552 vs other brand preamps

Chrissw19 posted:

Well, too early to say. I’ve just set it up quickly and left it with bbc radio on ... the cables are very affordable (20£ rca-rca and a set of flashback rca to xlr) and haven’t been dressed properly ... should be able to start forming an opinion on Saturday ...

I will follow your feedback with interest as well. It’s a bit too bad that you haven’t had F1 or even DCT I/Cs made for you to exploit all the Allegri+ resolution and transparency. ????

Chag -

Well, so far it is really impressive. Not sure how or why that little box is able to do that but the music sounds really good. 

My interest in this is.....buying a preamp with 8 inputs when I probably only need the one from my digital streamer or Core seems a total waste of money. It would be nice for the next set of Naim preamps to have customer options on how many inputs.....or just accept that there is a set of customers that need just a straight through signal to power amp. Times change...a Naim need to move with the times or lose customers

What would be really nice is for the new series streamers to have an analogue volume control included...

Yes, but you know what I mean. 

There is a quite intresting read in fish forum comparing 552/300 with couple of highend integrated amps vitus / Luxman etc

he concludes that a 10£ k vitus integrated beats 27k£ naim pre/power

i don’t remember which vitus

it is a depressing read after ordering a 552!

There is a certain Vitus dealer doing a roaring trade converting 500 series users to Vitus. He has no end of traded in 500 series boxes for sale.

552 will be my end game pre Maybe add a nap500 in coming years and that’s it, I am not a statement guy never will be 

Gazza posted:

My interest in this is.....buying a preamp with 8 inputs when I probably only need the one from my digital streamer or Core seems a total waste of money. It would be nice for the next set of Naim preamps to have customer options on how many inputs.....or just accept that there is a set of customers that need just a straight through signal to power amp. Times change...a Naim need to move with the times or lose customers

totally agree. My ear 912 is a full pre with phono , all useful and wonderful one box. For the same amount of money and not better sound with my nap 300dr, the nac 252 has 8 inputs , no phono, and 4 imputs that i was not using.

Alba1320 posted:

Gazza posted:

My interest in this is.....buying a preamp with 8 inputs when I probably only need the one from my digital streamer or Core seems a total waste of money. It would be nice for the next set of Naim preamps to have customer options on how many inputs.....or just accept that there is a set of customers that need just a straight through signal to power amp. Times change...a Naim need to move with the times or lose customers

I'm not sure that would be practical (or even possible?), let alone make much/any difference to the price of the product, so what real benefit would there be to you in having fewer inputs?

more imputs have a cost...

Emre posted:

There is a quite intresting read in fish forum comparing 552/300 with couple of highend integrated amps vitus / Luxman etc

he concludes that a 10£ k vitus integrated beats 27k£ naim pre/power

i don’t remember which vitus

it is a depressing read after ordering a 552!

lotus hifi thread that i read too. The person had 552/500 before, preferred the vitus integrated, but admitted that naim combo had more prat and bass.  The soundstage was better on the vitus.

Alba1320 posted:

Emre posted:

There is a quite intresting read in fish forum comparing 552/300 with couple of highend integrated amps vitus / Luxman etc

he concludes that a 10£ k vitus integrated beats 27k£ naim pre/power

i don’t remember which vitus

it is a depressing read after ordering a 552!

Why? It's one person's opinion, not an incontrovertible fact; all that matters to you is what you think about it.

Because, would you not agree if you could purchase something for half the price you was intending too spend that potentially you may prefer, then its worth a listen. 

I am biased i own a Vitus. I wonder how many other pre amps or integrated's Emre demo'd before ordering the 552.

None although it is a big investment for me, don’t have the time don’t have the will

it is little bit like a naim fan boy habit, it has been 2 dacades with the brand... also with my dealer/ friend...

have the frame ,cables, naim power amp, din interconnects, have to sell the lot and listen other brands etc.... 

i just shell the money knowing buying a great kit that will serve me years

maybe knowing it might not be the best value for money option

I Am only depressed for the bill nothing else... 

