NAP300 DR vs NAP250 DR is it really worth the extra mile

It's all down to context.  In the context of a top source and pre-amp, yes, absolutely, moving from a NAP250DR to a NAP300DR is definitely worth it. But if source and pre-amp are not up there with the best then I reckon putting the not insubstantial sum that moving from a NAP250DR to NAP300DR requires toward the source and pre-amp is probably the better and more satisfying move. That's my opinion.  I'm sure there will be others in due course.

I agree with Richard, the 300 is a fantastic amp, but do not underinvest in the preamp in order to fund it. 

At the risk of repeating myself, I would strongly suggest a home demo before making any decision. When upgrading last year I had budgeted for a 300DR. It sounded fantastic in the dealers demo room, but was disastrous at home! All the issues (dreadful, totally overwhelming bass boom, poor imaging) were resolved at a stroke when my dealer substituted a 250DR. Before anyone asks, all connections were checked and double checked and the amp performed admirably when returned to its home!

I have no doubt whatsoever that technically the 300 is superior to it’s little brother. However, in my own very limited experience, that does not automatically equate to a superior listening experience. I wonder sometimes whether or not all the very vocal supporters of ‘upstream’, more expensive, Naim equipment have actually heard them perform outside of the demo room or exhibition. I appreciate some have done very careful, real life comparisons, but surely I can’t be the only one to have preferred the 250? According to reps from both ProAc and Naim, it is not uncommon for synergy between the K6 and the 300 to be less than ideal. Just a thought.

Taking into account Richard’s comment changing from a 250dr to a 300dr in my system was a superb upgrade well worth the financial outlay a very special amplifier indeed.

It is worth it. But only when paired with top-notch notch source and pre. 

It should really be one of the final elements in a jigsaw puzzle.

250 to 300 is similar to 300 to 500. It's not incremental. It's not more of the same. They sound very different. Less HiFi, more music. Which presentation suits you best is your call. 

When I added a 300 to my 252 supercap from a 250 the differences were not subtle. One of the best upgrades I've ever made

Timmo out of interest what preamp are you using? 

Ludovico posted:

Timmo out of interest what preamp are you using? 

272.

The 300 is in my opinion worth every penny extra compared to the 250. It’s just so much better. You do though, as others have said, need appropriate electronics before it. When I was using a 272, XPS and 250, I got a 555PS at the same time as the 300. I’d choose a 272/555/250 over a 272/XPS/300. The 300 would be fine as a stepping stone with an SU. 

Ludo - you’ve received really good advice.  However, I wouldn’t bank on the pre-amps being revamped.    

Regards,

Lindsay 

I’m definitely leaning towards the 300DR where total cost would be around £2800 for a second hand 300 and £1500 for conversion to DR. It’s not stupid money and a good starting point for upgrading. 

After suggestions for me to me to look at this option, a couple of weeks ago I did a demo, 250dr vs 300dr, with 272/555ps and then NDS/555ps, the budget is there to spend, however even though there was a difference, for me the VFM wasn’t not enough to make the change from my 250dr.

What I did learn from that exesise was, my system is sitting very well balanced and  it holds it own when compared to its bigger brother, secondly, the source upgrade offered far more beifits than the power amp did.......I hate to say it, source first.

boom posted:

I hate to say it

Why? It's as relevant now as it ever was

Absolutely. If I had a dollar for every time it was mentioned on this forum, I would be at S1 level by now!

Ludovico posted:

My ears ought to be doing this assessment but my issue (like many) is finding a dealer where i can audition both with PMC's Fact 8's. My Fact 8's...

Why not take your speakers to the dealer(s) to audition/compare the amps?  I don’t know about Switzerland, but UK dealers seem quite happy for me to turn up with speakers - and much bigger/heavier ones than the F8s, which they lug in themselves! 

Alternatively, a trip to the UK where it may be easier to find a Naim dealer with F8s is not very expensive in the context of the cost of an amp, and you could combine with a coty break or somesuch...

Ludovico posted:

I've been reading a few posts of underwhelming expectations from NAP 300DR owners/converts. By reading these posts I am now  more confused on whether the incremental price difference between a NAP 250DR and a NAP 300DR equates to a similar incremental difference in sound quality (stage, clarity, control, etc). My ears ought to be doing this assessment but my issue (like many) is finding a dealer where i can audition both with PMC's Fact 8's. My Fact 8's are currently paired with a SuperUniti, the latter being the component that I would like to upgrade over time. I was therefore planning to use the SU as a preamp paired with a NAP 250DR (second hand) or go the extra mile and pair it with a NAP 300 (second hand), get Salisbury to upgrade it to DR status. Eventually, when the wallet allows it, to replace the SU to a NAC (hoping for a new NAC release in the near future). The bottom line is: is the NAP 300DR really worth the extra wallet effort vs a NAP 250DR? Or is that underwhelming sensation in posts real? Someone help me demystify this one. Thanks!

Atlas Hyper speaker cable
Blue Heaven power chord (i live in Switzerland and could not use the UK power chord i had on the SU).

As a fellow Switzerland based hifi fan, I share your pain. Local dealers tend to be ‘if you don’t like my gear then tough luck’. It might be worth a day trip to Germany as I have found better service there. Perhaps you could get a proper demo and make a decision then. 

Interesting question and one I am unable to comment on directly.  I guess it depends upon your upgrade path and the likely timeline for doing so.  I have proven to be completely useless at sticking to plans, sometimes doing nothing for long periods and then suffering a dose of upgraditis.  I ran a 252/300 combination for quite a while and I still look back fondly with the hindsight that I could very easily have stopped there with a remarkably well balanced sound.  Curiosity eventually got the better of me but lp12/cds3/252/300 works tremendously well.  Not so sure about where the superuniti would fit in with a 300 hence I'd suggest you have a think about timeline for upgrading your pre - the 300 will probably be very underutilised in the intervening period.

Peter

Yes agreed though if I go for a 300DR swapping the SU for say a NAC272 wouldn’t be a huge effort and I don’t think I’d leave it too long. 

Demo first and as others have said, sort out the source and pre, if for example you have a 272 pre without a separate power supply you could purchase a 250DR plus a decent power supply for about the cost of a 300DR. In fact this is the route I'm taking, my next upgrade is the power supply rather than the amp. Having said that, consideration of your speakers needs to be taken into account, if they're very difficult to drive then there may be a case for 300DR. Spending before demo could equal regretting at leisure, spending after a demo means you'll get it right. Rich 

Starting from a SuperUniti means that adding a power amp is the logical way forward, unless the ultimate aim is to have a separate source and preamp. Given the Fact 8, the route I’d go is 300, 272, power supply for 272 (ideally a 555DR) and finally the DR upgrade for the 300. This ensures that the source is maximised as quickly as possible. 

I started out with a SU and my first upgrade was a new 300dr. The difference was huge. I eventually did away with the SU which was always the plan but I could have lived with the combo happily without upgrading further. I heard a 272 bare with a 300dr and it wasn’t much better than my SU with it.

connecting a 300 to a SU is a slight problem. You will need either a special cable making up if that is possible (speak to dealer or Naim) or do what I did and use a hicap. I bought the hicap because I thought I’d use it for future upgrades but never did so I wasted a bit of cash there.

I reckon the DR-300 is Naim's best value for money power amp. Absolutely cracking; and a very different beast to the 250 to these ears.

John.

Despite what some may say I have a 300 dr on the end of my Nova, it replaced a 250 dr. It’s a big step up, best value amp I have bought in the Naim range.

Drewy interesting what you say. Thanks