Demoing loudspeakers (not at home) How to listen

Byoa: bring your own amp. It is at least what I did.

How do you listen yourself at home ? Just do it the same way otherwise your going to be concentrating more on how you listen than be relaxed for your demo.

Once you're happy follow up by a home dem which is the most important as you will be in your normal environment and will be at your most relaxed. That's when you make the decision to buy (or not)

James

Hi,

 I usually take one of my current favorites and another familiar record with a very different style of music to every demo. The current favorite, because I seem to like listening to it at the moment. Therefore I can relate to the difference between how I know its sound from home and on the demo system. The other one is to see how whatever I’m demoing is suited to different sounds.

If I don’t know most of the gear used for the demo, I tend to listen to some music from the dealers stock, simply to acclimate myself with the new things.

Alonso posted:

... I've done this in the past a couple of times, I thought I'd tap into this forum for general advice.

It might sound obvious to most but, how do you approach this?

You bring your own favorite music, that is clear, but do you bring music you know sounds good (e.g. Steely Dan Aja) or you bring music you love (I dunno, early Dylan bootleg recordings) do you also bring music you're not so keen on?

Do you play one song with component A and then switch to play the same track with component B? The same but with a full album? Fractions of a track again and again?

Do you take notes on paper?

Do you pay attention to particular traits? Is it purely an emotional experience for you? 

Do you ask the dealer to do a blind test for you? Eyes closed, swap and not tell me what's connected sort of thing?

You get the drift. I would genuinely like to hear you views, opinions, past experiences of what has worked best for you

Thank you

PS: I promise to shower and wear by Sunday best 

Don't take notes on paper!

One thing to have in mind is that with music you listen both consciously and subconsciously - meaning that you enjoy some things that you can't really at present consciously explain. That does not stop people trying to do this - PRaT, timing ...etc are just attempts to itemize aspects of the musical experience to the conscious mind.

Personally - and it is always a personal individual thing - just relax and let the music come to you and let yourself notice how it moves you and you are enjoying it - or not.

The better the system, the less effort it takes to 'enjoy' it - in fact it should not entail any conscious efforts or explanation crib-sheet to enjoy music from a good demo.

With speakers the usual thing is try to make sure the rest of the system and cables are as close to what you have or will have as possible for the demo.  Then the Power Amp makes the next largest difference and some Amps get on better with some speakers than others - a good Dealer will know all this and should aim to help you along to your final decisions in the demo.

But all else said - relax and play a couple of tracks from different music types you like and see if you want that system!
That is the test I perform - does it interest me, capture my attention and am I finding over time I'd like to have this for myself.

DB.

There's something to be said for 'blind' testing/listening; but ................. we (and perhaps other family members) have to be happy with the physical appearance of the chosen loudspeakers to some extent, or they might psychologically 'jar' - spoiling the listening experience.

I think it's a mistake to take, and try to listen to too many tracks. I'd say three, maximum - and they should be well loved/known favourites. Either one derives more from the music than is currently heard at home on the current rig; or one does not.

As DB says; don't get too analytical - just relax.

Good luck.

John.

I might add that I usually take more music than I'm going to listen to because sometimes, my mood takes me in one direction or another. I might fancy some female vocals or something retro or Rock or Classical.

Certainly take familiar music - perhaps something which always stuns you (for me Talk Talk's Colour Of Spring album) and if it doesn't stun you, or one stuns you more, you know which speaker to buy!

Avoid lots of A/B switching, especially at the beginning (it can be useful for confirmation towards the end). And yes listen to a piece all the way through. Challenging performances (nuances of interpretation), challenging voice s and instruments (with undertones or whatever that not all systems successfully capture) are also helpful, as can be great performances that are badly recorded.

I have changed my approach over the last few years, where I will not listen, until the end, to music I know on a demo. there are too many variables and I find I end up trying to make the system sound the way my home system does, which will never happen.

I have had much better results by listening to unfamiliar music as i'm not trying t hear for a certain instrument or something I know exists in the track. Its easer to relax and see how the system takes me.

ultimately the item has to come home and be demo'd in your system for any meaningful comparison.

Michael_B. posted:

Avoid lots of A/B switching, especially at the beginning (it can be useful for confirmation towards the end). And yes listen to a piece all the way through. Challenging performances (nuances of interpretation), challenging voice s and instruments (with undertones or whatever that not all systems successfully capture) are also helpful, as can be great performances that are badly recorded.

