LP12 Home service advice.

If I remover correctly the screws to arm-board tension is quite critical and must not be too tight.

Yes that is correct Geko and my very old LP12 Export armboard is in need of replacing as it isn't perfectly flat anymore.

Well adjusting the big grommets at the top of the springs was a quite tedious job getting that bounce correct is tricky. 

When I fired the deck up prior to any adjustments after a couple of tracks the belt kept coming off (which does need replacing) and I couldn't remember if I'd replaced it the same way anyway after about 30 minutes of grommet fiddling and reversing the belt all is sounding excellent. I left the platter turning for over an hour and the belt is firmly in place.

I do resent the £50 asking price Linn ask for a belt and might try another has anyone tried a Vinyl Passion or a Thakker belt?

Finally sourced a mint looking armboard cut for an Aro so that my slightly larger off centre hole that I need to accomodate my FR12 tonearm can be drilled around the existing Aro sized hole. I've also managed to bag a new style motor which is already fitted to a five bolt top plate with the pulley and belt guide also attached so I have some work to do either this weekend or next.

I may well wait for a new plinth that has the corner brace needed to accomodate the 5th bolt on my top plate when the only thing left of my 'Red Button' LP12 will be the FR12 and the bonded subchasis. I may well just add some home made corner braces to my existing plinth whilst I'm waiting for a decent used plinth though.

I wonder if it was my old Aro board you acquired...

Yes bracing the plinth your self is easy enough ...plywood and gorilla glue are your friend...and mat black car paint ( if it's a black ash plinth ) works well

Don't forget to just nip up the 5th bolt very lightly when your brace is done ...the idea is to just stop any rattle ..not to bolt the top plate right in that corner

Yes JAPTIMSCARLET I think it was your Aro board I still haven't got around to cutting it though although it will definitely fit my FR12.

Yesterday I fitted a new top plate and motor to my 'Trigger's Broom' LP12 and have just part exchanged my old top plate and motor for a Black Ash corner braced plinth. The only thing remaining from the original after that will be the FR12 the bonded Subchasis and the inner and outer platter oh and the feet!

Bob the Builder posted:

Yes JAPTIMSCARLET I think it was your Aro board I still haven't got around to cutting it though although it will definitely fit my FR12.

Is it not best that the armboard is new, so that nuts and bolts are biting together for the first time?

Getting new Aro armboards is easier said than done these days

But I think Bob T B was checking first if it was feasible to mod the armboard to fit and a used one is fine for that

Linn now use slightly longer screws with little washers to stop them "pushing " the top surface up slightly. ( There is no nuts as such involved in the wood joint ...and the arm fixings are just in a compression mod)

That gives the option of making sure the screws are nice and firm... As of course a drop of superglue on the already formed wooden threads does too.

I do have a slightly unusual arm and don't think Linn supply an armboard to take it anymore and so will have to cut one myself and the one I got from JAPTIMSCARLET was very reasonably priced but I wouldn't want to practice on a new £70 Linn Armboard.

The LP12 is a very, very simple design and is held together with no more than a dozen fixings it can be stripped down and reassembled in minutes rather than hours it isn't a Ferrari although there is a skill involved in getting it put together correctly but like anything this will come with practice and patience. 

Apart from cutting the armboard it would be very hard to do irreversible damage to an LP12 yes you may not have it sounding it's best but with practice you will and it is a very satisfying process. When I first got mine I was scared to even change a stylus and took it into my local tech every time but last weekend I changed top plates which involves a total strip down and last night I tweaked the suspension and got the top plate level with the plinth and it sounds fantastic.

Bob the Builder posted:

I do resent the £50 asking price Linn ask for a belt ....

Me too. I've just bought a £6.99 one to try from Amazon.

Christopher_M posted:

Bob the Builder posted:

I do resent the £50 asking price Linn ask for a belt ....

Me too. I've just bought a £6.99 one to try from Amazon.