Honestly it’s easy on an Internet forum to say an integrated beats a 552 but I for one would be very surprised.

But then there are some integrated out there at very silly prices - from the US for example and these make the 552 look like beer money. That’s if you’re daft enough to invest in a 60K integrated of course.....

Hi FR,

I know of someone who went from the 552 to the 912, but he was using EAR509s. I went from a Modwright pre to the 868, but I use an EAR534. I suspect that there are levels of synergy here. IF you will be sticking with the 300 then I suspect/expect the 552 will have a built in advantage.

The 912 is my dream pre-amp, but as I mainly stream I am not convinced i would be a worthwhile step.

M

Mr Underhill posted:

Hi FR,

I know of someone who went from the 552 to the 912, but he was using EAR509s. I went from a Modwright pre to the 868, but I use an EAR534. I suspect that there are levels of synergy here. IF you will be sticking with the 300 then I suspect/expect the 552 will have a built in advantage.

The 912 is my dream pre-amp, but as I mainly stream I am not convinced i would be a worthwhile step.

M

The synergy is also, perhaps, a personal point of view, or feeling.  I had before the 252/supercap and tried the ear 912 with the same amp(nap 250) at a dealer place.  I may be perhaps the first one to have tried this. I was searching a preamp with built in phono to pair with the nap 250.  I wanted tube pre because , for me, the all naim sound is sometimes a little hard and edgy.  

I tried also cat sl1 renaissance preamp, but found the sound a bit soft , but very nice. The other preamp with very good phono is the vac signature, but no dealer in France.

At the dealer place, the ear 912 and nap 250/2 worked perfectly: dead quite, no tube rush , no hum.  More fluency and openness, nicer sound vs the nac 252 i had at home. The ear 912 is perhaps the most dynamic tube pre, in this price category....So i sold the nac 252 and bought the ear.

The 552 is in a different league and very probably better than the ear 912 on most areas. But no phono .

Like you i mostly stream, but want to keep the magic of the turntable sound on some occasions.   I will take a less ambitious turntable than my sme20/ 2a in the next future, because listening rarely lps...so my sme turntable is now on the bay market.....

How sound the ear 868 with ear amps, is it dynamic, with good prat and involvement like with naim combo?        I feel the sound must be very nice, fluent and open, natural, but perhaps lacking the prat and dynamics of naim gear.  The dealer who bought me the ear 912 have not the ear amps on demo.   I am listening mostly to modern jazz and need to have great dynamics, sense of urgency and prat.

Ravenswood10 posted:

But then there are some integrated out there at very silly prices - from the US for example and these make the 552 look like beer money. That’s if you’re daft enough to invest in a 60K integrated of course.....

Would  “daft enough” apply if said integrated sounds better than, say, Statement pre and power amps?

Mr Underhill posted:

The synergy is also, perhaps, a personal point of view, or feeling.
This could quickly become VERY philosophical.

 I had before the 252/supercap and tried the ear 912 with the same amp(nap 250) at a dealer place.  I may be perhaps the first one to have tried this. I was searching a preamp with built in phono to pair with the nap 250.  I wanted tube pre because , for me, the all naim sound is sometimes a little hard and edgy.  
Over the years I have used my NAP250s with a few non-Naim pre-amps. It has always worked, whether it has given the 'best' performance is back to 'a personal view'.

At the dealer place, the ear 912 and nap 250/2 worked perfectly: dead quite, no tube rush , no hum.  More fluency and openness, nicer sound vs the nac 252 i had at home. The ear 912 is perhaps the most dynamic tube pre, in this price category....So i sold the nac 252 and bought the ear.
I would always expect the 912 to outperform a 252 as I think of them as in different classes. I am sure many here will bridal at that statement.

The 552 is in a different league and very probably better than the ear 912 on most areas. But no phono .
I wouldn't agree with this as I know at least one person who preferred the EAR.

Like you i mostly stream, but want to keep the magic of the turntable sound on some occasions.   I will take a less ambitious turntable than my sme20/ 2a in the next future, because listening rarely lps...so my sme turntable is now on the bay market.....
I am going through this internal debate at the moment. My streaming solution currently normally outperforms my vinyl (LP12/ARO/Dyn/Geddon). There are albums where I would pick the turntable. I know I can get better performance from the TT by, for instance, Tangerining it - but the cost is making me hesitate.

