Bookshelf speakers - near wall challenge.

Huge posted:

Charles44 posted:

I've been using the Tablette 10 speakers since last November with an XS set up in a room about 20ft long and 10ft wide. They are about 5ft apart, on hifi racks stands, either side of a low wooden open unit with about a foot between the side of it and each speaker. Listening wise I am 6/7 feet away. So not that different to this.

I am reasonably happy with the sound although sometimes I feel it lacks depth although I have tinkered with positioning it has made no difference. There are no more compromises I can make to change either the position of the speakers or where seating is. If ever we move to a house that allows the use of a larger room I feel sure I would look at either PMC or Spendor floor standing speakers but I guess I am content for the time being.

Whatever I feel about these they are still better in my room than the PMC20/21 I sold, although I would like a bit of the depth they gave but their problem was eventually they were  bass heavy.

My experience with the Nait XS2 was that depth perspective in the sound-scape was not really one of it's many strengths.

It's not the XS2.

mpw posted:

john kent posted:

Fwiw...

I’ve got Proac Tablette 10 with naim nait 5i-2 in a small room that’s 12 x 10 feet.

I’ll say right now that it’s the best setup I’ve ever had.

The tablettes are about 10” (25 cm) from the rear wall and about 5’ (150 cm) apart and about 9’  (300 cm) from my ears...I know this isn’t ideal placement, but the proacs are just so simple to place. Best sound I’ve ever had and just as everyone says... the bass and size of the sound from these speakers is awesome.

would love to see a pic

How do i post pics on this forum?

john kent posted:

How do i post pics on this forum?

Read in FAQ  ...........  https://forums.naimaudio.com/t...web-into-your-post-1

The way I do it:     I use 'Imgur' (an open source [free] image sharing host) & upload photos to Imgur.

To attach an Imgur photo to a Naim post: In Imgur; open the photo (click on the thumbnail) & touch the 'Copy' button on the Direct Link line, or, right click the image & 'Copy Image Address'.

On the Naim post screen: Touch the Insert/edit image & paste the Imgur copy into the Source window & touch OK. The picture will appear in the post screen. You can adjust the picture size by highlighting the picture & dragging the corner blocks.

I run the Neat Iota Alphas with 82 (recapped)- hicap-2502-ndac- sotm-sms 200 streamer- Aro-LP12. I used to have sbl and and Ovator-400. I do not miss any of them! The Neats are so musical, so driven and give so much insight. Many great tests, every reviewer gest lyrical, but I think they have problems being taken seriously because of their small size. I love the design and they virtually disappear in the living room (behind my plant: )) 

Fred

FWIW.......  Others have mentioned them previously and I would also recommend giving the ProAc Signature 10 or ProAc Signature 10 Signature speakers a go.   I have heard them in a demo room and they sounded wonderful. I previously owned a pair of ProAc speakers (DB2) and do think highly of their build and sound qualities.

Good luck with your search and your decision.

Jonners posted:

Huge posted:

Most speakers have 'binding posts' that allow the use of both spade connectors and 4mm plugs at the same time.

You can make (or buy or get made) jumper leads that have a spare at one end and a 4mm plug at the other; these almost always work considerably better than the gold plated pressed brass bars that come with the speakers.

Thanks Huge, very helpful!

On my main rig with ATC SCM 19s powered by SN2, I use the Nordost Norse Series Bi-Wire Jumpers vs. the supplied connectors.  I *think* it’s made a marginal improvement, but I think the real margin created was for my dealer given they cost $160.

On the ProAc Tablette 10 Signatures powered by the NAIT 1 in the office, I just have the NAC A5 connect as banana plug and use the supplied connectors.  I put the Nordost Jumpers in this system one evening, but honestly could not tell enough of a difference to justify getting another pair of these. Perhaps it seemed disproportional on that system vs. the main rig and that biased me... but there you have it. 

And it original topic:  YES – the Tablette 10s are amazing in tough placement situations.  Enjoy with confidence that you you’ll get away with near wall placements you wouldn’t with other speakers.  I’m running them in near field listening now, which perhaps isn’t ideal either – but am still loving them.

kishekar posted:

Jonners posted:

Huge posted:

Most speakers have 'binding posts' that allow the use of both spade connectors and 4mm plugs at the same time.

You can make (or buy or get made) jumper leads that have a spare at one end and a 4mm plug at the other; these almost always work considerably better than the gold plated pressed brass bars that come with the speakers.

