my current Dynaudio X32's although a great speaker seem to be struggling a bit when playing loud since I added the 300,  I think that they just need a bigger room  when played louder whilst I had my 200 this wasn't a problem and I didn't have the 250-2 long enough to worry about it.  So my thinking is get a good fast stand mounted speaker that likes a bit of power and can play loud without falling a part.

I really, really loved the extra bass a bigger speaker brings but I don't think my small living room can handle it so perhaps back to stand mounts and a little sub.                                         

Just out of interest Bob, what are the dimensions of your living room?

Bob the Builder posted:

Thank you for all your help so far my motivation for this thread is that my current Dynaudio X32's although a great speaker seem to be struggling a bit when playing loud since I added the 300,  I think that they just need a bigger room  when played louder whilst I had my 200 this wasn't a problem and I didn't have the 250-2 long enough to worry about it.  So my thinking is get a good fast stand mounted speaker that likes a bit of power and can play loud without falling a part.

I really, really loved the extra bass a bigger speaker brings but I don't think my small living room can handle it so perhaps back to stand mounts and a little sub.                                         

Is it too loud bass that's the problem? Or symply the X32s? I know nothing of them, but What HiFi Criticises them for "Lack of clarity at very high volumes". Maybe it is just a different speaker you need, not necessarily one lacking in bass. 

Bob, Wilson-Benesch Arcs.

Cheers, Chris

Hungryhalibut posted:

That’s really helpful, like suggesting a unicorn as a pet. 

You don't keep a unicorn as a pet, the unicorn keeps you as a pet!

the "uniticorn” seems also to be a kind of animal, a cat perhaps, playing ever and ever with its metadata....( refer to uniticore) 

I play music loud in a small (5mx5m) room and find Nsats and a sub work very well - actually better than my previous large Monitor Audio floorstanders. Nsats are fairly easy to find S/H but Nsubs are rare and IMHO overpriced when they do come up. Other subs, such as my Velodyne, can and do work very well.

French Rooster posted:

the "uniticorn” seems also to be a kind of animal, a cat perhaps, playing ever and ever with its metadata....( refer to uniticore) 

For native UK English speakers, Uniti Corn is a bad joke!

Pev posted:

I play music loud in a small (5mx5m) room and find Nsats and a sub work very well - actually better than my previous large Monitor Audio floorstanders. Nsats are fairly easy to find S/H but Nsubs are rare and IMHO overpriced when they do come up. Other subs, such as my Velodyne, can and do work very well.

In Britain, an 8m x 8m counts as a large room, not a small one!!! That's the trouble with adjectives like that, they are so imprecise, and realtive to the user's experience.

However, square rooms tend to be difficult ones, having two identical domensions. (Though as bad as a cubic room, such as an 8ft square room with 8ft high ceiling - not an uncommon small bedroom size in Britain)

Timmo1341 posted:

                                

 

Just out of interest Bob, what are the dimensions of your living room?

It is 4m x 4 &1/2m and is the front room in a Victorian terraced 2 up 2 down that has 9" solid brick walls and suspended wooden floors.  The room has a fire place and two alcoves the system is in the right hand alcove nearest the window one speaker is to the left of and quite close to the system the other is in front of the other alcove which has a shelving storage unit built in to it.  As you can see the set up is not ideal and does lend itself to stand mounted speakers I suppose.

French Rooster posted:

 

i prefer a little bit sugar to very neutral sound, because the neutral sound tends to sound bright or agressive with some recordings. I don’t want to listen only to audiophile recordings.

The other point with accurate and neutral is that it can be boring too.  Atc are very accurate but not very colorful, not rich in tone colors...I prefer to run them with a powerful tube amp personally, like audio research.

My ideal sound with naim amps are sonus faber like speakers, but faster.....( i choose apertura)

Many like the warm sound of distortion that a tube amp brings. To my ears it flattens and softens everything.  I like to hear music as the artist intended, ATC speakers give me that. I've never found them boring, always found them to reflect the true tonal colours of the music which just enhances the emotional involvement.

Innocent Bystander posted:

Pev posted:

I play music loud in a small (5mx5m) room and find Nsats and a sub work very well - actually better than my previous large Monitor Audio floorstanders. Nsats are fairly easy to find S/H but Nsubs are rare and IMHO overpriced when they do come up. Other subs, such as my Velodyne, can and do work very well.

In Britain, an 8m x 8m counts as a large room, not a small one!!! That's the trouble with adjectives like that, they are so imprecise, and realtive to the user's experience.

However, square rooms tend to be difficult ones, having two identical domensions. (Though as bad as a cubic room, such as an 8ft square room with 8ft high ceiling - not an uncommon small bedroom size in Britain)

It's actually 5mx5m - I did correct it within a couple of minutes but you were too quick for me - sorry! It is square but has a large inglenook fireplace projecting from the wall between the speakers - they are set in line with the front of the fireplace and still manage to image well.