Allo DigiOne Signature

RX8R3Rod posted:

That’s IMHO really interesting feedback; really appreciate it, thanks! ????

It also nicely demonstrates the potential dangers of quick-fire assessments (which you v astutely sidestepped ????????).

I suspect one other variable that may also possibly come into play in a scenario like your initial experience of the Signature, is that of variable mains supply quality. It’s probably relevant for us all from one day to the next, but perhaps particularly relevant when comparing listener A’s experience (‘wonderful’ (or whatever) with listener B’s experience (‘barely average’ (or whatever))?

But I must stop waffling and back to the topic at hand; would you consider it overall a worthwhile purchase?

 

I certainly think that the DigiOne Signature is a worthwhile purchase. But the question of whether it is worthwhile for a DigiOne owner to upgrade to the Signature has to be put in a perspective and answers will necessarily be subjective.

I am glad that I have purchased the DigiOne Signature and hopefully I will be able to provide a more detailed assessment of the differences between DigiOne Signature and Digione in the upcoming days.

That said, Allo need to improve both the packaging and the assembly quality of the DigiOne Signature. I have received the UpTone Audio LPS-1.2 and the DigiOne Signature on the same day. The LPS-1.2 was delivered in an impeccable package and with a simple and yet detailed user guide and a lot of care for details. The build quality is very good.

In contrast, the DigiOne Signature was delivered in a not so mint package with a puzzling warning ("DO NOT FEED POWER TO THE RPI AND DIGIONE IN THE SAME TIME") printed on the box and with no instructions inside.

The two boards of the DigiOne Signature were connected with brass spacers. These spacers are about 0.5mm too short for the 8pin GPIO port that connects the two boards: the screws that hold the spacers together were tightened and the two boards were under stress. Such assembly/design is not very inspiring. The assembly worked fine but for a 300$ device I would expect a better build quality and packaging.

In short: the original DigiOne was a no brainer and a great value for money. The DigiOne Signature is an improvement over the Digione. But at 2.5 the price of the original DigiOne, one would expect a better build quality and a more professional packaging.

Timo posted:

nbpf posted:

RX8R3Rod posted:

Very much look forward to hearing how you find the comparison! ????????

...

I have been running the new DigiOne Signature side-by-side with the DigiOne into the Naim DAC since Monday evening.

The two devices are connected to inputs 7 and 8 of the Naim DAC through two Naim DC-1 cables of the same length. The DAC is connected to a Supernait 2 via a Super Lumina DIN-DIN connector. I have been listening to the devices through Ovator S-400 speakers and Sennheiser HD-800 headphones. These are connected to the headphones output of the SN2 which is less than optimal for the HD800.

The dirty side of the DigiOne Signature and the DigiOne are powered by a grounded ifi 5V/2.5A PSU. The clean side of the DigiOne Signature is powered by a LPS-1.2.

The DigiOne and the DigiOne Signature were hosted by two Raspberry Pi 3B+ running the same minimal Raspbian distribution, the only difference being the host name and, of course, the IP address.

During the first listenings through the S-400 I could not distinguish the DigiOne Signature from the DigiOne. This was perhaps because of the tone quality of the two devices which is very similar. Perhaps the DigiOne Signature needed some run in time or perhaps my system is not very revealing or I am a poor listener.

After listening more carefully to the two devices yesterday and today (first through the HD800 and then through the S-400 again), I am now convinced that the DigiOne Signature is definitely better than the DigiOne. The presentation is more engaging. Fast transients are better controlled. Both basses and high pitch notes are more distinct and clear. These impressions were consistent across three very different tracks.

That said, the DigiOne Signature is about 2.5 times more expensive that the DigiOne and the LPS-1.2 costs about 1.5 times the DigiOne Signature. Thus, the DigiOne Signature + LPS-1.2 is about six times more expensive than the DigiOne.

On the other hand, the DigiOne Signature + LPS-1.2 is a very fine and flexible solution to the problem of feeding a S/PDIF DAC with a high quality signal.

With MinimServer and upmpdcli running on the RPi that hosts the DigiOne Signature, one has a self contained server + network player with excellent support for classical music, internet radio and gapless replay of Qobuz, Tidal, etc.

The clean side of the DigiOne Signature can also be powered by batteries. This very much decreases the price of the system but, of course, requires replacing and recharging the batteries. Four 2400mAh 18650 batteries should be able to provide clean power to the clean side of the DigiOne Signature for more than 50 hours.

Thanks nbpf for sharing your experience with us! 

I wondered -- did you try the regular Digione with the LPS-1.2? If so, did this decrease the performance gap between regular and Signature Digione? 

