Speakers at Bristol Show

What about some  speakers information from bristol 2018.

Shropshire Hills posted:

Halloween Man posted:

It's so important to demo speakers at home as they will sound completely different to what you hear at a show. Your shortlist of ATC SCM 11, Dynaudio Special 40, and PMC 25/23 is a good one. I would also add SCM19, SCM40, SCM19A, and SCM40A if budget and room allows.

I own SCM40A and consider them a masterpiece  

Thanks Halloween

I will certainly add the SCM19 and 19A to the list. The 40’s will definitely be too powerful for my small dedicated listening room. The 19A looks a good choice and the saving by omitting the power amp makes them very competitive. Do you have a pre-amp or use your Hugo for this purpose? Is there a good ATC dealer in the Midlands you can recommend?

Out of interest, a few years ago I spent many happy hours listening to a fine pair of ATC SCM40s in the company of a couple of ex-pats who live on the edge of a small village at 2000’ on the west side of La Palma, a small island in the Canaries. Rob, the owner, could not find any Spanish dealer who could supply the speakers. ATC came to the rescue and shipped a pair direct to him at what he told me was a very decent price 

Bob

Hi Bob, yes, when you consider separate power amps are already inside the active speakers they are very good vfm. I have no need for preamp as I only have a single digital source (Macbook). If this is also your situation then I would strongly recommend a DAC with preamp and remote such as Hugo TT, Naim 272 (this also is a steamer), Naim V1, Benchmark DAC 3, etc.

Great story about your friends, sounds like good times. ATC customer service is as good as I've experienced. Very nice people.

I've used Castle Hifi in Nottingham before and had no problems. Fidelity Sound and Vision in Doncaster currently have a mint pair of SCM19A in stock that might be worth an audition.

I moved into a tiny listening space of 3x3.5 metres and my ProAc D15's simply did not do at all.

Because of my remote location (Orgiva in the Alpujarras) away from any normal hifi demonstration facility, I selected replacements based largely on advice from my local shipment agent plus Googling reviews and bought a pair of ATC SCM19's.

My gob has never been so severely smacked. Buy with confidence fellah. 

My setup:

Shuko wall plug/Graham's Hydra/Isoblue racks/ND5XS/XP5XS/NAC282/'Theodorehat'/NAPSC/NAP250/Chord Epic/ATC SCM19/Quadraspire stands...

Chord Chameleon+ and two standard NAIM interconnects. The NAIM soon to be replaced with Chord Clearway cables.

Hi Halloween - thanks for the info on the ATC SCM 19A. The cost is good, especially ex- dem but they are quite large and maybe too much for my small room. Certainly I will try and have a demo of them as well as the SCM 11.

Mike thanks for the info on the SCM 19. I had thought that they would be too big for my small room but your experience gives me the confidence to have a listen to them as well

Bob

That is a good observation... the 19s are large and need a fair amount of space to sound their best ... you might find 11s tighter in a smaller room.

Hi Bob, I'm not 100% but I think the footprint of SCM19 and SCM19A are identical. Certainly at the dealers you will be able to compare both for sound quality and size. You will need to try in your room at home to know for sure.

I went to Bristol specifically to hear the Dynaudio S40's.  I've already had them on home dem and know I like them but Dynaudio always put on a good show and NDS/252/300 didn't disappoint. That's a £2.5k pair of speakers on a > £15k system and they were in no way outclassed.  My buying decision was strongly reinforced.

Otherwise I didn't go to listen to speakers specifically but other systems I heard and enjoyed were

Primare/JBL.  This was a bit of a surprise, a very natural unforced presentation. The JBL's aren't the prettiest speakers though. 

Naim/Proac. Tablette 10's with a CDX5XS & Nait 5si I think. Foot tappingly good. 

Leema/ATC. SCM 50's (?) with Tucana Anniversary & Sirius streamer.

Systems I heard and didn't much care for

ATC - ATC were playing an all ATC system.  It was bit like the recording was under a microscope, easy to inspect and analyse but there's not much enjoyment in looking down a microscope.

Nova/Focal.  When I went in there was a piano piece on.  Another couple already there obviously weren't impressed and asked for another piano piece.  Some Keith Jarrett was served up, it wasn't a great improvement and I left.

Totem.  Don't remember what the system was but it didn't do it for me.

I didn't listen to PMC or (sadly based on reports here) Nova/Kudos.

Olly

nigelb posted:

I heard the Dynaudio Special 40s and they sounded very good indeed, but with a full-blown Classic Naim rig behind them.

