Chord Music and Sarum T Hybrid

Why would you ever pick a system component on it's looks first are we now so fashion conscious that aesthetics come before SQ!  And all that SWIMBO stuff is a smokescreen my other half wouldn't out of choice have our system but she indulges my passions and I do hers!

I suppose those so concerned with cable color have the option of using expandable braided cable sleeves (available in numerous colors) to achieve their desired coordination.

Then again, I suppose this merely opens up the argument as to what SQ impacts the braided sleeve will impart on the cable.

Chris Bell posted:

You won't care what it looks like, it's a remarkable cable.  I've used Sarum Tuned Array for several years and have demo'd all of the various incarnations... I thought Music was going to be a minor upgrade, it's in a whole different league.  

Thanks for the feedback.

I have heard the entry level Chord clearway and Sarum Super Aray, and they sound a bit polite to my ears (not the Naim sound)

Something is missing in the attack of the notes - easily audible when compared to a Vertere or Naim cable.

Maybe they finally fixed that issue in ChordMusic. I'm eager to listen to the cable.

What you were missing with Sarum Super Aray was probably the hash and general distortion that you’ll be used to with the cables you currently use. I suspect you may be finding that their inherent edginess and aggression works on some types of Rock music. 

With the 552 in place - and the 52 before it - the far more natural, realistic and rhythmically and dynamically correct Sarum easily demonstrated its superiority over the previous cables I used. 

Given your tastes, you may not get on well with ChordMusic.

It's a complicated one Dave and I'm very open to your thoughts.

I am testing my new Vertere D-FI vs my chord clearway cables and it's actually very difficult to decide which one I like more.

The vertere have a clear advantage in more open, airy, and more realistic timbre - no contest really there. 

I can hear what you talk about "insight" with the chord clearway aray cable - and there is some of the old school lavender Naim sound there - clearly some music with boogie sounds a bit more rhythmic and foot tapping.  The old lavender or chrysalis sounds which pushes the midrange to emphasise rhythmic flow. The separation of instruments of slightly better (hence the insight)

The vertere cables don't (need to) push the midrange, as there is no slight curtailing of the high frequencies, and yet sounds more dynamic, more fast while having very open and airy high frequencies and tremendous realism.

But I can easily see why someone could like Vertere (and Superlumina) more or the Chord cable more.

It could depend on the music, equipment, taste, ears, but for me personally if I had to choose one, it would be a close call, but it would be the Vertere (and Superlumina)

What made my decision was actually watching Craig David live.

With the Vertere cable it sounded the way it should sound (live/energetic) whereas the Chord cable sounded different - a different view of the same performance - but some of the live music aspect wasn't quite there to me. Still very good though.

That's why sometimes when you go on about how the chord cables are so much better than the Superlumina - I just cannot hear these "one cable superior to the other", and please don't tell me about 552, because I've heard them on 552 also, the same differences are there.

The other rather troubling issue is that my TV decoder with a Vertere RCA/DIN sounds better than a Chord Mojo with a Chord clearway 3.5m to DIN cable. More open, more dynamic, and I don't doubt anyone in any kind of blind test would pick the Vertere cable.

But both are very good, they just do it differently. 

Hungryhalibut posted:

I’m sure the Music cables sound great, but they are hardly discreet. At least the SL is a boring brown, and much less visually intrusive. 

So now it’s the wrong colour and Naims is of course better there...what’s next...

Maybe I’m just missing the irony?

//Jonas

I see there’s an interesting review of Sarum T speaker cables in the November issue of Hi-Fi World. You can access it via the reviews on the Chord site.

buyers beware - only the chord music speaker cables are tuned aray and NOT the sarum t speaker cables.

per chord website.

ChordMusic speaker cable isn’t just the first to use Taylon® insulation, it’s also the first speaker cable to feature the adapted Tuned ARAY conductor configuration.  The resulting high degree of clarity and transparency makes it possible to hear extra coherence and detail.

No mention of capacitance or inductance on Sarum T speaker cable specifications either.

It seems easier to just buy Superlumina speaker cable to me.

I mean the engineers who design the kit, who know how it works, and who built the legendary Nait 2 (Roy George) and Naim Statement (Steve Sells) are the ones who designed and signed off on Superlumina speaker cable.

I have not compared Chord Sarum/ Music against Superlumina.  I imagine that each system in their settings may sound better with one than the other.  Only one way to find out really.  I do think it's a lazy argument from analogmusic to say simply to buy SL because Naim knows best.  Several Naim dealers offer both and I presume they have the technical nous to ascertain if there are any compatibility problems before doing so.  Not so long ago we were being advised on the forum that NACA5 was the only way to go - at the same time Chord and others (whose entire business is built around cables) were offering alternatives.

I am not suggesting one is better than the other, merely that it is lazy and ill informed to trot out the blind faith argument. Then again I suppose this is not an unusual place for a thread of this nature to end up!!

Peter

oh well ho hum

I think it's quite naive, risky and expensive to think that cable companies can out-do or outsmart Naim's own engineers.

Maybe some cables can like ChordMusic, but it's an eye watering 3800 GBP/meter.

I'm absolutely convinced about Superlumina and I reached my conclusion after comparing Superlumina cables over and over again with Chord Sarum.

Maybe some people like that Chord Sarum sound, but I bought Naim for a reason, and Superlumina is the Naim sound.

