Amps that are better than Nait XS 2

If more boxes allowed,..?

Perhaps get a Hicap as first move and instant XS upgrade.

Later on you could partly upgrade power section and another preamp, buy s/h if new is too expensive, plenty of reasonable priced non DR hicaps.

Otoh, Elex are fine but not endgame coming from XS, Osiris s/h perhaps.

Easier more effective speakers might be another solution staying with XS

At it's price point, the XS 2 is a very well balanced amp.

In my experience, adding an external PSU for the preamp adds quite a lot of extra resolution without it becoming at all harsh - it actually becomes rather more refined and gets some gains in micro-dynamics at the same time.

Another vote for an external power supply for your existing amp ..

But please NOT the flat cap in any form..

I found it very disappointing as an upgrade..so maybe a hicap DR it funds allow.

Nac 272 into a poweramp. 

I was considering a PS upgrade. There's a used FlatCap XS available locally for $850 CAD (£490) but a previous posts advises against it. I had previously tried a third party PS (you know the one) but ended up returning it (unruly bass) . This however was in a small room and I've since moved into much larger. As I mentioned funds are limited. Speaker options are up in the air as my current speakers are up for sale. Budget and small footprint are to be considered.

Hi. You live in Canada, so Simaudio Moon and Bryston should get an audition.

Besides that, I agree that XS 2 does a lot of stuff right, and it's hard to beat at that cost. However, for my taste,  any Naim separate combo beats their integrated, from my limited experience with Nait 5si, xs2, SN2, 202/172/282 + 200. So maybe look into those, on the sh market.

Naim's best vfm amp, NAC202 with NAPSC, and NAP200. Where it starts to get serious.

As recently suggested in another thread, I would always consider skipping a step up the ladder for greater and quicker VFM. Go 282/250 if not 252 from XS-2. ????

Chag -

Chag... posted:

.. Go 282/250 if not 252 from XS-2. ????

Chag -

Great suggestion to OP which said it should not cost a fortune..????

And should be clearly better than the XS 2. 

Chag -

Perol posted:

Chag... posted:

.. Go 282/250 if not 252 from XS-2. ????

Chag -

Great suggestion to OP which said it should not cost a fortune..????

I suppose ''a fortune'' is relative. For non your average non-audiophile an XS 2 costs a fortune, for an Arab sheik the Statement series is pocket money.

Too bad FlatCap XS is not recommended despite being the logical choice for the XS 2. I spotted a used HiCap DR but I can't help but question why the XS PSU is not recommended for the XS integrated.  What happened to KIS?

Iconoclast posted:

Perol posted:

Chag... posted:

.. Go 282/250 if not 252 from XS-2. ????

Chag -

Great suggestion to OP which said it should not cost a fortune..????

I suppose ''a fortune'' is relative. For non your average non-audiophile an XS 2 costs a fortune, for an Arab sheik the Statement series is pocket money.

Too bad FlatCap XS is not recommended despite being the logical choice for the XS 2. I spotted a used HiCap DR but I can't help but question why the XS PSU is not recommended for the XS integrated.  What happened to KIS?

What I've learned with this forum and upgrade advice is more is better. I'm a bit surprised there hasn't been add a 300dr to it. I think a Flatcap would be a nice upgrade and I think Naim says so also. 

yes, but the nice thing about adding a Hicap is that it can power a 282 down the road, if the OP decides to go that route.

Iconoclast, back to your OP,

Iconoclast posted:

What amps have you experienced (Naim or other) that are clearly better than the XS 2, particularly in bass control and dynamics without being overly aggressive and/or costing a fortune? I found the XS 2's main quality is that it plays most of my music collection without offending.

The Elex R was exciting (and cheaper) but I was afraid it might irritate in the long run.

First, I'd say the fact you found an integrated that plays without offending is very valuable. Don't stray far from that attribute; otherwise, you risk isolating yourself from a portion of the music you enjoy. The SN2 was too exposing of poor recording quality for me. I haven't heard the Elex, but any Rega boxes I've had home posses an overemphasis in their mid-bass, an exaggerated kick drum to my ears. Pleasant in the near-term, but as you say irritating in the long run.

