Naim dac new worth or not!?

Ardbeg10y posted:

Maybe a dumb question, but when the Dac is externally powered, is the toroidal then switched off?

No, a small part of the DAC is still powered by the internal transformer.

Richard Dane posted:

Ardbeg10y posted:

Maybe a dumb question, but when the Dac is externally powered, is the toroidal then switched off?

No, a small part of the DAC is still powered by the internal transformer.

Which small part ?

Is it similar to the cd spinners and network players ?

TJ, a good question - I have forgotten!  I think it's the Blackfin DSP, however it's on the forum somewhere...

It's different to the CD players and Network players, which don't use any of their internal Tx when being owned from an external power supply.

Richard Dane posted:

TJ, a good question - I have forgotten!  I think it's the Blackfin DSP, however it's on the forum somewhere...

It's different to the CD players and Network players, which don't use any of their internal Tx when being owned from an external power supply.

If I remember correctly the internal power supply is used for the digital processing side and the external one for the analogue output stage. Hence the addition of, say 555PS, makes for such a dramatic increase in sound quality.

I wonder why Naim don’t offer a DR upgrade to the ndac. Surely that would provide a significant sonic upgrade.

Hard to believe Naim’s next dac won’t have onboard DR’s

FC, they do - it's the XPS DR or 555PS DR.

fatcat posted:

I wonder why Naim don’t offer a DR upgrade to the ndac. Surely that would provide a significant sonic upgrade.

Hard to believe Naim’s next dac won’t have onboard DR’s

Err........XPSDR, 555DR.......

I’m suggesting an onboard DR. (In the dac, not in a power supply). I think the SN2 has an onboard DR.

The closer they are to the circuit they power, the better they perform. Plenty of spare space in the ndac to accommodate a DR or two.

But, as I’ve suggested, maybe we’ll find one in Naims next dac.

Fatcat, yes perhaps naim will update the nDac. But currently one can hardly complain at the current level of performance. With or without external PS it is an excellent piece of kit.

I got rid of my ndac and kept the CDS2. I and everybody who heard them was of the opinion the CDS2 was better. Although, that was before the firmware update.

I now have a Mojo and wish I had an ndac.   I'm considering buying one S/H, but, feel sure Naim will be releasing a new model soon.

Did not get the impression that with the new Uniti range the Dac had changed significantly from other implementations, others may have other information. Could be a long wait.

I’m interested in some of the comments about how the source to the nDac changes the sound.  A few years ago when migrating from iMac based audio after my CDX packed up, I first fed the iMac into the nDac then latterly bought a Unitiserve SSD as that was marketed as the front end of an HDX, thus in theory I had ended up with a deconstructed HDX in bite sized chunks; happy.  For this reason I’ve always been hesitant about looking at an NDX assuming that would only add greater functionality rather than better sound.  Put another way, my system is Unitiserve SSD, nDac, 282/ HiCap, 200, PMC 25.24’s.  Around £3,800 buys me either an NDX, XPSDR for the nDac, or potentially a 250.  But which one?

I found that the quality of the digital transport into the nDAC is of paramount importance. Also compared my UnitiServe into nDAC and NDX into nDAC. NDX was a clear winner (in my room, with my system and to my ears).

Also NDX has one cool feature - it has an FM / DAB module which also works via nDAC (that's how I use mine).

The Naim dac was meant to be an upgrade route for all Naim digital devices with a digital output.

Gentlemen you really need to get out more. 

I'm currently listening to DSD 256 on a Holo Spring DAC and can assure you that DAC replay has moved on over the last few years. 

The next DAC I buy will most likely have RAVENNA  and the input will be Ethernet. 

.sjb

Richard Dane posted:

The Naim DAC is really rather special - excellent performance aside, if you delve under the bonnet you'll find much of the important stuff (BB PCM1704K chipset, 40bit SHARC DSP, I to V convertors, fully discrete analogue output stage) that is shared with Naim's absolute top end kit.  

Take a look inside - I wish it could come with a glass top because it's rather gorgeous to look at the innards;

Naim DAC info

In fact, the only thing that's not top end here is the price - relatively modest by Naim standards.  That makes it something of a bargain in my book.

Very pretty Richard

I have the Naim Dac being fed by the CD5XS and I love it to bits

I purchased a pre-owned one which is in mint condition and at the price I think it was a bargain

Nina posted:

Richard Dane posted:

The Naim DAC is really rather special - excellent performance aside, if you delve under the bonnet you'll find much of the important stuff (BB PCM1704K chipset, 40bit SHARC DSP, I to V convertors, fully discrete analogue output stage) that is shared with Naim's absolute top end kit.  

Take a look inside - I wish it could come with a glass top because it's rather gorgeous to look at the innards;

Naim DAC info

In fact, the only thing that's not top end here is the price - relatively modest by Naim standards.  That makes it something of a bargain in my book.

