N272 versus nDAC

Peter Earnshaw posted:

[@mention:17757776930523932] and [@mention:63936634726737555] regarding the Allo digione; I have to say I am very impressed. Even with a no-name, cheapo S/PDIF cable it matched the internal streaming section of the 272 on Spotify, and improved (slightly) on my existing setup based on Macbook/Audivarna/USB/Audiophilleo technologies. I then bought an S/PDIF cable from SLIC Innovations and am extremely pleased with the outcome. I have never heard such levels of natural, unforced detail from any digital rig. It's the old adage of improving the source, and very gratifying to be able to spend so little compared to other solutions. I'm using Volumio, which is free (donations requested). There are niggles but the SQ is worth a niggle or two.

Thanks for sharing this Peter — that’s very encouraging. I thought about a simple Coax cable (BNC) from Flashback Cables (about £45) or maybe a Chord Clearway (about £100) — the latter is what Chord Company (not Chord Electronics) suggest to use with the Hugo 2.

I've ordered an Allo. Will report back. 

Will compare Allo into nDac with digital out out of 272 into ndac with digital out of unitiqute into ndac.

Mango

i don’t know the Allo,but I can guarantee you the digital out of the 272 is better than the digital out of the UQ.I used to run the digital out of my old UQ2 into my Dyn XD 600s,I upgraded to a 272,and fed the XDs the digital out from the 272...same music on a thumb drive.This was a large upgrade to my ears,much better with the 272.Now whether or not you will hear that much difference into an Ndac,I don’t know.

MangoMonkey posted:

I've ordered an Allo. Will report back. 

Will compare Allo into nDac with digital out out of 272 into ndac with digital out of unitiqute into ndac.

Mango, check out Hans Beekhuyzen on YouTube -- in his review of the Allo Digione, he tried a few power supplies. It's an informative video! And please report what your ears hear when you have the Allo in your system! 

Peter, did you try your Allo Digione with power supply upgrades?

DrMark posted:

Richard Dane posted:

I have both. I like the performance of the Hugo but find that I don’t really use it anymore. I do however use the Naim DAC day in day out. They both sound great, albeit somewhat different, but I think the Hugo isn’t really very convenient for use in a system, whereas the Naim DAC is an excellent digital hub and no need to mess around. So if you fancy a Hugo do consider carefully its use ability in the real world. 

Richard, can you expound a little bit on this? I don't want to potentially hijack the thread, but I am interested in what is "inconvenient" (or less convenient) about the Hugo, especially if one were to use it just as a DAC for streaming.  Hopefully the answer here will prove instructive to the subject at hand.

I'm obviously not Richard ... but what I took from Richard's comments is the Huge sounds great (though different rather than better compared with the nDAC) ... but if you are using it with more than one source it is inconvenient: less inputs, no remote switching (in Hugo MkI), if you connect multiple cables it can get a bit unwieldy and (shock horror) untidy, etc.

Hi all

i have ordered a ps from custom hifi cables and await its arrival. Will report back. At the moment I’m using an iFI iUSB 3.0 literally just as a power supply.

regarding usb from thumb drive into the n272, I concluded Allo Digi1 > MacBook with Audirvana and Audiophilleo > usb thumb drive using the same file for each (Gregory Porter iirc). The first two quite close and both much better than the thumb drive.

now with the SLIC cable it is no contest, Allo wins easily

Eloise posted:

DrMark posted:

Richard Dane posted:

I have both. I like the performance of the Hugo but find that I don’t really use it anymore. I do however use the Naim DAC day in day out. They both sound great, albeit somewhat different, but I think the Hugo isn’t really very convenient for use in a system, whereas the Naim DAC is an excellent digital hub and no need to mess around. So if you fancy a Hugo do consider carefully its use ability in the real world. 

Richard, can you expound a little bit on this? I don't want to potentially hijack the thread, but I am interested in what is "inconvenient" (or less convenient) about the Hugo, especially if one were to use it just as a DAC for streaming.  Hopefully the answer here will prove instructive to the subject at hand.

I'm obviously not Richard ... but what I took from Richard's comments is the Huge sounds great (though different rather than better compared with the nDAC) ... but if you are using it with more than one source it is inconvenient: less inputs, no remote switching (in Hugo MkI), if you connect multiple cables it can get a bit unwieldy and (shock horror) untidy, etc.

Thanks Eloise - much-appreciated explanation.

