Fraim.......I’m now a believer!

Posted by: boom on 28 December 2018

 The  past 12 months I have contemplated the upgrade of my 18 year old Apollo 5S rack, and after reading many threads on the subject I still struggled (like many others) to understand how a decent rack can improve the SQ of music replay so much, despite the many positive threads on this forum.

So I finally bit the bullet and purchased a SH Fraim a few weeks ago and completed the install today. After powering up the black boxes I let them warm for an hour or so before listening to some music.

Well the title of this thread says it all. The uplift in performance was noticeable right from the first song and my initial thought was the uplift is similar to the improvement when I upgraded my Hicap to SC in terms of detail, however the music was more relaxed, voices softer and and clearer and the baselines easier to follow.

I just wanted to share my experience as I’m sure there will be many more people in this predicament over the coming years......Just do it!

 

Posted on: 29 December 2018 by Timmo1341

Interesting. A dozen Fraim supporters contributing to this thread over a 24 hour period, during which time, at any given moment, there seem to have been 5-600 visitors, of which at least 100 were members. This seems to be a fairly consistent pattern whenever any particular pieces of equipment are discussed. Open to interpretation, of course, but it says to me only a minority of Naim owners use a Fraim and believe strongly enough it makes a significant positive difference to SQ to make it worth mentioning. In general most people will only recommend that product upon which they personally have spent money, and are seeking positive reinforcement of their purchase by interchange with others of a like mind (I believe this is why so many afficionados  spend much of their time seeking out and quoting professional reviews that give their own purchases 5* ratings).

I’ll probably now be set upon and savaged by one or two experts in statistical interpretation! Hey, ho, I can take it.

Although I’m definitely not rubbishing Fraim, or indeed any other rack, or glass shelves (ringing or otherwise), balls, supports etc., all I am able to report is that none of them made any discernible difference to the sound of my system when demoed at home. We all ‘hear what we hear’ but once again I’d advocate an exhaustive trial to anyone thinking of investing significant funds in any rack, rather than relying upon the opinion, no matter how well intentioned, of a few users.

Posted on: 29 December 2018 by Bert Schurink
Timmo1341 posted:

Interesting. A dozen Fraim supporters contributing to this thread over a 24 hour period, during which time, at any given moment, there seem to have been 5-600 visitors, of which at least 100 were members. This seems to be a fairly consistent pattern whenever any particular pieces of equipment are discussed. Open to interpretation, of course, but it says to me only a minority of Naim owners use a Fraim and believe strongly enough it makes a significant positive difference to SQ to make it worth mentioning. In general most people will only recommend that product upon which they personally have spent money, and are seeking positive reinforcement of their purchase by interchange with others of a like mind (I believe this is why so many afficionados  spend much of their time seeking out and quoting professional reviews that give their own purchases 5* ratings).

I’ll probably now be set upon and savaged by one or two experts in statistical interpretation! Hey, ho, I can take it.

Although I’m definitely not rubbishing Fraim, or indeed any other rack, or glass shelves (ringing or otherwise), balls, supports etc., all I am able to report is that none of them made any discernible difference to the sound of my system when demoed at home. We all ‘hear what we hear’ but once again I’d advocate an exhaustive trial to anyone thinking of investing significant funds in any rack, rather than relying upon the opinion, no matter how well intentioned, of a few users.

Like you say, we hear what we hear. When I installed my Fraim it was a significant step up. And I didn’t have a totally rubish rack before. But again my ears and my experience.

Posted on: 29 December 2018 by Stephen Tate

After I purchase a ND5 XS 2 my next move is a Fraim Lite. I don't know if it will make much difference to the performance i'm currently experiencing with my current rack but I think the Fraim look smart. My only concern will be finding a way of dangling my Hi-Line without it touching the floor. Something tells me that I might have to purchase two Fraim Lite to achieve just that. 

Posted on: 29 December 2018 by HiFiman

I was a sceptic regarding equipment supports but this year purchased a full fat Fraim and love the change it made both visually and of course the improvements to the sound.

Three box system 272/555DR/250DR using Fraim medium posts with the 555 on middle shelf the burndy loop hangs about an inch from the floor, perfect.

Posted on: 29 December 2018 by Harry
Timmo1341 posted:

Open to interpretation, of course, but it says to me only a minority of Naim owners use a Fraim and believe strongly enough it makes a significant positive difference to SQ to make it worth mentioning. In general most people will only recommend that product upon which they personally have spent money, and are seeking positive reinforcement of their purchase by interchange with others of a like mind (I believe this is why so many afficionados  spend much of their time seeking out and quoting professional reviews that give their own purchases 5* ratings).

