ATC SCM40 stumbles the SN2?

It sounds as though he's trying to sell you more kit -  I'd go and listen for yourself and see what you think of the SN2 / 40 combination.

You need 65K amplification to run a 8K speaker? Something seriously wrong with either the amp or the speaker if that's the case..

I've had a dem in the past of SCM40s driven by a NAP200 so similar to SN2 and they sounded great , not lacking at all . They will definitely benefit from more power and I use a 250DR on my SCM19s but you definitely don't need a 300 . 

I think there a couple of members here with SN2/SCM40 combo . Patu maybe ?

kaydee6 posted:

Have just sold the Harbeth SHL5 and am going to audition the SCM40 soon. However the ATC dealer mentioned I would need a 500DR to drive the 40. He had a customer who uses the SN2 with the 40 and the amp clips above 85db volume (I assume no HicapDR). He recommends ATC 40A and to use the SN2 as pre.

Naim dealer told me the same, need at least a 300DR.

Another ATC dealer says no issue as his customer uses an all in one naim system (I assume its either the SU or nova) and drive the 40 well. So what gives?

ATC SCM 40 has a impedance not lower than 5 ohm with 85db/w sensitivity and traditionally not an easy speaker to drive. However, SN2's 80watt is no slouch. .

I am currently waiting for the NDX2 and presently have the Allodigital One>NDAC>SN2/HicapDR. I would appreciate feedback from existing ATC 40 owner on their experience. Thanks

i heard often that atc 19 needs a nap 250 to really begin to perform well.  So i guess the atc40 need at minimum a 250 and better the 300....  If i were you i would take more the atc 19( if you keep the sn2).

But perhaps try another speaker, because you will loose the midrange beauty of the harbeth and get a leaner sound.  Sonus faber olympica 2 is faster than harbeth but had body and lots of beautiful textures.  

Or try atc 40 with nap 300....

I would trade the lot in for 40 actives and 272. You might find you have change left over.

I had a demo of SCM-40's driven by a Nova a few months ago at Acoustica in Chester and it sounded really really good at reasonably loud listening volumes. No issues at all. I don't see why a SN2 wouldn't be equally as good.

Also to say that the demo was to listen to the Nova and the speaker choice was down to Acoustica themselves so they must have thought they would make a good demo pair :-)

Hi all. Have had the following for the past 6 years & never had a problem with volume or sound quality;

202/200 with Hicap and Napsc. Original 40's (without the fireguards). Absolutely fantastic sound (for me), never any clipping etc. even when playing Yes/Floyd/Meatloaf/Zep at window bending volumes.

Trust your own ears, they are a better guide than someone looking for a hefty sales bonus.

Stainless

I can't answer about the ATC specifically, But, if a speaker was so difficult to drive, that a SN2 could not drive it; I would look for another speaker. 

I enjoyed a very good demo of N272/250DR driving a set of ATC SCM40s beautifully.  No sign of clipping or distress that I could discern.  I really liked the SCM40s and would recommend an audition with your SN2 and decide what you think.  They probably do sound better with a 500 but that doesn't mean they can't work with something a little more modest...

Thanks for the feedback. Keep' em coming

I auditioned the SCM40s with my NAC252/300 and they worked fine, no signs of clipping at all. I went for SCM50s and they work even better. ATC say power amplifiers up to 1500 watts can be used, but I can't imagine many people do. If you have doubts try the active version, I saw the active SCM40's at Bristol driven by an ATC pre/streamer/CD and that seemed a very neat solution, as Halloween Man suggests try active SCM40 with a 272

I have the ATC SCM 40's on home demo right now. I am running them from my superuniti, and whilst volume isn't an issue, bass control at 'enthusiastic' listening levels isn't great, (i'll go further, it's not good enough). The dealer also lent me a Musical Fidelity M6si Integrated to try, which I am using as a power amp fed from the SU. In this guise the system has much better control over the bass, which is deep and punchy, very satisfying.

So, I strongly suggest a trial at home with your amp and if possible borrow a bigger amp as it might give you a clearer insight into how well your amp is managing the ATC's.   

Clearly the NAP 250dr power amp would be a more appropriate partner for the SU as a source, but as the ATC dealer doesn't carry Naim kit, I am now wondering whether the NAP250dr would be enough for the ATC's.

Good luck

Thanks Roog. Yes it looks like a bit of a struggle for the SU. 