How sound the ear 868 with ear amps, is it dynamic, with good prat and involvement like with naim combo?        I feel the sound must be very nice, fluent and open, natural, but perhaps lacking the prat and dynamics of naim gear.  The dealer who bought me the ear 912 have not the ear amps on demo.   I am listening mostly to modern jazz and need to have great dynamics, sense of urgency and prat.
The 868/534 is superb: dynamic with good PRAT - viceral is the word that I generally use. The amps keep improving as I step up the front end and the speakers. I started down the EAR route in the early 1990s and felt that they pummeled my CB 32.5/Hicap/250.

It is interesting to listen to friends systems and compare and contrast, whether that be a full 500 rig or a Garrard 401/YBA/JBL, they each have strengths and major on aspects my system doesn't; the joy is that it gives a slightly different view & insight on the same music.

thanks Mr Underhill for this argumented response. Do you think that ear 912/ ear 890 can be a good combo with rock music or jazz?  when you say «  visceral « , does it mean grip, urgency and music with consistence and body ?

I just fear that the ear 890 will soften a bit the sound, vs my nap300...

Hi FR,

Can a 912/890 be a good combo with Rock & Jazz = absolutely. How would it sound compared to a 552/300 Naim rig? I don't think anyone can answer that but you in your room with your music. I think that Naim has a sound signature with each of its generations. I personally would rank them Classic > CB > Olive, others will disagree. That said one of the best systems I have heard is an Olive system .....with the right Rock music. If I had the choice if I was listening to Led Zepp on vinyl that would be what I would want to listen to it through.

I don't think any system does everything with every genre better than anything else. I was listening to the LP War of the Worlds via a Garrard 401, YBA amp and old JBLs a couple of weeks ago, it was superb .....but, it was missing detail and top end, but that didn't lesson the sheer bass underpinning and exuberance.

It is a shame you are not in the UK, if you were close enough I would lug over my 534 and hopefully we might be able to get a 552 at the same time for you to listen to. Mike who went with the 912 told me it wasn't a night and day simple choice, but he and his wife ended up preferring what they heard from the 912 in combination with the 509s - in his context.

Visceral for me means the music is alive, something I associate with well done Class A.

M

Emre posted:

There is a quite intresting read in fish forum comparing 552/300 with couple of highend integrated amps vitus / Luxman etc

he concludes that a 10£ k vitus integrated beats 27k£ naim pre/power

i don’t remember which vitus

it is a depressing read after ordering a 552!

I've just spent a weekend with a very recent Vitus integrated (RI-100) and CD player (RCD-101) to see how it compared to my CDS3/555/252/300.

In the end I decided that either my Allaes couldn't show the difference, or I have become too accustomed to the Naim sound, or that my ears aren't up to the task - I'm sticking with my Naim. I'll be spending the c.£3k it would have cost me to 'upgrade' on servicing & DRing my 555 and Supercap.

300 already done?

Gavin B posted:

Emre posted:

There is a quite intresting read in fish forum comparing 552/300 with couple of highend integrated amps vitus / Luxman etc

he concludes that a 10£ k vitus integrated beats 27k£ naim pre/power

i don’t remember which vitus

it is a depressing read after ordering a 552!

I've just spent a weekend with a very recent Vitus integrated (RI-100) and CD player (RCD-101) to see how it compared to my CDS3/555/252/300.

In the end I decided that either my Allaes couldn't show the difference, or I have become too accustomed to the Naim sound, or that my ears aren't up to the task - I'm sticking with my Naim. I'll be spending the c.£3k it would have cost me to 'upgrade' on servicing & DRing my 555 and Supercap.

maybe the allaes got such a strong naim sound of their own?

yeti42 posted:

300 already done?

No, but it's only 4 or so years old - I'll wait until it needs servicing. The 555/Supercap need servicing now so that's where my limited funds will go.