Upgradeitis strikes - but which way should I go?

I think you have covered most bases, I would say you have quite a nicely balanced system and I think you have correctly identified you will need to spend a fair bit to get appreciably better. If you want to stay with cd, then the cdx2 is a really good CD player. The speakers are an obvious one to look at for more bass.....your 20A,s would be a good audition.My only add would be to hear a NAP300, it’s rather special and your system could handle and benefit from its speed and control.

Hi Svetty

Of the options you've outlined, I'd be inclined to try replacing your Hi-Cap with a SuperCap.  I still vividly remember the moment when I was at my dealer's demoing a 282 and he swapped out a HC for a SC.  It was one of those 'wow' moments as the extra detail and significant expansion of the soundstage hit me. And that was all of about 20 seconds into the track played! That was also how long it took me to decide I had to have a SuperCap.

Easy - you like Kudos then you’ll love the S20s.  If not SC the 282. 

Regards,

Lindsay

I used to have a similar system but non-dr hicap and 250 (and Dynaudio speakers). At that time a SC was an amazing uppgrade over HC, just so much more musical! A 555ps is a revelation on a cdx2 bringing speed and drive in abundance, but since you seak seperation and flow my best bett is between a CDS3 and a SC, ideally both...

I think getting a used CDS3 would be my first move in your clothes.

Svetty posted:

A. DR the XPS

B. 555PS

C. SCDR

D. SCDR + 252 (expensive)

E. Speakers (perhaps super 20As?? - would need to be oak veneer which excludes quite a few options)

F. Something else - ?? settle for a 2nd HCDR

 

Between options A and B, I would recommend B. I may be missing something, but the XPS is the one Naim product (that I've heard) that I've never quite got. In both the older XPS2 and newer XPS-DR guises, the improvements that it brings about have always felt small, especially given the cost. The DR version is better, and you should hear an improvement. But the 555 is really in a different league. Though considerably more expensive than the XPS, I feel that it offers far greater value for money. The non-DR version of the 555 is better than the DR version of the XPS. Since you concentrate your listening to CD, it seems logical to get the most out of your CDX2.

Never tried options C-F, so it's possible that they might offer more than B. Others may be in a better position to comment.

If I may also throw in option G, namely an nDAC, which should be available second-hand at a reasonable price. It's another way of upgrading your CDX2, plus it might provide a useful upgrade for your TV viewing. I am using CDX2/nDAC/PS555 (non-DR) on the DAC. If your budget runs to a second-hand nDAC and non-DR PS555, that might be the best solution. The one caveat - a second-hand non-DR PS555 is now likely to be close to an age that it will need a service. But if you go the second-hand route, then get a service and maybe even the DR upgrade, it is still the most cost-effective price of admission to the world of the 555.

I think adding the nDAC is a good shout here, or even other similarly talented DACs could be considered.  I think standalone DACs these days represent some great value for money anyway, but if you have several components with a digital out, such as TVs, bluray players, USB sticks, or even phone, and dare I say even a PC/MAC, that you wish to use with your amp and speakers, you can plug them all in the same digital hub, and it makes them all sound great.  Amazing!  Not necessarily all absolutely as great as each other, but still pretty damn cool.  Plus the DAC would potentially perform the same miracles if a streamer makes it into the equation in the future.  Gets my vote, but I'd be sorely tempted to get some S20As as well, just to make sure.  

A second HCDR and the DR upgrade to the XPS might be as far as you need to go without an upgrade to the speakers. A second HC was very good when I had my 282 - a (pleasant) surprise given some views posted on the forum. I was also amazed at the improvement an XPSDR (ex demo) gave over the XPS2. Again I was initially sceptical - but 10 mins had me warming up my flexible friend. 

I think there can be a bit too much emphasis on front end without giving consideration to speakers. No doubt that even a £1000 pair will respond to front end improvements - you’ll hear the difference. However are you getting the best bang for your buck. This might seem simplistic but expenditure wise I have kept everything broadly in balance. So now I have (in terms of Naim) 5 boxes which sort of average £4.5k each. I then have £5k speakers - Kef Ref 1 - my final splash of the cash. I loved the previous, cheaper, PMC Gb1i’s - and they showed the step improvements - but the Kef’s are in a different league and complete my set up.

Your system is well balanced as others have said. Personally a better front end (CDS3) or pre (power supply and/or 252) would be my preference. A good dealer is your friend in this situation.

Stu

I would definitely upgrade the speakers first get as big a driver and speaker as your room allows and go from there. 

A nice used CD555 with a 555PSDR is the best value for money upgrade... there is one in ebay i guess..

Hi Svetty.

I would buy myself some mourish and expensive red wine and after a few sips, you will forget you even started this thread. Second best, apparently down grading is now ‘ the new upgrading’ ....... ????

ATB Peter

Downgraditis indeed. Until the Nait 1.

It can be hard given the upgrade options naim offer..... source first would be a reasonable principle so I would see if you can find a dealer with a used cds3 - in my view a delightful upgrade from a cdx2. 

