Lp12, omg how did I get here

Go for it !

You decide monday for a visit in November !

I’m looking forward to having Peter over in November here in Texas. It will be the 5th time I host him between Brazil and the US, so I would defintely encourage you.

Definite synergy between the LP12 and Naim I'm another very happy client of Peter's here in the US. Sadly ,he will not be stopping by my place on his Fall 2018 tour but I have hosted him numerous times as well over the years. A true gentleman. You will watch him build your deck from scratch in your own home- crazy right ?! Oh, and an LP12 built by Peter will not go out of tune as all the naysayers proclaim ...Go for it- you are in for an eye-opening / ear-opening experience.

ATB,

Mark

Backwater- see my profile and feel free to contact me if you have any questions ? This Forum may not be the best place to discuss...

Mark, there's no problem with discussing LP12s on here.

Zackwatet

When it comes to Lp12 in the context of naim Peter Swain is you man. I know know him for several years and very much appreciate his knowledge and his friendship. Can’t praise him high enough. He has come over to my place  just recently to rebuild my deck and help me with my system setup. There are many happy customers here from Peter and I am confident all will concur. 

Kr F 

Another very happy customer here. Peter’s your man.

varyat posted:

....on his Fall 2018 tour....

At this point I can easily imagine Peter's Tour 'merch', at the very least black T-shirts with a suitable design on the front, and a list on states and dates on the back 

Zackwater, I hope you find the whole turntable thing to your liking. Love mine.

Like I stated in your other thread, you can't go wrong with [@mention:1566878603906177] and his recommendations.  I'm another one of Peter's US customers (I think I was on another tour sandwiched between [@mention:1566878603964768] and [@mention:1566878603992139]).  He's great fun, a great guest and a wonderful dealer.  You will not regret working with Peter.  I really suggest you go for it!

Upgrade machine lp12.... 

I would recommend Peter Swain - and Cymbiosis as a whole - unhesitatingly and unreservedly; well almost unreservedly, as if if keeps jetting around the world he might not be available when I need him  

I’ll be hosting Peter tomorrow morning on one of his slightly less exotic tour to Exeter, Devon, England. He’ll be installing my new LP12. I don’t believe there’s anyone in the World better experienced or skilled with LP12’s, not even at the Linn factory in Glasgow. Really looking forward to it as you might imagine 

Zackwater, I too was expecting to buy a Rega when I started my quest to buy my first turntable in 25years. The Rega’s are fine turntables and a very valid alternative approach for those who find the LP12 a little contrived and coloured, but personally, it didn’t take long into the dem at Cymbiosis for me to realise where my preferences lay..

ricsimas posted:

I’m looking forward to having Peter over in November here in Texas. It will be the 5th time I host him between Brazil and the US, so I would defintely encourage you.

Hi Ricsimas,

I’m in the northern suburbs of Dallas. Where abouts are you?

Peter has helped me out several times but I’ve never actually met him. If he’s going to be not too far from me I’d like to do so.

Thanks.

Best regards,

Mark Dunn

Christopher_M posted:

varyat posted:

....on his Fall 2018 tour....

At this point I can easily imagine Peter's Tour 'merch', at the very least black T-shirts with a suitable design on the front, and a list on states and dates on the bacK

This one really got me belly laughing out loud.  I'm one of the original P Swain USA tour groupies.  He has been here so often I lost count - I think he might even have his own set of keys!  Probably has a set to Mark's house and Joe Silva in HK as well!

Just dropping in to say hello to some old friends.  Hi Mark - Hi Ricardo (heard you are back in the States)- Hi DaveJ (I owe you an email reply).  Mark Dunn (of the famous Aro hanger bending fame) - I'm surprised you have never met Peter in the flesh after all these years.  I hope the two of you can hook up.

 Speaking of the Aro I see on the other forum there is now a second coming of the famous wobbly arm!  Maybe there is hope for all of us when it comes time to replace out Aro's due to old age.