Thanks Huge, very helpful!

On my main rig with ATC SCM 19s powered by SN2, I use the Nordost Norse Series Bi-Wire Jumpers vs. the supplied connectors.  I *think* it’s made a marginal improvement, but I think the real margin created was for my dealer given they cost $160.

On the ProAc Tablette 10 Signatures powered by the NAIT 1 in the office, I just have the NAC A5 connect as banana plug and use the supplied connectors.  I put the Nordost Jumpers in this system one evening, but honestly could not tell enough of a difference to justify getting another pair of these. Perhaps it seemed disproportional on that system vs. the main rig and that biased me... but there you have it. 

And it original topic:  YES – the Tablette 10s are amazing in tough placement situations.  Enjoy with confidence that you you’ll get away with near wall placements you wouldn’t with other speakers.  I’m running them in near field listening now, which perhaps isn’t ideal either – but am still loving them.

Well this is really good insight! It is so easy to get carried away with expensive interconnects and so on and I was sceptical about investing hundreds of Pounds in a couple of pairs of fancy jumper leads.

I hope in my case the ATC's and ProAcs will solve my problem. In the meantime I have a halfway house by toeing in my Dyns and stuffing 2 sheets of toilet tissue in each of the rear firing ports.

Hi Jonners

I use ATC11s in a small hifi/tv room - 3.5m x 3.2m (plus alcove) -  paired with a Nova/250DR and I am very pleased with the sound. The speakers are sat on Custom Design stands with the backs of the speakers 30mm from the walls. Due to room (door) constraints one speaker is 40cm from the side wall and the other is 70cm. They are 1.6m apart with a similar distance to my listening position

 Before them I had a pair of n-Sats which I had owned from new and was very pleased with despite their lack of bass as they were just so great to listen to. In a long search for replacement speakers I did the usual journey around dealers and also had home demos of several including PMC, Dynaudio, Kudos Super 10s and ATC11 & 19s. I actually bought a pair of Neat Iotas which have many good reviews and look great in a small room but, unlike most reviewers and owners, I found them not to my listening taste. I finally bought an immaculate secondhand pair of ATC 11s and in my small room they sound excellent. My room has a carpet and soft furnishings which may heIp. I have also tried the ATC11s in our 6m x 3.5m lounge which has a wooden floor  and minimal furnishings and the sound was not ideal - room treatment would certainly be needed.

Bob

Shropshire Hills posted:

Hi Jonners

I use ATC11s in a small hifi/tv room - 3.5m x 3.2m (plus alcove) -  paired with a Nova/250DR and I am very pleased with the sound. The speakers are sat on Custom Design stands with the backs of the speakers 30mm from the walls. Due to room (door) constraints one speaker is 40cm from the side wall and the other is 70cm. They are 1.6m apart with a similar distance to my listening position

 Before them I had a pair of n-Sats which I had owned from new and was very pleased with despite their lack of bass as they were just so great to listen to. In a long search for replacement speakers I did the usual journey around dealers and also had home demos of several including PMC, Dynaudio, Kudos Super 10s and ATC11 & 19s. I actually bought a pair of Neat Iotas which have many good reviews and look great in a small room but, unlike most reviewers and owners, I found them not to my listening taste. I finally bought an immaculate secondhand pair of ATC 11s and in my small room they sound excellent. My room has a carpet and soft furnishings which may heIp. I have also tried the ATC11s in our 6m x 3.5m lounge which has a wooden floor  and minimal furnishings and the sound was not ideal - room treatment would certainly be needed.

Bob

Thanks Bob, my own suspicions are the ATC's won't be as good as my Contours which cost nearly double the price when I bought them 14 years ago but back then I had a big lounge where they could be installed in plenty of free space. Now stuffed into an alcove about 3' between them, 9" off the back wall and with one of them only 4" from a side wall they sound rubbish. In this situation, although the ATC or ProAc's may be, (according to my dealer), "inferior" - they will almost certainly out-perform the Dyns. Well, that's what I'm hoping anyway, otherwise I may as well sell up because at the moment listening to my music is not remotely enjoyable.