Can't comment on how how Naim amps drive the 40's. But having owned a pair for some years and heard them driven by a number of amps, one thing ive found. You need an amp with plenty of drive and enough grip to control them.

without this they sound weak, woolly and flabby. With it they are still the best speaker ive heard under £10K, IMHO.

I tried the ATC's  at lower volume last night, still fed by the M6Si, and the bass held up well. I really like the controlled sound of the SCM 40's. I can see that I will need to consider the 'power and the grip' of my amplification.

Any one have any other suggestions?  

Why not try the active 40s? Swap the SU for a 272 and you are sorted. 

Hungryhalibut posted:

Why not try the active 40s? Swap the SU for a 272 and you are sorted. 

Ah, HH this option had crossed my mind, I guess I have a fear of committing to buying my amps as a part of the speakers, either way it seems like I'm going to have to pay for a 'bigger' amplifier either in, or out side of the speakers.

One key advantage of buying the amplifier as an 'out board' item is being able to buy used, as I haven't budgeted for an amplifier.  I'm now looking for a powerful amplifier with the ability to drive a tough load, any ideas?  

You could try a 250, and maybe later swap the SU for a 272. Cost wise, the 40 is £3,750 and a used 250DR say £2,500. A new pair of 40As is £6,800, not much different. 

I auditioned Supernait2 against 250.2 into SCM40's. The 250 had  more control over the bass driver. SCM40A is an interesting speaker, which was not in production when I bought the 40's, I would try 250DR into 40's against 40A. listen to the music, not just just the huge power increase of the 40A. I suspect the 250DR into SCM40's will give more PrAT, but I must listen myself.

a friend has NAC 202 + NAP 200 into ATC SCM40 - he was unhappy in a largish room

he shifted to a smaller home and is much happier

If i wanted the ATC SCM 40 - i would pair it with ATC SiA 150V2 + Naim 272 streamer or Naim DAC

Those ATC SCM 40 are nice speakers though.

Hi Kaydee

You don't say why you sold your Harbeths so it is not entirely clear what you are looking for in your new speakers.  With that caveat in mind I concur with others that if you are considering ATC you owe it to yourself to listen to their active speakers.  Amongst their entry level range I have heard the active 19s and 40s and both are quite exceptional imho.  I had a long demo at Acoustica last autumn and a chap from ATC who was there at the shop reckoned that the 40As were a real sweet spot in the range and that most of his colleagues shared this view.  As HH has suggested you could swap your whole system for a 272/SCM40A or, depending on budget, include an XPS or even swap the SN2 for a pre-loved 282 to front the ATCs.  Lots of things to try but I urge you to investigate the SCM 40As.

Roger

A few weeks ago I had a ring around to locate a nearby demo of ATC Active 40s and I got an email yesterday that some had arrived in a central london dealer . I became free this afternoon and managed to get a direct passive and active ATC 40 demo . 

The source was a fancy Burmester Network player / Pre and a £3k ish ATC Power Amp on the Passives to keep things in  tandem price and spec wise . 

In short anyone considering SCM40s with that level of electronics has to seriously seriously consider the Actives , I listened to a few familiar tracks streamed from Tidal by Marvin Gaye , Massive Attack , Nina Simone, Air , the Stones and Frank Sinatra  etc and the sounds were fabulous but it was Jimi Hendrix's guitar solo halfway through 'All along the Watchtower' that stole the show , it was like I've never heard it before , absolutely incredible ! 

So after about 45 minutes listening to the Actives we switched everything identically to the Passives and the signature remained the same but it felt like all the life , dynamics , detail and realism had gone . Everything much smaller , I fully expected the Actives to win but not by this margin . We listened to the Passives for about 5 minutes , about 30 seconds a track . Job done . I'll need to try the Passive 40s at home as I don't think I can borrow the Actives but my findings at the Acoustica show were reinforced today . 

Very likely my next speaker .

Thank you Pete for reporting your findings, sounds like the actives have to be on the list.

On a related note, on the day I picked the passives up from the dealer for a home demo, another chap was auditioning what i think were active scm 50s  in the store. They sounded incredible even through a closed demo room door, the door seemed to be rumbling in its frame. I know, I'm such a kid!

I really like the Active 50s and thought at one stage I'd stretch to them but I think the 40s will suit my house better in many ways . 

Pete, I have recently bought Active 40's and have no regrets. Incredible speakers and sound amazing compared to all previous passive speakers I've heard.