Dynaudio fans (evoke)

Bouba-

The evoke range has only been announced, but not yet released, so you won't hear any who has heard them ( I think I like them for the size of the 30 and hopefully price - I don't think I can/want to stretch to the contour 30. I'm trying to get to a no upgrade system. I do like my harbeth 30.1 but they can be a bit too polite , also they can get a bit congested on large scale music (not what I usually listen to - but still want them to work with orchestra/ large scale. I have to say, the special 40 did sound terrific, even the bass output for the size, but I know I want a full range . Also the finish is gorgeous - a nice + 

benjy posted:

Bouba-

The evoke range has only been announced, but not yet released, so you won't hear any who has heard them ( I think I like them for the size of the 30 and hopefully price - I don't think I can/want to stretch to the contour 30. I'm trying to get to a no upgrade system. I do like my harbeth 30.1 but they can be a bit too polite , also they can get a bit congested on large scale music (not what I usually listen to - but still want them to work with orchestra/ large scale. I have to say, the special 40 did sound terrific, even the bass output for the size, but I know I want a full range . Also the finish is gorgeous - a nice + 

Not sure how large your room is but my C20 fill my 24’x16’ room and satisfy my love of low end. I listen to mostly rock but the C20 supply more than enough for me. I bought my C20 secondhand at a nice price with the idea of if I liked them to get C30. Going on 2 years now with my C20 and haven’t really given C30 much thought. 

Oh iI see . So If I should sum up your thoughts, the Dyn are generally fun speakers then, with solid low end depending the range. 

I live in an apartment and my kit is located into the 25m2 living so I can’t afford having speakers eating up my living space. Hence my current sélection of speakers.  I also have a second Atom feeding the various speakers I mentioned above in an office room, depending on my current mood. 

could you please tell which of my current speakers would be the closest match vs Dynaudio’s sound ? I love the PM1s currently playing on the living’s Atom. 

Just curious about how the Dyns would compare vs my own various speakers (if some of you already owned/listened to one or several of those with naim) 

Bouba posted:

I've never had the chance to properly listen to a pair of Dynaudio (quite badly distributed in France actually). Could anyone honestly give me some insight about what's the typical recent Dynaudio sound is like ? I own B&W speakers (PM1 for instance), some Leemas (both the Xero and One floorstanders, very "in-your face"), Dali Menuet latest incarnation (very sweet top-end and really astonishingly convincing bass given their tiny dimensions), and finally I also had the Kef LS50 (the passive original version black/rose-orange cone), these were sold long time ago. 

So how would compare the standmounters from the current Excite or newly released Evoke range versus the aforementioned speakers. I know only my ears could give me a idea about the Dynaudio sound but I'd like to have opinions (honest and unbiased if possible) before being able to actually be able to listen a pair

Dynaudio would sound closer to your Dali speakers. I own Dali and Dynaudio, the Dali’s sound warmer, Dynaudios more neutral. 

analogmusic posted:

looks like the update or replacement for the passive focus series of speakers.

there was a gap between the excite range and the contour range, so keen to audition the new speakers.

Was told this line replaces both Excite and Focus. 

Just looked at a recent catalog -their is an all new line of passive focus speakers coming out including an esotar3 tweeter, priced above the contour line. The evoke seems to "slot in" just above the excite line, so it looks like it is the replacement for them. The  evoke line uses a new "cerotar" speaker which is probably less expensive than the esotar, but hopefully has the same characteristics.

benjy posted:

Just looked at a recent catalog -their is an all new line of passive focus speakers coming out including an esotar3 tweeter, priced above the contour line. The evoke seems to "slot in" just above the excite line, so it looks like it is the replacement for them. The  evoke line uses a new "cerotar" speaker which is probably less expensive than the esotar, but hopefully has the same characteristics.

 

Confidence is above Contour and there is a new Confidence line coming this year. 

benjy posted:

Just looked at a recent catalog -their is an all new line of passive focus speakers coming out including an esotar3 tweeter, priced above the contour line. The evoke seems to "slot in" just above the excite line, so it looks like it is the replacement for them. The  evoke line uses a new "cerotar" speaker which is probably less expensive than the esotar, but hopefully has the same characteristics.