T

I have not tried the regular Digione with the LPS-1.2 because the LPS-1.2 can only deliver 1.1A and the Digione + RPi + USB drive need more than 1.1A. But it's a good point and if the DigiOne is used as a network player and underclocked, it might indeed be possible to power it with a LPS-1.2.

https://forums.naimaudio.com/t...80#77596589427282880

Any recommendations on a good S/PDIF cable to run from the Allo DigiOne Signature to a Naim DAC for < $100 US?

Belden 1694a from blue jean cables takes a lot of beating, should be about 20 dollars, depending on the length and connectors.

Bill_nyc posted:

Any recommendations on a good S/PDIF cable to run from the Allo DigiOne Signature to a Naim DAC for < $100 US?

Have a look at this thread:

https://forums.naimaudio.com/t...ax#77033102951917594

Timo

Bill_nyc posted:

Any recommendations on a good S/PDIF cable to run from the Allo DigiOne Signature to a Naim DAC for < $100 US?

If you wanted to spend a disproportionate amount of cash: Siltech makes excellent S/PDIF cables. I deeply regret selling mine.

If not, for a lot less than $100 US, the entry level Audioquest Forest will work fine. I prefer it to the BJC S/PDIF cable.

My UnitiServe just died and I sent it in for service.     While I'm waiting for the estimate to come back I'm pondering my options.  How much of a step down in quality from the UnitiServe would I take by going with the DigiOne Signature?  I'm using a Naim DAC vintage ~2010 into a Musical Fidelity M5si, with B&W 804 speakers.

Also, what would be my best option for ripping in that case?

Bill_nyc posted:

My UnitiServe just died and I sent it in for service.     While I'm waiting for the estimate to come back I'm pondering my options.  How much of a step down in quality from the UnitiServe would I take by going with the DigiOne Signature?  I'm using a Naim DAC vintage ~2010 into a Musical Fidelity M5si, with B&W 804 speakers.

Also, what would be my best option for ripping in that case?

I very much believe that the Allo DigiOne Signature could bring you a step up in sound quality from the UnitiServe, but I have not made any direct comparison. It also depends a little bit on the Power supply that you use for the clean side of the Signature.

With MinimServer and upmpdcli, the Signature will certainly be an improvement in functionality over the UnitiServe.

Ripping is done with whatever bit-perfect ripper software you feel comfortable with. I understand many of use dbPoweramp. The only thing that matters is that the software supports setting whatever indexes you want. For instance Composition or Work to store the name of a work or composition. Support for multiple values for a given index is also mandatory, especially for Artist, Ensemble, Composer, Conductor, Period, Genre and Form.

Any thoughts on an NUC (with AudioLinux?) vs. the DigiOne Signature?

Bill_nyc posted:

Any thoughts on an NUC (with AudioLinux?) vs. the DigiOne Signature?

That's also a possibility and I have been in touch with the developer of AudioLinux over the last few days as I have compiled a real time kernel for the Pi and we have exchanged our experiences.He was very competent and supportive.

I have already outlined what I think are the advantaged of a Raspberry Pi + DigiOne (or DigiOne Signature) solution against a NUC (mac mini, fitpc, etc.) + USB to S/PDIF interface solution in previous posts: the former is simpler, requires less power and a smaller total number of boxes.

Also, I have been using a fitPC3 + USB to S/PDIF interface (M2Tech hiFace Evo,  Schiit Eitr) for years and the DigiOne Signature sounds clearly better in my system. I have not tried AudioLinux though.

The advantages of a NUC-based solution are also obvious: you have a more powerful system that can run in memory and that allows you to play around with upsampling, Roon, HQPlayer if you fancy to do so. I am personally not very interested in fiddling around with the system and only use MinimServer and upmpdcli.

Perhaps you could just buy a DigiOne for about 100$. With a 35$ Rpi and a 50$ power supply, this would give you a system that has better functionalities than the UnitiServe (apart from ripping) and that would allow you to experiment with MinimServer, upmpdcli and with non-Naim control points like Linn Kazoo and Bubble UPnP.

Perhaps you do not like it. In this case you have lost little money. If you on the others side like the approach, you can then alway replace the DigiOne with a DigiOne Signature (no need to change any settings) later or play around with a NUC + AudioLinux.

hi,

i'm a bit confused here...

I just can't see any ethernet connection in the allo digione, do I miss something?

or do I need to buy the signature player in order to get ethernet socket?thanks

e

yoav1yon1 posted:

hi,

i'm a bit confused here...