All kidding aside - Richard - how long can the Aro go for?  I think wiring eventually needs to be replaced?  Inner paint for conductivity?

In all seriousness we need to speak with Peter, Wayne and Phil and have some tour T shirts made up.  It would be hilarious!

Best to all

Gregg

Zackwater posted:

  With naim components and a lp12 turntable I can’t go too wrong.  PLUS, IT FITS ON MY FRAIM STAND! 

The LP12 works great on top of Fraim however if you can accommodate it have Peter bring over a Vulkan wall shelf and another set of Fraim cups,balls and glass to go with it.

Ask Mark (Varyat) - he has TWO Vulkans (!)

Zackwater - IIRC this is your third separate thread in relation to turntable choice, as opposed to one continuous thread.

You seem to have gone from a "VPI vs RP10" thread, to a "Clearaudio" and now "LP12 ...." canvasing opinions, but without actually listening to anything.

Are you absolutely sure that you want a turntable for playing vinyl or should you simply call it a day and stick with digital?

I really think that you owe it to yourself at this stage, to at least audition something.

The Peter Swain turntable (Linn) may be a great option, but you can't exactly have him flying from the UK, every time you need something (inevitable upgrades etc) for the LP12 and that's why you really need to invest in a reliable dealer where you live - otherwise, who is going to provide you with any on going support.

I thought that was the rationale for looking at the Rega decks, but you now seem to have gone to the opposite end of the spectrum, with the inevitable setup requirements of the LP12.

Surely there must be someone closer who can provide you with a demonstration of the decks?

Living in the UK offers great support for LP12 owners and might be the right choice, if you live there. However, if you live somewhere 'remote' and without dealer support in reasonable proximity, it may not.

I am also a little perplexed as to why Peter Swain (Cymbiosis) is the only apparent much lauded LP12 guru ..... and I am sure that he is an absolute expert in this field. It does beg the question, however, as to why other LP12 dealers do not appear to be held in such high regard.

For a turntable costing that amount, it should be able to be set up to exactly the same performance level by ALL Linn dealers and not require some kind of magical Quija board setup skill, not found elsewhere.

If I lived in the UK, I would most certainly want to experience and listen to an LP12 setup by Mr Swain. Living in New Zealand doesn't offer that opportunity, which is why I selected the RP10 and don't have to worry about whether the setup is on par with that of a specific, much sort after dealer.

There is a Linn dealer in New Zealand, but I doubt that they have the sought after skills of the aforementioned expert - which would leave me always wondering whether I was getting the best sound from the deck.

Without being discourteous to the dealer, I have to say that the difference between the Majik and Akurate level LP12 (compared side by side), was not clear at all. I do not know whether this was a result of the dealers ability to extract the best from the deck or whether there really isn't a huge difference?

Listening elsewhere to the RP10 was a revelation and the deck sold itself. It was much better than the Akurate level LP12 (even if it shouldn't be?), for far less cost and without any setup magic being required. 

Perhaps all Linn dealers are not equal ... who knows? But you would expect a product of this nature, not to be 'so fussy', in order to sound amazing.

Just food for thought and trying to help you not regret your purchase - particular at the price point you are looking at .... which may be why others have sought to guide you towards Planar 3, until you are convinced by vinyl and have a nice collection etc.

The most expensive and sought after turntable may not be the answer to your quest.

I genuinely wish you well in your plight - happy listening 

Mr Frog, all valid points but your post does seem a little negative, especially as many USA customers are happy with this arrangement.

Certainly in the UK there are other top notch dealers for the LP12. I personally use Ian Ridge at Billy Vee. Many such dealers exist but with perhaps a reduced presence on internet fora to that of the clearly excellent Peter S!

Stu

Lp12, omg how did I get here

Deep pockets

stuart.ashen posted:

Mr Frog, all valid points but your post does seem a little negative

I found Mr Frog's response to read as lucid, transparent, and objective. Zackwater in Arkansas is not simply paying for a LP12, he's paying the expenses of, by all accounts, a valid guru to fly and stay across the globe. Buying blindly with a catalog of 50 LPs. This against his own alternative to travel and personally demo decks. Disposable income meets practicality.