Please let us know how you get on.

There is a feeling , supported by Peter at Cymbiosis that the LP12 doesn't go out of tune by itself if left ...or at least not quickly

I never noticed mine dropping in sound quality...but pretty much always noted a marked increase in sound quality after I'd set it up ( yet again) 

This was fun at first.. but becomes tiring after a while and was the main reason for selling on my Aro / lp12... I simply got bored with the constant fiddling with it to get the last few percent of sound out of it .

4 sets of springs to pick the best ones... 5 belts ..4 sets of bushes ..upgraded top plate / 4 x sub chassis / arm board / bearing oil / mat / 3 x power supply .... The list goes on and on ...

I think you can get hung up trying to get that last few %. Earlier this year I bought an old 'Red Button' variant from a guy who lived in an old signalman's cottage on the Eastbourne to Brighton railway line and to get there it was a couple of minutes walk from the car crossing over the line.

Really nice guy offered me a G&T it was a beautiful and hot sunny day so afterwards I had to carry this 40 year old deck back across the railway and to the car after a very large G&T. I then stuck it in the car and drove it through the Sussex downs bouncing up and down on the back seat then after about 30 mins I got home connected it up and it sounded fantastic.

Since then I have made a few changes just for my own fun and to 'tinker' with it and though performance has improved the enjoyment I get from it has remained the same because the LP12 is really enjoyable and lots of fun to listen to the problems come when people try and turn it it an 'Audiophile' record player because it isn't.  By trying to extract finer and finer levels of detail from it you just end up taking all the fun out of it.

The difference between a properly set up LP12, and one that isn't, is so much more than just hearing more detail...

The last few percent are where the "magic" happens, and that's what makes the whole thing worthwhile, IMHO.

Monster posted:

The difference between a properly set up LP12, and one that isn't, is so much more than just hearing more detail...

The last few percent are where the "magic" happens, and that's what makes the whole thing worthwhile, IMHO.

 

 

 

Well of course it's open to interpretation and I'm talking on a personal level here and yes a properly set up LP12 is optimal of course as a badly set up deck won't sound good  but  getting caught up in trying to turn the LP12 from a fun and let's face it quite coloured sounding deck into something it is not by trying to ring every last detail out of it isn't fun for me  because instead of enjoying what a well set up LP12 sounds like you  can find yourself listening to how it sounds rather than just enjoying the way it plays music.

The main thing I'm talking about is in this thread is teaching yourself how to set up and mod your own LP12 otherwise I can see how it would become a drag and know from experience it can become quite expensive too if you have to disconnect it, pack it up and drive it to your dealer each time you want something done.  Like the guy tinkering away with his bike tinkering away with a deck can be extremely enjoyable and very rewarding too and if you are happy with sound it makes each time you work on it happy days.

When I do get my deck to a point where I'm happy with it I would like a professional tech to set it up properly of course but unless they are coming to my house to set it up I can't see the point as surely the drive home will negate anything they. would have been able to do.

Bob the Builder posted:

When I do get my deck to a point where I'm happy with it I would like a professional tech to set it up properly of course but unless they are coming to my house to set it up I can't see the point as surely the drive home will negate anything they. would have been able to do.

For occasional trips to and from the dealer, mine has the stylus guard fitted, the platter removed and the sub-platter packed with three piece of stiff, folded corrugated card.  The inverted platter is then fitted upon it and the mat placed inside. The belt is left in place. The counterweight is removed and put in my pocket. The lid is then closed.

The Linn then goes in the boot of my car and soft stuff packed round it to prevent movement should I brake hard.

But I take nothing away from the pleasure you are getting from doing the job yourself at home.

Bob I fully agree with your sentiments ...I just hope you don't get sucked into the " one last mod" trap

You are quite right ..the LP12 is a fairly ordinary and not that well made disc spinner ...but it's secret to success is it's modular  design allowing ever single part to be upgraded and changed

To build a top spec deck costs well north of 10k ...but it's easy to just add this ...then just add that

Sadly I grew to hate the design and it's compromises

I hope you keep in love with yours

As one being interested in getting an LP12 next year, what is a comfortable level to stabilize on?