Building a solid relationship with your local dealer is very worthwhile as they often take tradeins which removes the risk of buying second hand privately. 

Good luck and be careful not to upgrade for the sake of it as you know one upgrade is never enough.... Naim’s products have that beguiling ability to make you think “I wonder what the next upgrade will sounds like” after about 5 minutes of enjoying the one you just made ????

cheers 

Gary

Not sure how I managed to highlight that sentence and increase font size.....

I started from a similar position to your own - differences being speakers and additionally I had an LP12 as well as CDX2/XPSDR.

I chose to replace  the HCDR with an SCDR on the basis that both sources would benefit. Big improvement in detail and soundstage - the kind of improvement I had, hitherto, assumed would need a 300 instead of 250DR (having never heard either the SCDR or 300).

Worth talking to your dealer, as I did, to get an SCDR on loan for a bit. Its important to hear it because not everybody appreciates an SCDR on a 282. 

Have recently replaced CDX2 with NDX2 (retaining XPSDR). Another WOW moment for me.

One other thing - in my experience the CDX2 benefits enormously from being on a Fraim... something else to consider if you don’t have Fraim.

Svetty, The SuperCap is a really good step forward to get the most from your 282. If you don’t have good shelving with Naim glass, cups and balls your electronics won’t thrive. The SuperCap is very sensitive to other power supplies and possibly even the 300 head unit. I now have empty shelves effectively above and below mine although just having it at the top would achieve the same. I can’t overstress the importance of this as otherwise signals get messed up sometimes quite subtly. Although I have a 252 now, I might well have stuck with my 282 if I had got this sorted. Needless to say the 252 is much better than 282.

Like others I can recommend the 555 (DR) although I play my CDX2 through nDAC mainly because I like to listen to tv through my system just using AQ Forest toslink. Quite frankly much better value for money than streaming specially as the boxes (apart from 555) can be picked up second hand at good prices.

Phil

However I'm not in the position to buy an nDac - TT needs updating first, the aspect of having many ports on the nDac has always been a big benefit over the Chord - and many other Dac's - offerings in my humble opinion.

I have a couple of computers in my home office, and a bunch of RPi based streamers and the nDac would be the easiest solution without a doubt. For my kids it would also be brilliant: many gaming consoles still have an optical out, our Apple TV has an optical out, the TV has only coax, the htpc has optical out. It is just a very useful / usable dac!

Would be - unfortunately (yet)

When I demoed a supercap against a hicap in the shop prior to taking it to try at home a pair of Kudos C2s were used, I though the bass sounded muddy, until the supercap was applied which cleaned it up nicely. I've not heard the C10s and being stand mounts they might not have this character but a supercap is worth a listen at home anyway. My other option was a 555ps (non DR) on the CDX2 and this is what I decided to do first as my own speakers didn't need the bass cleaning up and I did rather like what it did to the CDX2.

You say you want to get into streaming but not yet, and you have stayed with CD because you don’t like faffing with networks. Answering Your question with a question: have you considered streaming from your own store to music without a network? Or rather just using the network for backup purposes to the NAS that I note you have. 

You could use something like an Innuos Zen/Zenith, Melco or maybe Uniti Core, to both store and play your music, feeding directly (i.e. not streaming across a network) to a DAC, whether nDAC or something else like Hugo etc. Then you could rip all your CDs and get rid of the CD player, to just stream from your own local store easily, conveniently and potentially with better sound quality...

If something like that would fit as a goal then that may help focus your upgrade thoughts at this point. Anathema to some, but you could even rip your LPs to eventually dispose of the turntable (vinyl sound preserved, and with no risk of gradual degradation, cleaning,, stylus replacement, etc...).

Thanks for your thoughts everyone. With an eye on budget has anyone any direct experience of 2 x DR'd Hi-caps vs an un-DR's Supercap on the 282. I wonder how much the 'precision' of the DR upgrade influences the power supply vs the sheer grunt of the SC? I assume the DR'd SC is the optimal solution but it's another 1500 quid over an un-modified SC and given that a good proportion of the SC is wasted with a 282 I'm kind-of hoping that the benefit of the full fat DR'd SC isn't blatantly better. (Yes I know I should try it for myself..... )

Svetty posted:

Thanks for your thoughts everyone. With an eye on budget has anyone any direct experience of 2 x DR'd Hi-caps vs an un-DR's Supercap on the 282. I wonder how much the 'precision' of the DR upgrade influences the power supply vs the sheer grunt of the SC? I assume the DR'd SC is the optimal solution but it's another 1500 quid over an un-modified SC and given that a good proportion of the SC is wasted with a 282 I'm kind-of hoping that the benefit of the full fat DR'd SC isn't blatantly better. (Yes I know I should try it for myself..... )

The SuperCap makes the step to the 252 easier. Just keep your eye out on the SH market.

Phil

Why don't you get a sub?Agood one will give you what you want, and would probably cost less than other recommended upgrades.

That’s an easy one:

1. Upgrade you’re CD player (head unit and/or ps)

2. Upgrade your speakers. Kudos 505 or 606. 

//Jonas