Supernait2 ProAc Tab 10

Did you try another source before swapping amp and speaker? I can imagine that Hugo has a high resolution signature and that in combination wit a class A amp could be too cold... imho...

T38.45 posted:

Did you try another source before swapping amp and speaker? I can imagine that Hugo has a high resolution signature and that in combination wit a class A amp could be too cold... imho...

 

Hey. Anything I have tried hasn't satisfied me like the Chord. I include some Naim stuff like the V1. Perhaps I should try a nDAC or CD. 

Any recommendations? 

Just for fun: borrow a Naim CDx2 ( or a LP12 but that is another story) It should tells you without complicated setup if you have a source problem (not saying your source is bad, but the constellation of source,amp and speaker could be too much sound signature in one direction)

The Studio100 and the SM100 replacements are ProAc's thoroughbreds.

If you only want one box then the SN2 is a fantastic amp but if you don’t mind multiple boxes then 282/250 is better. I cant see anything wrong with your front end looks fine too me. 

I’m a Dynaudio fan so can’t help with your speakers. I did have some Royd Eden’s last year and they were as fast as lightning but and I’ve found this with other very fast speakers they were a bit light in the bass. 

A friend of mine has ProAc Studio 140's, driven by a Cambridge amp. Sounds very nice to my ears. I cannot imagine that a Supernait can't drive the ProAcs. Always wanted to bring my Supernait to his place and see what happens when these two are combined. No time to do unfortunately.

Don't forget that you need a PS for the 282, either hicap or supercap.

ThatsNotMyNaim posted:

Well I left Naim amplification. Now I'm coming back. I miss the fluidity.

I have a Sugden A21 currently for 12 months. Positive characteristics: Big, wide soundstage, clean sound, fast transients, quite bouncey, musical. Very enjoyable generally. I demoed A21SE but didn't hear much of a contrast?

Negative characteristics; Slight glare, slight taming of the music. Shallow bass, lacks deep kick.

I have Supernait 2 on my radar. Now considering other options before I commit. Naimely Supernait 2 or used 282 / 250.

Also what do people think of;

Devialet, Ayre, A21SE, Lavardin IT/IS, 

I didn't get on with Leema, Burmester, Plinius, Sonneteer, and no valves. Sound vague to me whenever I've listened.

 

Secondly I've struggled to replace my ProAc Studio 118s with anything else. Fast, wide open, natural sound and quite fun & punchy - a bit like a studio monitor should sound funnily. However on demoing ProAc D2 they do hold a bit back in openess.

Didn't like D2, DB3 or any PMC (Not sure why but I find PMC restricted sounding versus the wide open ProAc mids. Russell K and a few others also tested but not my bag. Not into lazy music so they have to be fast. I find paper cones generally sound better? Dynaudio Special 40 sounded pants (To these ears). Just not enough swing or groove. 

Anyone have any thoughts on 118s or other ProAcs versus the new ProAc Tab 10s or Tab 10 Sigs?

My other curiosity is the Graham LS5/9 :-) Failing these I'm getting some SM100s. Revealing but spectacular midrange.

Cheers

A

 

System: Innuos Zenith (Powerline), Hugo2 (Di-Fi Double USB), Sugden A21 (Powerline and Shawline RCA), ProAc 118 (Epic/Sig links) on custom made stands. 

Feel like Shawline might be a weak link. Literally! 

 

 

 

A 282/250.2/hc will have a fuller sound than SN2 and might be a better choice for tab 10 which is great little speaker.

No idea of source Quality but such setup will reveal and deserve the very best source

Above amp is lightyears from A21 which allready is a mighty fine amp (in the right setup), PRaT may not be its first abilities though, I can't help but wonder if there are issues in OP setup, may be a good idea getting source and other fundamental details sorted before paying lots for new amp or risking another leave from Naim amplication.

ThatsNotMyNaim posted:

Well I left Naim amplification. Now I'm coming back. I miss the fluidity.

I have a Sugden A21 currently for 12 months. Positive characteristics: Big, wide soundstage, clean sound, fast transients, quite bouncey, musical. Very enjoyable generally. I demoed A21SE but didn't hear much of a contrast?

Negative characteristics; Slight glare, slight taming of the music. Shallow bass, lacks deep kick.

I have Supernait 2 on my radar. Now considering other options before I commit. Naimely Supernait 2 or used 282 / 250.

Also what do people think of;

Devialet, Ayre, A21SE, Lavardin IT/IS, 

I didn't get on with Leema, Burmester, Plinius, Sonneteer, and no valves. Sound vague to me whenever I've listened.

Secondly I've struggled to replace my ProAc Studio 118s with anything else. Fast, wide open, natural sound and quite fun & punchy - a bit like a studio monitor should sound funnily. However on demoing ProAc D2 they do hold a bit back in openess.

Didn't like D2, DB3 or any PMC (Not sure why but I find PMC restricted sounding versus the wide open ProAc mids. Russell K and a few others also tested but not my bag. Not into lazy music so they have to be fast. I find paper cones generally sound better? Dynaudio Special 40 sounded pants (To these ears). Just not enough swing or groove. 

Anyone have any thoughts on 118s or other ProAcs versus the new ProAc Tab 10s or Tab 10 Sigs?

My other curiosity is the Graham LS5/9 :-) Failing these I'm getting some SM100s. Revealing but spectacular midrange.