I was thinking of getting an early eighties LP12 with valhalla PS (no 45 rpm needed - have only 33 rpm records), Nima arm. To be paired with my Nac 72.

That really is a how long is a piece of string question

Only you know what level you will be happy with...and the linn will take you to whatever level you want to go...but it will cost to get to those upper levels..and other decks become much better value at mid spec ( in my opinion) 

Hi Ardbeg,

with the LP 12 it can be nearly impossible to avoid upgrades or thoughts about them. For a 72-based system a historically correct one might be a way out of this. That would mean a different arm, like the Ittok, first generation Ekos or DNM Yota.

Thanks folks, and especially Bob for posting his experience on keeping a LP12 on a normal budget and his experience on Naim Olive gear. I'm having a 72/140 and a basic turntable as the retro-setup I find myself listening to Vinyl in the evenings and it is a great experience.

I noticed that especially the tonearm can increase the price significantly - and that the technical state can be quite different.

Anyhow, my (ex-naim) dealer has Linn too, so once the money is saved I'll give him a visit too but the dealer has transformed over the years into a Linn fanatic - but we still keep a good relation about cables etc... 

To me the older LP12 and the new Linn stuff is completely different. Its even more different than nowadays Naim and the LP12.

I really hope to find a sweetspot in the LP12 hierarchy which does not kickstart upgraditis. Read many posts about it, but unfortunately, it goes in any direction.

Your LP12 will not go out of tune as long as the dealer packs it well. 

Ardbeg10y posted:

As one being interested in getting an LP12 next year, what is a comfortable level to stabilize on?

I was thinking of getting an early eighties LP12 with valhalla PS (no 45 rpm needed - have only 33 rpm records), Nima arm. To be paired with my Nac 72.

That will sound fantastic with the 72 I was set on a Nima after I sold my last LP12/Ittock but came across one already fitted with a Fidelity Research FR12 arm which I love but the Nima is fantastic vfm.

An update to this thread:

I have now fitted a new 5 bolt top plate and motor and a new Black Ash corner braced plinth to which I had to do some minor surgery as one of the triangular corner braces was exactly where the very large pillar of my FR12 sits and so had to cut a small triangle about 20mm long out of the front of the brace.

I couldn't face attempting to cut the armboard that I bought from JAPTIMSCARLET and so have just found a new style one cut for a Micro Seiki 707 which is the same cut as the FR12 so the seller has been good enough to let me try before I buy, I'm also waiting for smokey or black coloured lid to match the black plinth once they are fitted it should be looking very nice.

The hardest bit is getting the armboard flush and at right angles with the plinth as at each stage this has to be redone and this can take  many, many, many failed attempts and as much as a hundred tightening and loosening of the bolts holding the grommets and springs. I also managed to source a new Linn belt for £20 still expensive but less than half rrp.

I played a couple of favourite records last night and it is sounding very good indeed.

I'm debating on sourcing a a used Cirkus Bearing meaning that the only oringal part of the deck then left will be the arm and a few nuts and screws if this is the case and after a final professional service I could have probably bought a deck of the same type for just a couple of hundred pounds but this is 'my' deck built by me and so is special.

I’ve had no end of pleasure servicing and updating my LP12...most recently with the Radikal and Tigerpaw Tranquility. My dealer advised on the former and Roger from Tigerpaw on the second. I bought a Kradle a year or so back and with the right tools I’ve experienced no issues at all. I’m obviously helped by the Khan top plate so no bending of suspension bolts is required. And as the OP has previously flagged, Peter Swain’s pdfs are an excellent source of useful information. The only thing I won’t touch is the cartridge - better for my dealer to bend a Kandid cantilever than me!