 

There are all kinds of ways of analysing this. None of them meaningful but lots of fun building arguments around anecdotal observations. Some people just lurk. There is no way of knowing their views unless they make a meaningful contribution to the discussion. I sometimes lurk here for weeks, months and on one occasion, for years, happy to read but not inclined to contribute to anything. This characterises my current behaviour in another place. You can't deduce what I think from what I don't say, if I don't say anything.

I think it is unlikely that a majority of Naim system owners put it on Fraim. I don't know this for a fact but it seems a more reasonable assumption.

Posted on: 29 December 2018 by Clive B

I purchased most of my Fraim in 2001, which I think was shortly after it was released. It was to replace some Target shelves. I compared it with Quadraspire in a comparison in the dealer's demo room, not based on a home demo. At the time I was using CDS2, XPS, NAC52, Supercap, 2x NAP135, SBL and I think the dealer tried to replicate something similar for the demo. Maybe the equipment wasn't good enough to show the difference, or maybe it wasn't warmed up or some other issue, but I'd say I heard very little difference, if any. However, I preferred the styling of the Fraim as well as its flexibility and the dealer made me an offer I couldn't refuse, so I went for it. I added two additional shelves a few years ago and was disappointed to see how, despite a significant increase in the price, the quality of the finish had been allowed to fall compared to my original shelves. I understand this is owing to a change in supplier. I cannot really say if it affects the sound I experience now at home, but it does look very smart in all black. It's a devil to dust though. 

Posted on: 29 December 2018 by boom
. In general most people will only recommend that product upon which they personally have spent money, and are seeking positive reinforcement of their purchase by interchange with others of a like mind 

 

This was my belief also. The condition of me buying the Fraim was I had to purchase SH, if I didn’t hear any different I would re list and recoup my money.

well the Fraim stayed, and the added bonus is it look superb and makes it easy for further upgrade additions.

Posted on: 29 December 2018 by hungryhalibut

Many years ago I had a big Naim system, supported on Fraim. When I downsized the Fraim went too, to be replaced with the basic Quadraspire Q4. Over the years that followed I went through a succession of stands including Isoblue (very good), Hutter (also very good), Hifi Racks (total shite) and finally Quadraspire SVT bamboo (excellent). I was really happy with the SVT for a good few years and then, in late summer, I saw a base and three shelves of maple Fraim for sale for £1,000. Fraim is a pain to set up and even more of a pain to dust, and the SVT is very very good. Anyway, rather like you, I thought I’d take a punt and I could always sell it again. The difference was amazing, just so much better, more real, more involving and also livelier. I had suspected I wouldn’t be impressed, but I was, and after years of telling myself that Fraim was somewhat over hyped I had to eat my words. So the SVT went, for £800, and the Fraim stayed. Other than a Cisco switch for £50, and dedicated mains for £300, the upgrade to Fraim has to be the best £200 upgrade I’ve made. Some of the burndies touch the floor but it’s still miles better than the taller SVT, where they didn’t. 

Posted on: 29 December 2018 by Clay Bingham

The Fraim design seems specifically tailored to the Naim rear panel layouts and the distance between the normal levels is quite small. Nevertheless, has anyone ever seen a Fraim used with non-Naim equipment, perhaps with the taller level spacing available as an option. I have never seen a Fraim used in such a manner whereas other stands seem to be used  with all types of equipment. Why would that be? Plenty of expensive stands, so money is not the factor. Or is use with other equipment more common in the UK? Do folks using the Fraim with other equipment notice the same difference Naim owners do?

Is the Fraim compensating for design decisions made by Naim in it's choice of feet for it's equipment or perhaps the way its mounts it's internal circuit boards? Were not some Naim pieces noticeable for hum in certain environments? Maybe at some subtle level the Fraim helps. It certainly is interesting that no one else in the business (that I can recall) makes their own stands and/or has owners so adamant about how a specific stand makes such a difference in their enjoyment.

 

Posted on: 29 December 2018 by varyat

Turn your music up to "11" and touch the wall in your room- it will be vibrating. Touch the top shelf of your Fraim......you won't feel much.

The Fraim is a well engineered equipment stand and imo, all audio components will benefit from isolation from air borne vibrations. Even if they do not wear a Naim badge

ATB,

Mark

Posted on: 29 December 2018 by Harry

Jason went into this in some detail when we did a factory visit. It is designed to transmit mechanical hash in well defined directions, at optimised speed and dissipation. At the same time, this must have no measurable or subjective effect on musical communication, sound quality, or whatever you would prefer to call it. Fraim lite didn't appear over night either. They were fiddling about for years before it launched.