 

Those won't be called Focus. That's the new Confidence range (20, 30, 50, 60). The entry level Confidence 20 monitor will be priced above the largest Contour floor stander. The 20, 30, 50 replace – roughly speaking, price-wise – the outgoing Confidence C1, C2, C4.

I heard the prototype of the 60 a few months ago and it sounds and looks amazing, but will be about $45K US.

I was quite pleased when I saw this thread and looked them up as there's a new light wood finish that would have been ideal. But, if the prices are really as I have seen, they don't look very competitive. Really, when you look at what's in a speaker, especially at this level, you've got to wonder how they come up with those prices.

Bang for the buck the Contour 30s and 60s are pretty hard to beat. Gets you the Esotar 2 teeter with an overall performance level which must be amongst the best at their price point. They are a massive improvement on the original Contours and I find the 60 to have really excellent synergy with NAP 300.

The one potential quirk with these speakers, I find, is that they need space to breathe and placement/toe in is critical. Once you get this right though, they deliver the goods and soundstage/focus is excellent. Not wanting to spend anywhere near £15k on a set of speakers, I am extremely happy with them.

Sorry - for ‘teeter’ I meant of course ‘tweeter’. 

Quote straight from Otto one of the Dynaudio Product Managers;

“The tweeter uses a combination of technologies from the Esotar Forty tweeter in Special Forty, and the Esotar3 tweeter in the new Confidence, albeit with a ferrite magnet. Personally, I think it gives Special Forty and Contour a run for their money.”

My questions and his responses;

It's not really a linear progression at this point. From a technical standpoint it's a bit back and forth, and a lot depends more on the balance/tuning of details in the construction, than simply "improving" something. Measurably, Evoke tweeter is more linear than both, with lower resonance frequency, but has less sensitivity. In the end, it just sounds really good (biased as I am), and that's difficult to explain in specs, or even plain words. You need to listen for yourself.
Please keep in mind that the end result depends on much more than just the tweeter itself, the same tweeter will sound different depending on cabinet and crossover, as well as the woofer it is partnered with.

Depending on which Focus model you own, I'd argue Evoke is a "next level", but they're not direct replacements of each size category so there's definitely room for subjective opinion. As a previous Focus owner myself, I'd take an Evoke any day - but again I'm biased.
Midrange in the Evoke 50 is basically straight from the Contour 60, which makes it a lot better than any of the ones used in Focus. Same caveats apply regarding implementation, so that's not to say the end result is exactly like a Contour, I'm just making the point that the hardware with regards to woofers is a clear step up from Focus. I'd be perfectly happy if you argue that the tweeter in itself is more of a sidestep (theoretically - subjectively is TBD of course). But if you want to nitpick tweeter construction, you should do the same for the woofers... That's where the most significant improvements of the Evoke is buried.

Prices not hard to find:

Evoke 10 (£1250) is a compact two-way standmount speaker with a 14cm long-throw woofer. Like all new Evoke models, it features Dynaudio’s new 28mm Cerotar tweeter with the new Hexis inner dome.

Evoke 20 (£1800) is the larger of the two Evoke stand-mounted speakers. This two-way design pairs the 28mm Cerotar tweeter and Hexis with an 18cm long-throw woofer.

Evoke 30 (£2900) is a compact 2.5-way floorstander. Under one metre tall, it has two 14cm long-throw woofers and the 28mm Cerotar tweeter featuring the Hexis inner dome to make for some serious presence.

Evoke 50 (£3900) is a large three-way floor-standing loudspeaker. The biggest loudspeaker of the Evoke line, it combines a single 15cm midrange driver with a pair of 18cm long-throw woofers and the Cerotar tweeter, fitted with the Hexis.

Evoke 25C (£1100) is a 2.5-way centre channel speaker comprising two 14cm long-throw woofers, as well as the range’s Cerotar tweeter (and Hexis), ensuring sonic parity in Evoke multi-channel systems.

Only thing is I'm looking for U.S. prices - I understand the prices you posted include vat also (I saw a list showing both) . Either way their website shows April as the release worldwide, and (technically) I'm not looking for a new speaker (so far just wishing).