For what it's worth, I already had the full loom SL in place, when my friendly dealer offered me a "no advance opinion from me" home trial of the Chord Music din / din interconnect to try with my NDS.

As I reported at the time, I felt that some of the so called hi-fi artefacts were possibly better with the Chord offering, but that the music had more drive and passion with the SL.

When I returned the cable, it turned out that they were of much the same opinion.

My room acoustics, set up and ageing ears, but I do tend to agree with ANALOGMUSIC, that, at least in a full Naim system, Naim cables are probably the best bet.

analogmusic posted:

oh well ho hum

I think it's quite naive, risky and expensive to think that cable companies can out-do or outsmart Naim's own engineers.

Maybe some cables can like ChordMusic, but it's an eye watering 3800 GBP/meter.

I'm absolutely convinced about Superlumina and I reached my conclusion after comparing Superlumina cables over and over again with Chord Sarum.

Maybe some people like that Chord Sarum sound, but I bought Naim for a reason, and Superlumina is the Naim sound.

I'm a tad confused.  I did not state that Naim's engineers have been out-done or outsmarted, nor that any cable sounded better than SL.  I would need to have carried out back to back comparisons to form an opinion.  However, going back in time a bit (several years ago) I do recall that for my system, NACA5 did not work well in my room and its non Naim replacement was a salvation.  Of course that has no bearing on SL which was not available at the time.

You seem to indicate that ChordMusic outperforms SL?  Again, I haven't compared them so am unable to comment.  But your statement appears to indicate a preference for the non-Naim cable, cost being the only qualification.  Perhaps you believe that Chord have nailed the Naim sound with ChordMusic?

Having made the case of sorts for both SL and ChordMusic, your profile indicates that you use neither, which is where I am a bit lost.

Peter

I have not heard Chord music, but a friend whose ears I trust did. He did like it.

Maybe it outperforms SL, maybe not, can't say until I hear it for myself.

No, I do not indicate any preference for a non-naim cable at all. I try alternative cables sometimes, but always keep coming  back to Naim ones.

To be clear to my ears, Naim cables (the standard interconnect, Hi-Line, NACA5 and SL) sound the best to me for that rhythmic Naim sound compared to all the other alternatives I have tried..... 

analogmusic posted:

I have not heard Chord music, but a friend whose ears I trust did. He did like it.

Maybe it outperforms SL, maybe not, can't say until I hear it for myself.

No, I do not indicate any preference for a non-naim cable at all.

To be clear to my ears, Naim cables (the standard interconnect, Hi-Line, NACA5 and SL) sound the best to me for that rhythmic Naim sound compared to all the other alternatives I have tried..... 

 

 

analogmusic posted:

I have not heard Chord music, but a friend whose ears I trust did. He did like it.

Maybe it outperforms SL, maybe not, can't say until I hear it for myself.

No, I do not indicate any preference for a non-naim cable at all. I try alternative cables sometimes, but always keep coming  back to Naim ones.

To be clear to my ears, Naim cables (the standard interconnect, Hi-Line, NACA5 and SL) sound the best to me for that rhythmic Naim sound compared to all the other alternatives I have tried..... 

 

 

So why are you using Vertere? We know that you’ve repeatedly suggested it’s virtually SL but how could Vertere possibly out-do or outsmart Naim’s own engineers?

well it is much closer to the Naim sound than the Chord cables I bought and now lying unused in my drawer   

analogmusic posted:

 well it is much closer to the Naim sound

AM, since you so often refer to 'the Naim sound' here can you describe exactly what that means to you? Possibly in terms beyond preservation of PRaT.

there is a certain sound which I can hear clearly on Superlumina, Hi Line and Standard interconnect.

Rhythms are very clear to hear, with a "leading edge"  and tremendous grip on the notes.

I can't hear this Rhythmic emphasis on Chord cables or even Vertere ones (but vertere is very much closer to the Naim sound). Vertere has a different sound, which I suppose is much closer to "live music".

Bass is also one very important area which I can hear Naim pays attention to in their cables. It just sounds "right" to me.

You’re saying that you can’t hear the rhythmic emphasis on Vertere cables, yet at the same time they are closer to the live sound. That makes no sense to me. 

it won't till you hear it for yourself HH. There is no extra leading edge emphasis on a vertere cable.

Their design philosophy is not to change the sound in any way. the best cables don't change the sound, they just get out of the way, which I can hear vertere doing very well.

This is a decription of the old Chord Chrysalis which I found, (I have one and agree with that description)

"The design of Chrysalis cable produces a slight attenuation of treble and a slight roll-off of low bass. This causes the mid-range to be pushed forward and this emphasises the rhythm and coherence of music. "

Now this Chord Chrysalis is not a neutral cable, and that is exactly where Vertere sound more live, realistic, and faster also at the same time.

Analog, is that referring to the original Chrysalis or late batch?  The late Chrysalis is much closer to Naim's own interconnect.

analogmusic posted:

it won't till you hear it for yourself HH. There is no extra leading edge emphasis on a vertere cable.

Their design philosophy is not to change the sound in any way. the best cables don't change the sound, they just get out of the way, which I can hear vertere doing very well.

Ah, but how can you hear what isn’t there?

erm not sure Richard, it's the one I use, which I think is the later one. Apologies for the mistake.