I just can't see any ethernet connection in the allo digione, do I miss something?

or do I need to buy the signature player in order to get ethernet socket?thanks

e

The Allo DigiOne and DigiOne Signature are Raspberry Pi hats. They are to be mounted on a Raspberry Pi (e.g. RPi 3 B or RPi 3 B+) and this has, among others, one Ethernet port. See the Allo webpage for full details.

[@mention:23389351206659471], happy new year/ein frohes neues Jahr! 

Over the Christmas break I did some reading up on (linear) power supplies — a new field for me... I wondered whether you tried your JS-2 on the clean side of your Allo (rather than your regular LPS 1.2). I hope I didn’t get your power supply situation mixed up... 

Cheers!

Timo

Timo posted:

[@mention:23389351206659471], happy new year/ein frohes neues Jahr! 

Over the Christmas break I did some reading up on (linear) power supplies — a new field for me... I wondered whether you tried your JS-2 on the clean side of your Allo (rather than your regular LPS 1.2). I hope I didn’t get your power supply situation mixed up... 

Cheers!

Timo

Hi Timo, happy new year!

Sorry fo the late reply: Over the Christmas break I have in fact done a number of tests, mainly with different cables connecting the power supplies and the DigiOne Signature.

I have to admit that I find it very difficult to assess the differences between two cables or between two power supplies if switching between them requires rebooting the source. I very much prefer testing two sources connected to two nDAC inputs in parallel and with identical cables. Then I can just switch the inputs on the nDAC and go back and forth through short music sequences as I please.

That said, today I tried powering the clean side of the DigiOne Signature with the JS-2 and with the LPS-1.2. The dirty side was powered by a (grounded) ifi iPower 5V/2.5A. I have only listened to one of my standard comparison tracks, namely track one of "Bach Arias" by Ensemble Pulcinella with Ophélie Gaillard, Sandrine Piau, Christophe Dumaux and Emiliano Gonzales Toro.  

Again, I am not sure that I would be able to take the JS-2 and the LPS-1.2 apart in a blind test but my impression was that the JS-2 sounded a little bit warmer and perhaps more natural/easier than the LPS-1.2. The LPS-1.2 was perhaps a bit more involving/hot. I was alone, thus I cannot provide more than these impressions. 

I still think that my current powering scheme (JS-2 for the dirty side and LPS-1.2 for the clean side) sounds best but this is likely placebo or whishful thinking. What is definitely not placebo, however, is the build quality of the JS-2 and of the LPS-1.2. The two devices are now on a single shelf just below the Oppo 203 and the Naim DAC and I can recommend them without reservations. The only thing to consider is that the JS-2 dissipates quite a lot of heat when powering the dirty side of the DigiOne Signature. While streaming from a 1TB Samsung T5 connected to one of the USB ports of the RPi that hosts the Signature and transcoding 24bits/192kHz files, the power consumption is between 500 and 800 mA at about 4.8V.

Best, nbpf

Hey nbpf, why not add another Rpi just to run Minimserver with the Samsung T5 attached and have it do the transcoding. Then pass that all off to the Rpi with the DigiOne Sig, that's what I do. The Rpi cost is minimal. of course it is yet another box.

dknk posted:

Hey nbpf, why not add another Rpi just to run Minimserver with the Samsung T5 attached and have it do the transcoding. Then pass that all off to the Rpi with the DigiOne Sig, that's what I do. The Rpi cost is minimal. of course it is yet another box.

I have tried stopping MinimServer on the RPi that hosts the Signature, disconnecting the T5 and streaming from another RPi. I cannot hear any obvious difference and thus, for the sake of simplicity, I am running MinimServer on the RPi that hosts the Signature. This setup some advantages and, as far as I can say, no disadvantages against one in which server and client run on different machines. The CPU load is also very low even when transcoding 24bits/192kHz files with a CPU frequency fixed at 1GHz. A load between 500 and 800mA is very modest for the JS-2. Thus, for the time being, I do not have a motivation for adding complexity to a very simple and lean system. If I have a chance, I will demo an NDX2 or a dCS Network Bridge (last year I enjoyed a very long ND555 demo but not in my system) to have an idea of how they compare to the DigiOne Signature. But I am not planning to replace the DigiOne Signature for the time being and realistic alternatives should be as simple as my current setup or sound significantly better.    

nbpf posted:

If I have a chance, I will demo an NDX2 or a dCS Network Bridge (last year I enjoyed a very long ND555 demo but not in my system) to have an idea of how they compare to the DigiOne Signature.   

I, for one, would be very interested to hear of your opinions on this.