Jonners - I think your best approach is to home dem some speakers and compare them to your Contours and other brands. Although I am in the Midlands I had very helpful service from a Scottish dealer who posted me firstly some ex-dem Kudos Super 10s and later a pair of ATC 19s. At the same time I borrowed a pair of ATC 11s from a Midlands dealer so I was able to compare all 3 against my n-Sats and also a pair of Neat Iotas. In my small room and with a modest Naim system the ATC 11s proved to be the best choice for me. Bob

Shropshire Hills posted:

Jonners - I think your best approach is to home dem some speakers and compare them to your Contours and other brands. Although I am in the Midlands I had very helpful service from a Scottish dealer who posted me firstly some ex-dem Kudos Super 10s and later a pair of ATC 19s. At the same time I borrowed a pair of ATC 11s from a Midlands dealer so I was able to compare all 3 against my n-Sats and also a pair of Neat Iotas. In my small room and with a modest Naim system the ATC 11s proved to be the best choice for me. Bob

Thanks Shropshire Hills. I'm getting the ATC's from a dealer in Oxford and the ProAc's from one in Maidenhead.

I was interested in the Iotas as well but the ATC dealer (who also sells these, as well as Dynaudio and about 20 other Speaker brands), reckoned they'd not really stand up well, particularly against the ATC's. He was quite dismissive in fact, as he was about the PMC Twenty5.21's I was also interested in because of their forward-firing port.

The dealer I recently bought by LP12 from handles Kudos, as well as Totem and Spendor. I like the Kudos sound but they do not have anything in my budget and even if they did, they're probably not suitable for my environment.

This probably leaves Guru but although they've attracted some great reviews, they look a tad odd! 

This is proac/naim in my secondary system in the Den...it sounds soooo good just like this!

Looks very nice John and from the look of it the Tablettes are a compact size, certainly smaller than my Contours anyway. Mind you, I'll be nearer to side walls but hope that toeing in a tad will help to minimise reflections.

Jonners posted:

Looks very nice John and from the look of it the Tablettes are a compact size, certainly smaller than my Contours anyway. Mind you, I'll be nearer to side walls but hope that toeing in a tad will help to minimise reflections.

They're tiny - literally the size of a shoebox I was doubtful i'd be happy with them at fist...but the sound is big and absolutely beautiful.

The size of a Linn Kan I assume. They are the only speaker that, every time I see them, I want some. I’d love to hear them on the end of my electronics. They seem perfect. 

Hi,

Another warm endorsement of Guru QM10 MkIIs. I've had the first version as well. They match with Naim extra-ordinarily well and are designed for the inside corner to be two inches from the wall. They are now back in production and the chap from Stockholm Audio is very helpful. I use mine with Tellurium Q which I found to be an improvement on NACA5 in my system.  They sound better on stands. They don't sound like many other speakers.

As someone wisely noted, the MkIIs go louder than the first model.  Mine get to 60 on the SU volume with a CB NAP 250 and, unless your aim is to render peoples' intestines into glue, that's plenty loud.

There's a blue LED that activates if they think you're over-driving them which is useful during, eg, wakes.

hungryhalibut posted:

The size of a Linn Kan I assume. They are the only speaker that, every time I see them, I want some. I’d love to hear them on the end of my electronics. They seem perfect. 

They will sound immense on the end of a 300dr, Proac even do maple just saying

Donkeyhaute posted:

Hi,

 

Another warm endorsement of Guru QM10 MkIIs. I've had the first version as well. They match with Naim extra-ordinarily well and are designed for the inside corner to be two inches from the wall. They are now back in production and the chap from Stockholm Audio is very helpful. I use mine with Tellurium Q which I found to be an improvement on NACA5 in my system.  They sound better on stands. They don't sound like many other speakers.

As someone wisely noted, the MkIIs go louder than the first model.  Mine get to 60 on the SU volume with a CB NAP 250 and, unless your aim is to render peoples' intestines into glue, that's plenty loud.

There's a blue LED that activates if they think you're over-driving them which is useful during, eg, wakes.

 

 

The Gurus have had great reviews for sure but hasn't the company suffered some financial strife? There only appears to be one outlet for Guru in the UK where I live now and it's a fair distance away from where I live. It used to be Tom Tom Audio but there's no evidence of them on their website so I am guessing they've parted company.

Are they designed for a stand? They look pretty tiny to me, almost like a monitor or bookshelf speaker.

Jonners posted:

[…] They look pretty tiny to me, almost like a monitor or bookshelf speaker.

Hi,

if I got this right QM stands for Quality Monitor and yes, they work on a bookshelf, just like the OP asked for.

And just like Donkeyhaute wrote, they don’t sound like most other speakers. I have just packed the demo pair and had a nice time with them. Not exactly what I am looking for, but pretty good and worth an audition.