In the end I'm sure ZW will have an optimized LP12 that fits on his Fraim with Peter's prescribed phono stage and cart, yet have no perspective as to the output from alternative decks. It's one thing to pay faithfully for quality service when having a car repaired or the carpets cleaned. Quite a different issue to accept another's ears as to what will sound best to yours.

For my own level of income I've been quite happy to do the legwork and homework with TTs, carts, and phono stages. It gives me an appreciation of what I have and I gain knowledge along the way.

All said, I sincerely wish you the best with your choice ZW.

For those based in the USA another option is John Schwartz at Pro Musica in Chicago.  He's been setting up LP12s for decades - absolutely an expert - and a great guy to work with.  He does an amazing job - been doing mine for 25 years - it sounds amazing.

I really appreciate the help.  There are many valid points.  I have withheld two things : (1) I had an rp8 /Aria for 2 months, it was ok (2) I have an old Marantz 2230b and a Thorens super 160/Ortofon bronze mm cartridge from Vinylnirvana , like it better than the rp8. I’m traveling to Denver in July on business AND TO SATISFY MY CRITICS I will stay an extra day and listen to the rp10,, Vpi, sme and hopefully an lp12.  

Zackwater posted:

I really appreciate the help.  There are many valid points.  I have withheld two things : (1) I had an rp8 /Aria for 2 months, it was ok (2) I have an old Marantz 2230b and a Thorens super 160/Ortofon bronze mm cartridge from Vinylnirvana , like it better than the rp8. I’m traveling to Denver in July on business AND TO SATISFY MY CRITICS I will stay an extra day and listen to the rp10,, Vpi, sme and hopefully an lp12.  

Zackwater, I wish you all the best, whatever you decide or choose.  However, forget the critics - the only person who you need to satisfy is yourself.

I never said I was the most decisive person in the world.  I have  even been called fickled, and that by the people who know me best!   I have ended up with what I own by never listening to one piece of it.   I might could have made a better choice on the speakers (focal maestro uptopia) but the rest, I think I did pretty good by  luck and faith.  

jverlen posted:

For those based in the USA another option is John Schwartz at Pro Musica in Chicago.  He's been setting up LP12s for decades - absolutely an expert - and a great guy to work with.  He does an amazing job - been doing mine for 25 years - it sounds amazing.

It's not that there aren't capable and trained LP12 dealers in the US that do a more than adequate job of setup.  I can name at least 5 off the top of my mind and I'm sure there are at least another 5-10.  However, the closest is a 5 hour drive from me and I was told if I ever wanted an "in-home" setup I would need to spend at least $15k on equipment or pay an $800 trip charge.  No thanks.  Keep in mind I live in the 4th largest metro area in the US.  We have no Linn dealer, let alone one well-versed in the ways of the LP12.  And while we do have Rega and VPI dealers here they do not carry any inventory and I would not trust any of them to setup a cartridge in any way.  In my experience it has become very difficult to find good audio retailers outside of the Northeast, Great Lakes area and the metros on the West Coast.

The other US Linn dealers I've contacted in the past were happy to help, but I would have to ship my LP12 across the country or bring it into their shop in New York, Michigan, Colorado, Oregon, etc.

The expense of bringing Peter into my home was well below any of the other options and was much more convenient for me.  He goes out of his way to keep costs reasonable and at a minimum.  I'm relatively young for this hobby, but I've been into high end audio for nearly 20 years, have lived in several large US metros and dealt with over a dozen dealers.  I can only name one US dealer (my current Naim dealer, Tyler at Next Level A/V in the Chicago area) that provides the same level of service and thoughtfulness that [@mention:1566878603906177] provides.

[@mention:13533848859433010] - You are lucky to have access to such a bounty of options in Seattle.  It is not the same way in the southern part of the US.