I am now Naimless after >40 years, after selling the lot to move to a RPi/Digione (standard) bridging to a pair of Kii Threes. It bests anything I've had previously by a very large margin indeed but I, understandably, can't help feeling that £150 worth of network bridge just cannot sound so good - despite what my ears tell me!

I heard a NDX2 in the context of a 65K system a few weeks ago and it sounded great (as it should for that price!) and the DCS seems to garner a huge amount of praise. Since the Kiis have internal DACs, all I need is a bridge. I wonder how close the Digione Signature gets to these two? Let us know! 

nbpf posted:

Timo posted:

[@mention:23389351206659471], happy new year/ein frohes neues Jahr! 

Over the Christmas break I did some reading up on (linear) power supplies — a new field for me... I wondered whether you tried your JS-2 on the clean side of your Allo (rather than your regular LPS 1.2). I hope I didn’t get your power supply situation mixed up... 

Cheers!

Timo

Hi Timo, happy new year!

Sorry fo the late reply: Over the Christmas break I have in fact done a number of tests, mainly with different cables connecting the power supplies and the DigiOne Signature.

I have to admit that I find it very difficult to assess the differences between two cables or between two power supplies if switching between them requires rebooting the source. I very much prefer testing two sources connected to two nDAC inputs in parallel and with identical cables. Then I can just switch the inputs on the nDAC and go back and forth through short music sequences as I please.

That said, today I tried powering the clean side of the DigiOne Signature with the JS-2 and with the LPS-1.2. The dirty side was powered by a (grounded) ifi iPower 5V/2.5A. I have only listened to one of my standard comparison tracks, namely track one of "Bach Arias" by Ensemble Pulcinella with Ophélie Gaillard, Sandrine Piau, Christophe Dumaux and Emiliano Gonzales Toro.  

Again, I am not sure that I would be able to take the JS-2 and the LPS-1.2 apart in a blind test but my impression was that the JS-2 sounded a little bit warmer and perhaps more natural/easier than the LPS-1.2. The LPS-1.2 was perhaps a bit more involving/hot. I was alone, thus I cannot provide more than these impressions. 

I still think that my current powering scheme (JS-2 for the dirty side and LPS-1.2 for the clean side) sounds best but this is likely placebo or whishful thinking. What is definitely not placebo, however, is the build quality of the JS-2 and of the LPS-1.2. The two devices are now on a single shelf just below the Oppo 203 and the Naim DAC and I can recommend them without reservations. The only thing to consider is that the JS-2 dissipates quite a lot of heat when powering the dirty side of the DigiOne Signature. While streaming from a 1TB Samsung T5 connected to one of the USB ports of the RPi that hosts the Signature and transcoding 24bits/192kHz files, the power consumption is between 500 and 800 mA at about 4.8V.

Best, nbpf

Thanks so much for sharing your observations with us!! :-) 

I guess, in a way, it is good news that the LPS-1.2 isn't outperformed, in an obvious manner, by the JS-2. :-)  I wonder whether the JS-2 only "shines" when more juice is needed... In any case, your praise for the LPS-1.2 very much corresponds with the good reviews the LPS receives. 

Based on reviews, I am also intrigued by Paul Heynes PSUs. His new SR-4 could be great for the DigiOne Signature. But I am somewhat put off by the long and apparently unpredictable wait for a Paul Heynes product... Admittedly, the problems are mainly caused by the SR-7; and maybe the end of the SR-7 will turn Paul Heynes into a more reliable business... His products must be great -- otherwise people wouldn't put up with a year-long or so wait... 

just got mine and after doing the set up and enabling of the wifi...

plugged into my Chord Dave.

this does sound very good indeed, it's a keeper !

Great to hear that the humble DigiOne Signature can even satisfy a Chord Dave owner.   

What did you use before? And, do you have a "posh" LPS for the clean side? Cheers!

I used Jriver from a laptop same as what Mr Rob Watts uses... but wanted to try a dedicated SPDIF streamer.... I haven't done any A/B this does sound nice.... 

I am just using the basic SMPS that comes with the Allo Digione Signature... but now I will buy a better PSU... have to say it sounds quite good now.

analogmusic posted:

just got mine and after doing the set up and enabling of the wifi...

plugged into my Chord Dave.

this does sound very good indeed, it's a keeper !

Give the Allo DigiOne Signature one or two weeks to run in and a good power supply for the clean side. You might be surprised how good this source can be. Which OS are you running on the RPi that hosts the DigiOne? 

I ordered it with diet pi. Quite pleased with it as it has upnp and AirPlay, along with Roon... I also use bubble upnp server on my laptop to create an open home renderer for using linn kazoo with tidal.

works really well as a software... quite pleased 

I look forward to your findings on the new forum!