The Kudos 505s were even better and so they should be and I realise these are out of your price range. I mention it though because they were being driven by a 'bare' Nova and this combo was rather special IMHO. Here's an off the wall idea. If you sold your 250DR, would you be able to afford the 505s? Bonkers I know but bare Nova/505 combo is superb to these ears. This also goes against the grain of the 'source first' mantra which I have always leant towards. I guess however there are exceptions to the rule.

Nigel 

The 505s are unfortunately too far above my price limit but I will be listening to an ex-dem pair of their lesser cousins, the Kudos Super 10As, in the next few days and have high hopes that they may be the one for me. If not its a second listen to and hopefully home dems of ATC 11/19 and Dynaudio Special 40s

Bob

Shropshire Hills posted:

nigelb posted:

I heard the Dynaudio Special 40s and they sounded very good indeed, but with a full-blown Classic Naim rig behind them.

The Kudos 505s were even better and so they should be and I realise these are out of your price range. I mention it though because they were being driven by a 'bare' Nova and this combo was rather special IMHO. Here's an off the wall idea. If you sold your 250DR, would you be able to afford the 505s? Bonkers I know but bare Nova/505 combo is superb to these ears. This also goes against the grain of the 'source first' mantra which I have always leant towards. I guess however there are exceptions to the rule.

Nigel 

The 505s are unfortunately too far above my price limit but I will be listening to an ex-dem pair of their lesser cousins, the Kudos Super 10As, in the next few days and have high hopes that they may be the one for me. If not its a second listen to and hopefully home dems of ATC 11/19 and Dynaudio Special 40s

Bob

Bob, that sounds like a very capable shortlist of speakers. Personally I have only heard the Dyn Special 40s and was very impressed.

Yes, I was getting a bit carried away with the Kudos 505s, but I was simply stunned how these sounded in a crappy hotel room being driven 'only' by a  bare Nova. That at least goes to show how capable the Nova is.

I am pretty sure you will find a match made in heaven between your speaker shortlist and your Nova/250DR.

Enjoy.

As Nigel says Bob a good shortlist.  Just my view but I would throw Neat into the mix as well.   

Regards,

Lindsay

The ATC SCM 11 is a superb speaker. I adore mine. Some people don't love it immediately because it's so neutral; it just presents you the music, any music, with an even hand. If you're used to warmer coloration that neutrality can be off-putting at first. Also, because of its closed design and unique woofer, it makes many other speakers sound sound slow and lugubrious.

I haven't heard that PMC, but in general I like them a lot. I would have it on my short-list too.

I've had Dynaudios before and liked them, BUT . . . you must hear them in your room. I've banged on about this before, but it'a still true. Rear ported speakers are very dependent on the room. They sound great at the dealer with flexible positioning, but that may not be practical at home. The closed box ATCs and front-ported TL PMCs will be somewhat less demanding of the space they're in.

Thanks chaps for further advice and suggestions. Solid Air I was aware that the ATC SCM 11s are a sealed box and that should be a plus point in my small room - the others all have rear ports and I need to listen to them at home before making a decision. My current n-Sats are also sealed boxes - they are now boxed up and awaiting collection by DPD 

The n-Sats duly went to a new owner last week  - they still look immaculate after 9 years of ownership but it was time for a change.

I was preparing for a round of speaker demos in store and later at home. However, I decided to first try a pair of ex-dem Kudos Super 10As and they arrived today on a 30 day trial. After 30 minutes of playing music through them I think I have found my next pair of speakers. I will spend a few more days listening to them and adjusting the positioning but the improvement over the n-Sats and the Iotas is so great I don’t think I can be bothered to look elsewhere.

The cherry veneer would not have been my first choice but it has grown on me and the speakers are beautifully made. It will be a serious listening weekend and next step is to order some suitable stands

 o 

The Super 10As are internally wire for active operation with Linn, Devialet and Naim although I don’t think I will be tempted to get a second 250DR at this stage. 

Handsome looking speakers. Kudos seem to do no wrong. It'll be interesting to see how much the 505 improves on the 10A given the near doubling in price.

Enjoy your demo

Shropshire Hills posted:

The n-Sats duly went to a new owner last week  - they still look immaculate after 9 years of ownership but it was time for a change.

