I know a lot of folk (not me) rip their CDs in order to be able to play back files without interference from electromechanical parts and to avoid jitter.
I am not a 'ripper' myself, as I have a large vinyl collection to play on my LP12, and a large CD collection which I enjoy playing on my pre-owned CD555. Before that I was using a high-end Krell CD player which had both digital and balanced XLR outputs. Both of these machines have veritable legends of drives fitted into them. Of course, with the Krell player, I imagine that if I had wanted to, I could have fed the digital signal into my computer to record files directly off it, and the resulting sound would probably have benefitted from the quality of the transport. I clearly can't do that with a CD555 which has no digital output. But no matter. It's not something I have ever needed to do anyway, as I normally slide CDs into my MacBook Pro, from where they automatically create simple files in iTunes, ready for using on my ubiquitous Apple gear so that I can listen to some music whilst lounging around the pool...so...job done.
But it did strike me that when one rips CDs, at least part of the quality of the resulting file must surely depend on the quality of the drive reading the disc. And from what I have read, the drives built into most machines designed to rip CDs, are often cheap(ish) computer drives.
And yet so much has been said over the years in the sales pitch and reviews of legacy CD players about the importance and quality of the drives. Surely, If we can hear the difference that a good player makes when playing CDs, then these same aspects are important in the ripping of CDs. Yet it doesn't seem to be mentioned very often. And if it IS the case that the drive is important in getting a 'rip' as error free as possible, then why don't I hear more from those who are keen on obtaining the best sonic results, about using high quality CD transports & CD players in the process?
Am I missing something? Or have new technologies moved on so fast that it is all now a bit of a moot point? :-)
I just wonder how much better a file played from a great streamer would sound, had it been ripped from something equivalent to a CD555, a Linn CD12, etc....
SURELY it would be better. Wouldn't it? I'd love to know others' thoughts on this....
Posted on: 26 July 2018 by meissmar
Did you listen to those different Rips from the D100 and cheap PC drives? No! But I did. Go listen to them yourself before dismissing others experience and then come back and tell us there can be no difference although you might (just might) have heard one.
There is no need in explaining how in theory there should not be any audible difference between bit perfect rips. I trust my ears. Do you?
Posted on: 26 July 2018 by mrspoon
Can I ask, if you were to rip a file on the D100, then rip the same track on a cheap drive, if the resulting files were bit for bit identical, would that clear for you the drives create identical audio tracks?
Posted on: 26 July 2018 by Simon-in-Suffolk
Did you listen to those different Rips from the D100 and cheap PC drives? No! But I did. Go listen to them yourself before dismissing others experience and then come back and tell us there can be no difference although you might (just might) have heard one.
There is no need in explaining how in theory there should not be any audible difference between bit perfect rips. I trust my ears. Do you?
This is not about theory - but based on fact and actual listening experiences. Lots of mumbo jumbo, conjecture and pseudo science on this matter which clouds judgment. There are many different things that cause a difference to the sound playback that is nothing to do with a rip.
When I and several on this forum looked into this a few years back I 'looked' at many rips using a specialist file deconstructor from many different drives and rippers - apart rom the offset issue - the payload sample data were all identical.. not even 0.00001% different.
I am confident I could stream from the same media server a multitude of identical rips from different transports and you would not be able to determine any difference ... because that was the state for many of us on a multitude of systems a few years back - and still is for me - and I cant see what has magically changed in the universe in recent months.
Happy to do the same again - and I am sure there would be other willing volunteers here. Record yourself playing something or use copyright free material - plenty about now - write on to a CD-R in Red Book. Rip using different transports - put ripped files on drop box or similar - and lets put to the test and let us trust our ears.... and I can confirm whether the file sample data payloads are truly identical and/or have offset differences - as well as trusting our ears...
Posted on: 26 July 2018 by meissmar
There could also be several other reasons why the differences I heard on that particular system might not be audible on another system.
As I wrote, I will not argue about the science, I'm just giving my listening experience (and that of many in the audience) to give another opinion. I want to encourage everyone wondering if there are diferences to make up their own mind by trying for themselves, maybe with a top of the line drive.
And just a reminder: Most people think we are crazy and stupid for spending so much money for things that can not sound better than their 500€ integrated with a 100€ DVD Player. And we don't understand how they can be so closed minded. But then we turn around and act the same towards people in our area of interest that hear things that we do not believe to be possible. Isn't that strange?
Believe what you hear and if you do not hear a difference, good for you! But don't run around telling everybody that it's just not possible when others are sure they hear an improvement with a better drive.
Posted on: 26 July 2018 by Simon-in-Suffolk
Care to follow my suggestion so others can hear and decide for themselves? Then it’s not a case of science, engineering, beliefs, theories, passions, conjecture, spirituality, open mindedness, closed mindedness yada yada yada .. but simply a case of community experience... it’s very effective.. if someone wants to believe in dragons, that is entirely upto them, but that is different from someone advocating a holiday in Wales on the basis of expecting to see a live or even dead one.
Posted on: 26 July 2018 by TallGuy
At £900 I'd want the Melco to produce results which sound better than a Lite-On or LG drive at £15 !!
I'm not doubting anyone who says they hear a difference/improvement - as I haven't heard one I'll keep an open mind, but I really do wonder what's in there beyond an OEM drive*, which could do a perfect bit for bit copy itself with no modification, a SATA to USB interface and a nice looking, well made case.
* There's only a handful of actual drive manufacturers left - I can think of Lite-On, LG, Matsushita, Hitachi and Teac. I'm sure Melco/Buffalo isn't one.
I'd have thought the "best" drive would be the one which is most able to cope with damaged disks, for which I'd see the dBpoweramp forum list - the top device being a Lite-On model which is around £12. This is based on feedback from dBpoweramp users so has actual measurement data behind it.