Callas01 posted:

analogmusic posted:

looks like the update or replacement for the passive focus series of speakers.

there was a gap between the excite range and the contour range, so keen to audition the new speakers.

Was told this line replaces both Excite and Focus. 

Thanks for the detailed post on the feedback from Dynaudio.  I am a bit cautious at this point as their press releases are a bit over the top in terms of bigging  up the new range.  No surprise, I would be doing the same, but it would be unusual for a company to produce a mid price product (which the Evoke is in hifi Speaker terms) and for it to instantly make more expensive products redundant.  The Special 40 has to retain an advantage, I suspect, even though the Evoke talk makes it sound comparable.  However, it might provide a cost effective alternative to my Focus 160s, if it really is an all round improvement rather than just a sideways step.

I remain quite pleased eith my Focus 260. That said, I think I want to take them to my local dealer and do a three way shootout: Focus 260 vs. Evoke 50 vs. Contour C30.

 I've done extensive listening of Focus 260 vs. Special Forty vs. C30; C30 is a clear upgrade, S40 is not.

benjy posted:

Only thing is I'm looking for U.S. prices - I understand the prices you posted include vat also (I saw a list showing both) . Either way their website shows April as the release worldwide, and (technically) I'm not looking for a new speaker (so far just wishing).

The US price for the new Evoke line should be about the same as the UK price.  Thus, a pair of Evoke 20 speakers should be about the same as a pair of Esotar 2 110 tweeters which is $ 1700.

NJB posted:

Callas01 posted:

analogmusic posted:

looks like the update or replacement for the passive focus series of speakers.

there was a gap between the excite range and the contour range, so keen to audition the new speakers.

Was told this line replaces both Excite and Focus. 

Thanks for the detailed post on the feedback from Dynaudio.  I am a bit cautious at this point as their press releases are a bit over the top in terms of bigging  up the new range.  No surprise, I would be doing the same, but it would be unusual for a company to produce a mid price product (which the Evoke is in hifi Speaker terms) and for it to instantly make more expensive products redundant.  The Special 40 has to retain an advantage, I suspect, even though the Evoke talk makes it sound comparable.  However, it might provide a cost effective alternative to my Focus 160s, if it really is an all round improvement rather than just a sideways step.

Similarly to you, I own Focus 260s. Are the Evoke speakers an upgrade or a sideways move?  I find it interesting as the same person discussed the Focus line saying the T380 tweeter could really be considered an Esotar1 tweeter because the 1st part (T3) uses the Esotar2 design (same shape, neo magnet, precision coating, etc)  but the back chamber (80) is from the D280 Esotec design. Now the Cerotar tweeter uses essentially the D280 design with improvements of the larger yoke taken from the Special 40 and the Hexis taken from the Esotar3 tweeter.  So is the Cerotar or T380 the better tweeter?  Or equal? I’m sure both have advantages in some areas as Otto eludes to by saying in linear terms it does. But trust your ears. 

There is something to be said that they took the exact mid-range off the C60 and added it to the E50, and the new woofer designs they’ve been using, haven’t heard them except in the Excites, but these newest ones aren’t Excite drivers either, so it would be good to hear the newest evolution. 

Then how much improvement is there if the entry level Focus tower was $4900 and the top Evoke tower is $5200-5500?

However I have to ask myself, would I want Evoke 50 or Contour 30? Really comes down to listening. Although I like the finish and design of the Contours more, the Evoke would have to sound really special. 

DynFan160 posted:

I remain quite pleased eith my Focus 260. That said, I think I want to take them to my local dealer and do a three way shootout: Focus 260 vs. Evoke 50 vs. Contour C30.

 I've done extensive listening of Focus 260 vs. Special Forty vs. C30; C30 is a clear upgrade, S40 is not.

Thanks! That’s what I was figuring. 

My own (supposed) shoot-out would be between contour 30 and evoke 30. Both seem to "fit" my room better than the larger models.From what I've seen the contour finish is nicer, but the evoke price is far more palatable. I do wonder about either speakers rear port. Unfortunately it would fire right at my tt(lp12) on a wall shelf. The set-up is pretty much unchangeable - my harbeths are front-firing.