I was preparing for a round of speaker demos in store and later at home. However, I decided to first try a pair of ex-dem Kudos Super 10As and they arrived today on a 30 day trial. After 30 minutes of playing music through them I think I have found my next pair of speakers. I will spend a few more days listening to them and adjusting the positioning but the improvement over the n-Sats and the Iotas is so great I don’t think I can be bothered to look elsewhere.

The cherry veneer would not have been my first choice but it has grown on me and the speakers are beautifully made. It will be a serious listening weekend and next step is to order some suitable stands

 o 

This might sound bonkers but I will suggest it anyway.

I notice you have a Nova with a 250DR and you like the Kudos sound which got me thinking. I heard a bare Nova driving the new Kudos Titan 505s (standmounts) in the unhelpful surroundings of a hotel room at the Bristol show last month and I was simply blown away with the music-making abilities of this very simple system. If the 505s are out of your price range then no reason to read further. If not, I would strongly urge you to have a listen to these although they are not on general relaease quite yet. You also have a separate 250DR which should improve things further.

Some might say that a Nova with 505s is an extreme mullet and plain daft. All I would say is have a listen before you make such a judgement. I could barely tear myself away from the Kudos room at the show, and that tells me all I need to know.

nigelb posted:

Some might say that a Nova with 505s is an extreme mullet and plain daft. All I would say is have a listen before you make such a judgement. I could barely tear myself away from the Kudos room at the show, and that tells me all I need to know.

It sounds like it's a very capable combination that happens to work very well together and makes fine music.

That's not daft in my book 

Solid Air posted:

 The closed box ATCs and front-ported TL PMCs will be somewhat less demanding of the space they're in.

Remember the PMC's are not strictly 'ported' as they are a transmission line system. As such they are not so picky about placement.

james n posted:

nigelb posted:

Some might say that a Nova with 505s is an extreme mullet and plain daft. All I would say is have a listen before you make such a judgement. I could barely tear myself away from the Kudos room at the show, and that tells me all I need to know.

It sounds like it's a very capable combination that happens to work very well together and makes fine music.

That's not daft in my book 

The 505s look fabulous and I like the fact they can be Active. Could they be used close to a rear wall ? 

NEAT Iota Explorers were sounding really good in a pretty straightforward system.

The Totem Sky Towers are superb - heard them twice now in different rooms and systems.  At Bristol they sounded terrible with the Rega RP3 but superb with the BlueSound Node and Rega DAC.  I think there was something wrong with the RP3.

Both Kudos rooms were sounding good too, but a bit pricey.

I rather liked the ELAC Adantes too.

pete T15 posted:

james n posted:

nigelb posted:

Some might say that a Nova with 505s is an extreme mullet and plain daft. All I would say is have a listen before you make such a judgement. I could barely tear myself away from the Kudos room at the show, and that tells me all I need to know.

It sounds like it's a very capable combination that happens to work very well together and makes fine music.

That's not daft in my book 

The 505s look fabulous and I like the fact they can be Active. Could they be used close to a rear wall ? 

I asked Derek, the owner of Kudos, that very question. He explained that the port arrangement (forward facing with clever channeling in the base to extend its length) means the 505s can be used a little closer to walls than is the norm but, as always, other factors in the room will affect how close they will go before SQ is affected. If you are interested the usual advice applies - a lengthy home demo is a must.

Boy, they sounded great though, even in a grotty hotel room with ‘modest’ source/amplification.

I can only imagine how good the 505s must sound as the super C10As sound brilliant even though they are sat on the floor until my stands arrive. I have resorted to slouching on the floor with my head resting on the sofa in order to get my ears in the correct listening position! Not recommended for purists but needs must

Very relevant thread to me. Collected my new Super 10As on Thursday in beautiful natural oak. Sublime speakers in my system. The active options are very interesting but it's another three boxes and just where they might go I have no idea.

Hi Cyclo

Natual Oak would have been my first choice but my ex/dem C10A’s are cherry and, to my surprise, it’s a lovely veneer - the quality of the cabinets seems to be very good

Active would be fun but it would probably be cheaper to upgrade to 300 passive - less boxes  and perhaps better sound than buying Snaxo, Hicap and a second 250DR. However I wouldn’t mind having a demo of the active option sometime

 o 

Yes Bob, only one more box instead of three. I really would like to hear both options though. Not sure how many retailers would have that very specialist snaxo hanging around.

I was expecting some running in harshness with the new speakers but they are sounding great right out of the box. In theory yours might not be singing along at their best yet. Dealerships don't always clock up too many hours on dem speakers. I am on Partington Dreadnought Broadsides btw.

Mike