My alternative integrated suggestion would be to demo a Plinius Hautonga, if possible. To my ears it falls somewhere between a Nait XS and a SN2. Like the Nait XS, musically engaging throughout the entirety of my recordings, yet with far better bass command and a more extended top end. Not the speed and agility of the SN2, but then there's no fatigue or loss of top-end cohesion when recordings get edgy. At 200-W, the Hautonga will grip most any speaker you plug into it and it's the same cost of the SN2. Plus it has an excellent built-in phono stage if vinyl interests you. 

Perol posted:

Chag... posted:

.. Go 282/250 if not 252 from XS-2. ????

Chag -

Great suggestion to OP which said it should not cost a fortune..????

I went 202/200 to 282/250 and can vouch for the benefits. Unfortunately, you will need an external PSU for the 282 in addition to the obligatory NAPSC. So, box count and added funding could be issues. That said, cracking amplifier 

A good amp should expose poor recorded music.

Iconoclast posted:

Perol posted:

Chag... posted:

.. Go 282/250 if not 252 from XS-2. ????

Chag -

Great suggestion to OP which said it should not cost a fortune..????

I suppose ''a fortune'' is relative. For non your average non-audiophile an XS 2 costs a fortune, for an Arab sheik the Statement series is pocket money.

Too bad FlatCap XS is not recommended despite being the logical choice for the XS 2. I spotted a used HiCap DR but I can't help but question why the XS PSU is not recommended for the XS integrated.  What happened to KIS?

You'll also find plenty of comments on this forum saying the Flatcap XS is the natural partner for the XS 2 and therefore a good match. 

Iconoclast posted:

Hi,

Finally decided to move on from my Nait XS 2. What amps have you experienced (Naim or other) that are clearly better than the XS 2, particularly in bass control and dynamics without being overly aggressive and/or costing a fortune? I found the XS 2's main quality is that it plays most of my music collection without offending. I remember at the time of purchase I hesitated between the XS 2, SN 2 and Rega Elex R. The SN 2 would have probably been the better choice in the long run but at the time I found the price a bit steep. The Elex R was exciting (and cheaper) but I was afraid it might irritate in the long run. I could sell my 4 year old XS 2 and pick up a slightly used Elex R (still on warranty) and still have change left over to spend on other gear (speakers, DAC). The prices on new Naim gear have skyrocketed here in Canada.

I have been running a ChromeCast Audio via an optical toslink cable into a SuperNait 1. The SuperNait 1 was driving relatively difficult B&W CM1's. It worked fantastic. Especially Spotify - which is lossy music - was working nicely since the SN1 / CM1's are not too revealing. It was a very musical combination. I always found dynamics the convincing capacity of the SN1. It can go from very soft / poetic / silient to a massive sound in a split second. From a single flute to a full orchestra including the timpanies.

The downside of this is that the difference between Spotify and hires downloads is not big. On my office system which has active Ovators the difference between Spotify and hires downloads is massive.

I know the SN2 and SN1 - both paired with and without Hicap and since you seem to be looking for an amp which is not too revealing, but has dynamics and bass control, I can fully recommend the SuperNait 1. This beautiful amp is not loved that much on this forum strangely enough but it has loyal fans like myself too.

wrc posted:

Iconoclast posted:

Too bad FlatCap XS is not recommended despite being the logical choice for the XS 2. I spotted a used HiCap DR but I can't help but question why the XS PSU is not recommended for the XS integrated.  What happened to KIS?

You'll also find plenty of comments on this forum saying the Flatcap XS is the natural partner for the XS 2 and therefore a good match. 

It is a great match and I have one on my NAIT XS. But is the FCXS any good to a guy who wants to upgrade his amp? It's kind of throwing good money after bad. But if he's keeping his XS2 it's a different story.

wrc posted:

Iconoclast posted:

Perol posted:

Chag... posted:

.. Go 282/250 if not 252 from XS-2. ????

Chag -

Great suggestion to OP which said it should not cost a fortune..????