Very pretty Richard

I have the Naim Dac being fed by the CD5XS and I love it to bits

I purchased a pre-owned one which is in mint condition and at the price I think it was a bargain

Nina, this is combination I currently use and like it a lot, and think it suits my taste and what I’m looking for.  Adding either XP5xs or XPSDR improves it further. I’m not really interested in other makes, but would investigate a new Naim Dac if it came out !

Adam Zielinski posted:

I found that the quality of the digital transport into the nDAC is of paramount importance. Also compared my UnitiServe into nDAC and NDX into nDAC. NDX was a clear winner (in my room, with my system and to my ears).

 

I too have found the nDAC sensitive to quality of the transport. Unsurprisingly it performs very well with Naim transports.  Some years back I found I got a bigger performance uplift by swapping out my big Accuphase CD transport and using the digital output of a CDX2.2 than the performance uplift from putting an XPS2 onto a bare nDAC.  It very much surprised me but I've found my ears to be more reliable than 'logic' in matters of hi-fi.

TOBYJUG posted:

Arcam d33.

Electrocompaniet dac.

Both Dacs came out roughly the same time with similar price.    The Naim one has definitely got more going on with power supply regulation. Digital handling. Output stages and other goodies.

By interior looks alone the Naim Dac would certainly win

I've never heard the Arcam or Electrocompaniet so can't comment on their sound but my Naim Dac is a keeper, love it's sound  

Richard Dane posted:

The Naim DAC is really rather special - excellent performance aside, if you delve under the bonnet you'll find much of the important stuff (BB PCM1704K chipset, 40bit SHARC DSP, I to V convertors, fully discrete analogue output stage) that is shared with Naim's absolute top end kit.  

Take a look inside - I wish it could come with a glass top because it's rather gorgeous to look at the innards;

Naim DAC info

In fact, the only thing that's not top end here is the price - relatively modest by Naim standards.  That makes it something of a bargain in my book.

Hello, 

Richard what i want to say the dac is behind for what other dac's offers for the same or less money; i don't say it sound bad or broken but it's far behind in the area of technology, and i can give you examples. I don't want to speak about the sound because it's subjective, but maybe NAIM start to think develop new sources, and less marketing for old technology. Thanks.   

Getting more out of established technology is an area where Naim have a strong track record. It's what they do best and there are scores of other candidates which will dazzle with their "innovation". Meanwhile, lovers of music and peerless after sales service know where to go.  And Naim can't seem to build them fast enough. 

Adi Stefan posted:

Richard Dane posted:

The Naim DAC is really rather special - excellent performance aside, if you delve under the bonnet you'll find much of the important stuff (BB PCM1704K chipset, 40bit SHARC DSP, I to V convertors, fully discrete analogue output stage) that is shared with Naim's absolute top end kit.  

Take a look inside - I wish it could come with a glass top because it's rather gorgeous to look at the innards;

Naim DAC info

In fact, the only thing that's not top end here is the price - relatively modest by Naim standards.  That makes it something of a bargain in my book.

Hello, 

Richard what i want to say the dac is behind for what other dac's offers for the same or less money; i don't say it sound bad or broken but it's far behind in the area of technology, and i can give you examples. I don't want to speak about the sound because it's subjective, but maybe NAIM start to think develop new sources, and less marketing for old technology. Thanks.   

It should be obvious that there is a change in streaming technology at Naim! But I wonder if the dac technology used in uniti is different than what is used in  the external DACs. If so that could point to future developments. Using new technology just to use it is not a good idea, but it may make  the marketing easier. Of course if the new technology brings with it better sq or valuable faetures it should be considered.

Claus

Claus-Thoegersen posted:

It should be obvious that there is a change in streaming technology at Naim! But I wonder if the dac technology used in uniti is different than what is used in  the external DACs. If so that could point to future developments. Using new technology just to use it is not a good idea, but it may make  the marketing easier. Of course if the new technology brings with it better sq or valuable faetures it should be considered.

Claus

Claus I have no idea if my Naim Dac uses the same technology as used in any Uniti unit

All I can say is I am very happy indeed with the Dac and it has lifted the CD5XS to a different level entirely

Also as Harry mentioned "lovers of music and peerless after sales service know where to go"  which is another reason why I love my Naim Dac...

As some may know I did own the Hugo for a little while and while I did like how it sounded I found the UI very lacking and annoying and I also found the Hugo only sounded really good on certain cd's while I am finding the Naim Dac more 'even-handed' across more cd's, if that makes sense..

Price wise there was not much difference between the Hugo and my nice pre-owned Naim Dac

Second that the Naim DAC does care a lot about the transport. Against my dealer’s convinced opinion, it sounds better fed from CD5XS than it does from a Zen Vortexbox/LPSU. Subtle difference, but when I got a cheap CD5XS, I’ve started playing CDs a lot more...

The Naim DAC is definitely more than good enough to show up transport differences.  I posted comparisons of various CD players as transports some years back. The differences were quite remarkable really.