Earth loop issue?

Posted by: Finkfan on 12 November 2018

Last night for the first time in weeks I had the chance to sit and listen to some music. As I approached my system to insert a CD I noticed my HCDR humming, not unusual, but also my system has developed a buzz from the speakers. It’s low level but audible none the less. It wasn’t present a month ago. The only changes I made a few weeks ago is splitting my system between 2 racks, brawn and brain, placing the napsc on the floor and upgrading my XPS Burndy to an SXPS. I didn’t notice any buzz when I fired up the system then. The buzzing does stop if I remove the mains cable from any of the black boxes (555ps, HicapDR, 250DR). It also stops if I remove any one link between the boxes (din-din, Burndy, Snaic, din-XLR). Removing the Napsc from the system makes no difference.

I spent the hour I had swapping cables for spares I have (din-din, Burndy, din-XLR), but buzz remains each and every time. 

My system is CDX2/555ps, 282/Napsc/HCDR, 250DR

Id be very grateful for any possible solutions. 

Posted on: 13 November 2018 by Finkfan

Thanks Bryce. Will give that a go too 

Posted on: 13 November 2018 by Finkfan

I tried switching output socket of the CDX2 but unfortunately this made no difference. 

I do have continuity between the outer ring of the rca terminals and the earth pin on the mains plug. 

The buzz is low level with CDX2 connected. Gone when disconnected. After disconnecting and re connecting the buzz appears slightly quieter. It’s now audible when the 282 is muted (ear against speaker ) but not when Un muted (the usual hiss is louder)  I’ve not tried the CDX2 self powered again yet, but will if I get the chance  

 

Posted on: 14 November 2018 by Finkfan

This evening I had wenger2015 over for a listen. The buzz remains whatever I do with the system. Tried different plug in sequence, buzz. Tried all on a 4 way extension lead, buzz. Tried the extension lead on the office ring, buzz. The only things I have left to try is moving the 282 further away from the brawn rack which I’ll try on the weekend. After that, I’ll take the CDX2 over Wengers and see if it makes his system buzz. 

Posted on: 14 November 2018 by wenger2015

It’s certainly a ‘head scratcher’ .....  Finkfan.....

the good news  ....is your system sounds extremely good despite .... 

Posted on: 15 November 2018 by james n

Sorry to hear this still hasn't gone. The CDX2 seems to be the common factor here so it'll be interesting to see what you find when tried in another system.

I take it nothing else has changed since you split the system - you mention the buzz wasn't there to start with when first split. Any new electrical products, (even lights) in your listening room etc ?

Posted on: 15 November 2018 by Finkfan

Morning James

No new additions or changes anywhere. I didn’t notice the buzz when I first split the system. But, the buzz is masked by the usual hiss from the speakers. I only noticed the buzz as, for some reason, I’d muted the 282, so no hiss, but a low level buzz. It doesn’t impact on the sound fortunately, and I could live with it I guess. But i know it shouldn’t be there so I’d like to find and fix the issue. 

Posted on: 15 November 2018 by Richard Dane

Finkfan, was the CDX2 new or secondhand?  If the latter, I wonder whether it had the signal to earth lifted - this may have ben done by a dealer or Naim, as it's an approved mod if two sources with signal to earth connection are in the system.   If not, then maybe it's an option to lift the signal earth connection to see if that cures the buzz.

Posted on: 15 November 2018 by Finkfan

Morning Richard

The CDX2 was second hand and Unmodified. Ive had the player for 2 1/2 years now and I never heard the buzz when connected to my 5i, SN or 272/250 and I didn’t hear it when I first connected up the 282/HCDR. It’s the only thing connected to the 282. As long as lifting the signal ground doesn’t impact on performance this may be my only option. 

Posted on: 15 November 2018 by james n

Just one more thing Finkfan - have you tried connecting the CDX2 to another input on the 282 ?

Posted on: 15 November 2018 by Richard Dane

OK thanks Finkfan.  Trying a different input, as recommended by James, is a good idea, just to see whether it's a fault with the currently used input. 

Posted on: 15 November 2018 by Finkfan

Yeah, tried all the dins and RCA’s. 

Posted on: 16 November 2018 by wenger2015

Finkfan,

Have you made any progress in solving this problem?

If not, you are welcome to bring your Cdx2 over to mine and connect up to my system... it might well help with trying to pinpoint just what the problem is? 

Posted on: 16 November 2018 by Finkfan

Still buzzing away here Wenger. I’ve completely disconnected and reconnected everything this morning. No change. The second the CDX2 is connected to the system the buzz starts. Will bring it over on Sunday if I can. It’s a real head scratcher! 

Posted on: 17 November 2018 by NickSeattle

My CD5X “caused” hum when first added to my system. I was told, politey, by my dealer that it was more likely “exposing an issue elsewhere”,  which turned out to be true — my CATV system was buggy.

Your experience seems to differ from mine, though.  

Good luck with it.  Interested in how it works out.

Nick

Posted on: 18 November 2018 by Finkfan

Very quick update

tried CDX2 in Wenger2015s system. No buzz. Only thing left to try now is 282/HCDR 

Posted on: 18 November 2018 by wenger2015
Finkfan posted:

Very quick update

tried CDX2 in Wenger2015s system. No buzz. Only thing left to try now is 282/HCDR 

Pleased after trying the 282/HCDR each can now be eliminated from the equation.....

its a head scratcher Finkfan.....??

Posted on: 18 November 2018 by Finkfan

Yep! 

Will reasemble the system later and check all cables, connections and dressing 

Posted on: 19 November 2018 by Davie R

interesting i had the same problem. i don't have a clue how computers work. my wife as a computer in her office up stairs put the router is down stair the router uses the mains earth to send the signal to the computer up stairs. this caused my nap 200 to hum. l put a dedicated earth with 5 earth poles. and it stopped the problem.i already had a dedicated mains using two cables 

Posted on: 19 November 2018 by ChrisSU
Davie R posted:

interesting i had the same problem. i don't have a clue how computers work. my wife as a computer in her office up stairs put the router is down stair the router uses the mains earth to send the signal to the computer up stairs. this caused my nap 200 to hum. l put a dedicated earth with 5 earth poles. and it stopped the problem.i already had a dedicated mains using two cables 

I’m not exactly sure what a ‘dedicated earth with 5 poles’ is, but wouldn’t it have been easier to run an Ethernet cable to the computer?

Posted on: 20 November 2018 by Davie R

sorry chrissu i should of said earth rod .a dedicated earth is a earth cable from the consumer unit  to a earth rod out side buried in the garden

Posted on: 20 November 2018 by ChrisSU
Davie R posted:

sorry chrissu i should of said earth rod .a dedicated earth is a earth cable from the consumer unit  to a earth rod out side buried in the garden

I thought you probably meant something like that, so perhaps more hassle than putting in an Ethernet cable, but I guess there are other benefits to having a decent earth. Personally I would still favour elimination to mitigation where possible.