Cheers

A

From your post, I don't think you will like the Graham LS5/9 as there are reports that it sounds quite similar to the Harbeth Super HL5 Plus. I've owned the PMC LB1 Signature and listened to the EB1i many years ago. The PMC's house sound is different from the Proac as the sound is fuller and warmer whereas the Proacs have a lightness to the presentation with an expansive and detailed sound. Generally the PMCs will sound less expansive than the airier and light presentation of the Proacs. I think the Dynaudio house sound is closer to the PMC than the Proac. 

I suspect it would be a three-way contest in your case, your current Proac Studio 118 vs. the Tablette 10 and Studio SM100 as the house sound should be quite similar among the three speakers. If you have tried the Tablette 10 and SM100s, I would appreciate your thoughts on the comparison with your Studio 118. 

Thanks for the comments all.

Ryder you've articulated well what I hear between PMC and ProAc. I love to be immersed in the sound. PMC that i have listened to such as the 25 range don't tend to have that effect. ProAc being as you say, open and airier. Wide and expansive, but I notice the 'lightness' you mention too. Perhaps a teeny weeny bit 'thinner'. Oh for the unicorn! I like full notes but you can't have it all.

I'll report back on Tabs. FYI SM100 vs Studio 118 already done. The SM100s are startling in the midrange but really reveal any nasties. Not forgiving at all. However they are liquid and super detailed. They aren't as forward as the 118s. Which is good as they are more explicit so balance out well. They are clearly a top quality speaker that hit you with a wow factor. However the 118s being less explicit feel a degree warmer (if a little bass lighter). Due to less detail and separarion I guess. I enjoy both. I chose not to go to the SM100 due to mainly expense at the time but also I felt I might get tired by them. They are super revealing but crazy good. I will buy a pair one day... just for ownership. My front end is pretty decent but I felt not quite enough still for this level of monitor.

I hope Tab 10s provide a middle ground in the meantime.

Ime the driver integration in the Tablette 10 is better than the PMC Twenty.23 I used to own. The latter has a very slightly grainy quality in the crossover frequency region. Initially I thought it was the SN2 but a change to S400 proved that not to be the case.

G

I think you should try  PMC fact3.

Supernait 2 with hicap, will do nicely.

leni v posted:

I think you should try  PMC fact3.

What makes you say that? 

GraemeH posted:

Ime the driver integration in the Tablette 10 is better than the PMC Twenty.23 I used to own. The latter has a very slightly grainy quality in the crossover frequency region. Initially I thought it was the SN2 but a change to S400 proved that not to be the case.

G

Curious. Sounds promising. Will try the 10s and the sigs out. Although if the sigs do the same as the D2s over the 118s then they'll not be for me.

I don't get the DB range of ProAc at all. Sound boxy to me. Sounds like the tabs are better!

ThatsNotMyNaim posted:

leni v posted:

I think you should try  PMC fact3.

What makes you say that? 

Its uses much better components then 25 range and mayby it will change your opinion about PMC SQ.I have nothing against the proac models,just offering you another option to explore.

TNMN - Have you tried ATC SCM19 speakers? From reading your posts they might be right up your street, they have that fine balance between accuracy and musicality.

leni v posted:

ThatsNotMyNaim posted:

leni v posted:

I think you should try  PMC fact3.

What makes you say that? 

Its uses much better components then 25 range and mayby it will change your opinion about PMC SQ.I have nothing against the proac models,just offering you another option to explore.

Not surprising since its very much more expensive

Well thats depend wether the OP is after vfm or high end sq.

VFM is important of course. However my aim is high end sound quality, for sure.

I'll have a listen to the Fact3 when I get a chance. It might be too big though for my room. I'm yet to hear much else I like and in the mean time I am rather fortunately stuck with my trusty 118s. For which I paid £900!

The PMC 25.22 or 23 couldn't sway me. Nor Dynaudio Specials. Nor did I take to Focals. Totem Sky were alright but a bit too much razzle! 

ATC I really need get a pair. Silly I haven't really. 

What Focals did you hear? What did you not like about them? I can understand if you didnt like PMC then not liking Dynaudio. They have a similar sound from what I've heard. Good luck with your search. 

Aria 906? Nothing high in the ranks.

I just felt versus the ProAcs they wern't as natural sounding. ProAcs less forced / less processed best way I can describe it. More like listening to music than listening to a speaker. 

Sopra's are expensive but not out of the question in future. 

I am loving my Sopra 1s,just came from Dyn special 40s.If you want something unique,try Trenner and Friedl Art monos,I will some day have a pair myself.Look them up on YouTube...go to Trenner and Friedl Arts,Crayon CFA-1.2,and Ray Charles...there is a nice video of them playing,starting with The Fairfield Four,that sounds AMAZING!

No quarter posted:

I am loving my Sopra 1s,just came from Dyn special 40s.If you want something unique,try Trenner and Friedl Art monos,I will some day have a pair myself.Look them up on YouTube...go to Trenner and Friedl Arts,Crayon CFA-1.2,and Ray Charles...there is a nice video of them playing,starting with The Fairfield Four,that sounds AMAZING!

Have heard these live? They sound superbly clean, fast and agile but quite rich? I knownyou can't judge from YT but sound promising.

No I have not heard them live,but everything I have read is very positive.The problem is finding a dealer who carry’s them.I believe there is a dealer in the US...