Mark, what I mean is that you firstly have to switch on the Hugo. This is not easy. The switch is tiny and difficult to get at.  You need to manage to snag it with a finger nail, but if you have relatively big hands, good luck. Secondly you then need to do all sorts of button presses - and remember what colours mean what. I often get it wrong then have to go and find the box/instructions.  Depending on which digital source you want to use you then have to do some plugging and unplugging (this may have been done initially, but you get the idea).  Now it won't sit square on the shelf, as the weight of the interconnects and digital coaxial cable tip it up on just two feet.  OK, ready to listen.  Oh damn, the batteries have gone flat.  Time to plug in and re-charge - heaven help you if you forget and don't disconnect the charger hours later (It seems that disconnecting the charger to listen is good practice and may be the best way to avoid premature battery failure - mine is still fine). 

The Naim DAC, by contrast, just sits on the rack, always powered up (and if I do want to switch it on or off, it's a nice easy big switch), and I can switch between sources by remote, and no need to press any buttons for different bit rates, crossfeeds etc..

Both sound great.  The Hugo definitely has something - it has detail and space but just manages to keep everything together rather than picked apart, and manages to avoid being too cerebral. The Hugo excels on natural acoustic music, classical in particular.  The Naim DAC is warmer, a bit less dimensional, perhaps a bit more forgiving, but does the Naim things well. Performance wise, I like them both, but for usability, the Hugo isn't even in the same race.  It sits on the Audiotech table next to the Fraim but I haven't used it in many months, which is a shame really.

Richard, interesting I don’t think I have seen you describe the Hugo before in those terms... and I agree, certainly it does not require much cerebral focus... you can listen into the music without having to concentrate or listen critically, you just get absorbed.

The Naim DAC as you say is quite a different beast... it can really convey a tune and a rhythm well, but does not  provide that inner sense of realism that the Hugo does... however to appreciate the most from what the Hugo offers you really need higher end amplification such as the 252 or 552. The Naim DAC does what it does  well across the Naim range... as you say more forgiving and perhaps less demanding.

BTW regarding colours, I associate red with RedBook which to my mind I associate with SPDIF coax... and blue for Bluetooth. Red also comes up when playing RedBook CDs with 44.1... it works for me.

Richard Dane posted:

Mark, what I mean is that you firstly have to switch on the Hugo. This is not easy. The switch is tiny and difficult to get at.  You need to manage to snag it with a finger nail, but if you have relatively big hands, good luck. Secondly you then need to do all sorts of button presses - and remember what colours mean what. I often get it wrong then have to go and find the box/instructions.  Depending on which digital source you want to use you then have to do some plugging and unplugging (this may have been done initially, but you get the idea).  Now it won't sit square on the shelf, as the weight of the interconnects and digital coaxial cable tip it up on just two feet.  OK, ready to listen.  Oh damn, the batteries have gone flat.  Time to plug in and re-charge - heaven help you if you forget and don't disconnect the charger hours later (It seems that disconnecting the charger to listen is good practice and may be the best way to avoid premature battery failure - mine is still fine). 

The Naim DAC, by contrast, just sits on the rack, always powered up (and if I do want to switch it on or off, it's a nice easy big switch), and I can switch between sources by remote, and no need to press any buttons for different bit rates, crossfeeds etc..

 

There is no reason why the Hugo shouldn’t be left powered on permanently just like NDAC, so  never needing to press any buttons unless needing to change sources. All I did when I had mine was turn off the mains about once a minth until the battery was low then turn back on, only needing to restart Hugo and reselect my desired input if I forgot it and allowed the battery to go completely flat.

I did use its thumbwheel knob for controlling volume, as I was using without a preamp (and unlike H2 there was no remote control): it was a bit odd at first compared to a conventional knob, but not long to get used to, and did mean the Hugo had to be positioned at the front (if vol control not used and different inputs not needed it can be positioned anywhere).

the hugo from the start was leagues in front of the ndac and others .   BUT operational it was a nightmare. i had two failures.   repaired under warrenty  in 3 years, both to do with the DC.  sold it due to reliability.   .listen to the nova again and it is surely a great product  . at the same time i listened to my ndx with the   chord quest and it was also stunningly good. guess most will wait to when the new platformed NDX etc comes to the market

YESTDAY

audio1946 posted:

the hugo from the start was leagues in front of the ndac and others .   BUT operational it was a nightmare. i had two failures.   repaired under warrenty  in 3 years, both to do with the DC.  sold it due to reliability.   .listen to the nova again and it is surely a great product  . at the same time i listened to my ndx with the   chord quest and it was also stunningly good. guess most will wait to when the new platformed NDX etc comes to the market

 

YESTDAY

By ‘the DC’ I assume you mean the battery? There was a problem with Hugo batteries, I don’t know if it was one batch, or simply during the early part of production. From what others have reported on this forum it was later resolved, and battreies replaced FOC even outside the warranty period.