I suppose ''a fortune'' is relative. For non your average non-audiophile an XS 2 costs a fortune, for an Arab sheik the Statement series is pocket money.

Too bad FlatCap XS is not recommended despite being the logical choice for the XS 2. I spotted a used HiCap DR but I can't help but question why the XS PSU is not recommended for the XS integrated.  What happened to KIS?

You'll also find plenty of comments on this forum saying the Flatcap XS is the natural partner for the XS 2 and therefore a good match. 

I would like to know why some people think it's not a good choice. What does it do or not do that's different from the HiCap or from the XS 2 in stock form. If it hinders musicality then it should not exist in the first place. Another thing that I find strange is that the HiCap is more expensive and supposedly better but is only half the width of the FC XS. What's the reasoning behind that? Sorry if I'm asking too many questions for my own good but I like to know these things before spending my hard earned cash.

Christopher_M posted:

wrc posted:

Iconoclast posted:

Too bad FlatCap XS is not recommended despite being the logical choice for the XS 2. I spotted a used HiCap DR but I can't help but question why the XS PSU is not recommended for the XS integrated.  What happened to KIS?

You'll also find plenty of comments on this forum saying the Flatcap XS is the natural partner for the XS 2 and therefore a good match. 

It is a great match and I have one on my NAIT XS. But is the FCXS any good to a guy who wants to upgrade his amp? It's kind of throwing good money after bad. But if he's keeping his XS2 it's a different story.

What I'm trying to achieve is better sound, with the XS 2 or without it. The challenge here is to achieve this without spending a truckload of money. I can get a good price for my XS 2, so if there's an amp out there that is better within that price range then I'll sell. A used PS is a relatively minor investment so if that transforms my XS 2 into something more articulate with better defined bass while maintaining its musical nature then that might be a good compromise. If it turns it into a lumbering oaf then I'll pass. I know that Naim's motto is Go Deeper but my wallet just isn't as deep as some. I always admire people who decorate their houses tastefully with tight budgets as opposed to others who have no taste but simply throw tons of cash at it.

Between the FC and HC on the XS (2) integrated amps, there's an interesting debate.

Some people prefer the FC because they think the HC adds too much to the dynamics of the amp.

If you want to know why there's a difference in cost, just use Google to find some images of the internals of each - the difference is obvious.  The reason for all the empty space in the FC is to make the box the same size and shape as the other XS components (and with the lower specced circuit, it also has an advantage in helping the RFI situation).

Iconoclast posted:

What I'm trying to achieve is better sound, with the XS 2 or without it. The challenge here is to achieve this without spending a truckload of money. I can get a good price for my XS 2, so if there's an amp out there that is better within that price range then I'll sell. A used PS is a relatively minor investment so if that transforms my XS 2 into something more articulate with better defined bass while maintaining its musical nature then that might be a good compromise. If it turns it into a lumbering oaf then I'll pass. I know that Naim's motto is Go Deeper but my wallet just isn't as deep as some. I always admire people who decorate their houses tastefully with tight budgets as opposed to others who have no taste but simply throw tons of cash at it.

My experience with adding an external power supply on the XS 2 was an increase in resolution and better differentiation of instrumental timbres at all frequencies.

I use an XS2 with Hicap DR,  sounds superb. Highly recommended. 

 Bob F 

Iconoclast posted:

Christopher_M posted:

wrc posted:

Iconoclast posted:

Too bad FlatCap XS is not recommended despite being the logical choice for the XS 2. I spotted a used HiCap DR but I can't help but question why the XS PSU is not recommended for the XS integrated.  What happened to KIS?

You'll also find plenty of comments on this forum saying the Flatcap XS is the natural partner for the XS 2 and therefore a good match. 

It is a great match and I have one on my NAIT XS. But is the FCXS any good to a guy who wants to upgrade his amp? It's kind of throwing good money after bad. But if he's keeping his XS2 it's a different story.

What I'm trying to achieve is better sound, with the XS 2 or without it.

Buy a NAC202 and use your NAIT XS2 as a power amp.

When you can, buy a NAPSC and a NAP 200, and sell your NAIT XS2.