I hadn't read the question properly (loudspeakers...ahem). Most decent dealers will empty the room of other speakers so A/B stuff is beside the point. Though if they do have the speakers you have at home, dragging them in at the end could be interesting just so that you get an idea of what the room is contributing (assuming the rest of the system is the same as your own)

Ardbeg10y posted:

Byoa: bring your own amp. It is at least what I did.

Yes... that's a good point and I might follow your advice.  Thank you

Darke Bear posted:

Alonso posted:

 

... The better the system, the less effort it takes to 'enjoy' it - in fact it should not entail any conscious efforts or explanation crib-sheet to enjoy music from a good demo.

 

I like this.... good mantra. Thank you

Try and get the speakers positioned in the demo room if possible, as near to how they would be in your room, width apart and in relation to side and back walls. Distance to the listening hot seat.  This should give you a better clue on how they will respond differently or not on home demo.

Use a range of listening volumes, from whisper to as loud as you normally play loud.

Michael_B. posted:

Avoid lots of A/B switching, especially at the beginning (it can be useful for confirmation towards the end). And yes listen to a piece all the way through. Challenging performances (nuances of interpretation), challenging voice s and instruments (with undertones or whatever that not all systems successfully capture) are also helpful, as can be great performances that are badly recorded.

I'm with you... intuitively I felt that lots of A/B switching would not help... not sure the full album approach either.... 

Re. great performances badly recorded are a great test... you're right. I think it's easy for a system to make Daft Punk's RAM sound good...  not many can do the same with early punk...  although the latter is more a visceral response than actual SQ but yes... the principle still applies.

TOBYJUG posted:

Use a range of listening volumes, from whisper to as loud as you normally play loud.

I need to write this one down.... Most of my listening is late at night.  

From what I’ve read, quiet music is not ATCs’ strongest point. It is really important to ensure you listen at the volume you normally use. 

Hungryhalibut posted:

From what I’ve read, quiet music is not ATCs’ strongest point. It is really important to ensure you listen at the volume you normally use. 

For this and for many other reasons is why I am doing this demo.  I've never heard so many contradicting descriptions of a loudspeaker brand as I've heard of ATC. From "cold and clinical", to "revealing and emotional". From "You need a NAP500 to properly drive a pair of SCM40" to "Ive got customers really happy driving them with a NaimUniti" from " You need at least NAC282 otherwise it will uncover the weakness of any lesser electronic" to the dozens of people on the ATC forum who hook them up to £500 pre and MacMinis"  -  So yeah.... I need to see for myself  

I'm listening to Active ATC40s now and using an iPhone app as a  sound meter I'm finding the sweet spot for me today is between 70-75db with the odd peak up to 80db . I wouldn't say this is particularly loud , voices sound very much a natural level etc and even turning down a little is fine . I would say the Active 40s sound a little better at low volumes than the Passive 19s they replaced but not significantly . Similarly having also owned PMC Twenty23s , they also seemed to switch ON at around the same level , this could also just be the level that me and my brain prefer .

I don't normally listen with a sound meter in tow by the way ...

When I'm looking to change something major it is because there is something that my current system that is not working to my satisfaction - some music that I really like doesn't sound as good as I think it should. I've seldom gone in thinking "I have a budget of x and want things to be generally better". More like "I want to improve Y, let's see if I can do that at a sensible cost".

I'll choose some recordings that show up these problems and some that sound brilliant on my current system. I want to fix the problems without killing what I currently enjoy. I'll generally listen to a couple of minutes of three or four different recordings then switch. And repeat. And repeat until I'm confident in what I think - i.e. this this a change I'm convinced about making.

Oh and if I felt I needed to take notes, that would tell me that the differences weren't big enough to be worth spending the money on. The change needs to be obvious in the ways I care about.

Dealer demos are ONLY a taster of how your possible L/S's can or will sound at home. The bigger they are, floor standers especially, need a home demo.

Hardest things to get right when buying. Do not "drive" the room with bass boom.

Douglas

Be sure to listen at the volume YOU are comfortable with. Often the dealer tends to try to impress with a full (loud) sound,also typically (for me) their demo room is larger than my listening space so they try to fill the room with a loud sound. Also most of my listening is at a relatively low level so that is part of my listening test.