Advice on temporaily using a Nait XS2 as a preamplifier with a 250DR, to eventually become a 282/250DR combo

Has anyone experience of using a Nait XS2 as a preamplifier with a NAP 250DR power amplifier?  I will eventually upgrade to a NAC 282 preamplifier (or similar), with the 250DR.

Do I have to buy a Hi-CAP, or other power source with the NAP 250DR to make a Nait XS2/NAP 250DR combo work?  

The other option is to sell the Nait XS2 and buy a Supernait 2, until I'm ready for the big investment of a 282/250DR.

Will there be a noticeable improvement with a Nait XS2/NAP 250DR combo compared with the Nait XS2 on its own?

Speakers are PMC Twenty5 24's and source is Michell Gyro SE/SME 309 arm/Benz Micro Ace SL, with a Lehmann Decade Phono Stage.

I look forward to your comments and advice.

Thanks. 

Original Post

I’m with Chrissu on this one.  I ran a Nait XS2 as a preamp into NAP 200 for a while and upgrading to a 282 made a huge difference in about every dimension, especially in detail and clarity.  Later updating the power amp to 300DR was significant but not nearly as revelatory.

ChrisSU posted:

I would consider upgrading the preamp first, and running that with the XS as power amp, if you want to do this in stages. Stage 2 could be to add a Hicap, and finally replace the XS with a power amp. 

Thank you for your advice.  Just to clarify, can you please confirm I wouldn’t need a HiCap to run the 282 with the XS2 as a power amp, but I would need a HiCap to run a 250DR?

Many Thanks

Looking at the manual I think that’s correct, you could power a 202 or 282 from the 4 pin  power amp in socket on the xs, but with a 250dr you’d need a separate hicap (or flat cap) for the xs preamp. The xs doesn’t have a biamp out like the supernait which would work for this purpose.

Adam Gr posted:
ChrisSU posted:

I would consider upgrading the preamp first, and running that with the XS as power amp, if you want to do this in stages. Stage 2 could be to add a Hicap, and finally replace the XS with a power amp. 

Thank you for your advice.  Just to clarify, can you please confirm I wouldn’t need a HiCap to run the 282 with the XS2 as a power amp, but I would need a HiCap to run a 250DR?

Many Thanks

The XS can power a preamp, so it will work fine without a Hicap. You would just need the Hicap before changing the XS for a 250, as that can't.

Either option is fine but upgrading the preamp should come first. I ran a 122x/FC2x with a 250.2 for a few long weeks before I got my 252. It was less than optimum in particular in the lower end. I received the SCDR first. The association with the 122x was interesting though, but still missing. This being said, the 122x is one of, if not the best entry level preamp Salisbury has ever commercialized. 😎

Chag -

Fueller / OP,

Although the XS doesn't have a  DIN bi-amp out, it does have RCA sub-outs.  I know Naim never recommends using RCA (probably why the manual doesn't cover this option), but a connection from that to a 250 should work with an RCA>XLR cable, and without hiCap.  The likes of Gotham produce decent I/Cs of this type.

This is not to say that going with a 250 upgrade first is the right option.  Years ago I performed a similar experiment with NAD rather than Naim, and the power amp brought staggering improvements to the integrated.  However Naim may be different and the body of opinion here seems to feel a pre would be provide the more significant step up.  I've no reason to disagree.....

ChrisSU posted:
Adam Gr posted:
ChrisSU posted:

I would consider upgrading the preamp first, and running that with the XS as power amp, if you want to do this in stages. Stage 2 could be to add a Hicap, and finally replace the XS with a power amp. 

Thank you for your advice.  Just to clarify, can you please confirm I wouldn’t need a HiCap to run the 282 with the XS2 as a power amp, but I would need a HiCap to run a 250DR?

Many Thanks

The XS can power a preamp, so it will work fine without a Hicap. You would just need the Hicap before changing the XS for a 250, as that can't.

Thank you for your excellent comments and advice. 

Adam Gr posted:

Has anyone experience of using a Nait XS2 as a preamplifier with a NAP 250DR power amplifier?  I will eventually upgrade to a NAC 282 preamplifier (or similar), with the 250DR.

 

Adam.., You beat me to it.  I was going to ask exactly the same questions. I want to use a Nait XS as a  pre to feed a NAP250 .... I can't be bothered with additional power supplies so I was going to go down the pre-sub out route... No point starting with a NAC Pre instead of a NAP since I need the grunt to move a pair of ATC SCM40.

I am eager to hear how your experiment goes...

Given the advice from others, I’m now going to go down the Nait XS2 as a power amp and buy a 282 (pre amp) - possibly secondhand.  In time I will buy a HiCap and then a NAP250DR when the wife.......I mean funds allow.

I have learned the NAP250 has it's own PSU and it’s the 282 that needs powering with a 24V DC supply.  The NAP250 and above don't have a 24V supply going back to the pre, so I would need a Flatcap/Hicap to power a 282.  The NaitXS2 has a 24V supply, so this would initially power the 282.  I also need a 5-5 SNAIC lead to make the connection.

My brother has ATC SCM40’s and the are lovely neutral speakers, but as you say do need grunt. 

I will let you know how I get on.

All the best Adam

Adam Gr posted:

My brother has ATC SCM40’s and the are lovely neutral speakers, but as you say do need grunt. 

Thank you for your post! - it certainly made me consider other options 

I am currently debating whether sell everything (see profile) and start again from scratch when wif- funds... when funds allow or keep either the streamer or the nait. not sure ....

What powers your brothers SCM40?

Adam Gr posted:

I believe he is using the ATC SIA2-150 integrated amplifier, but then he was talking about possibly upgrading - to what I’m not sure - I assume a pre and power amp.  I will ask him if you like?

Ah. yes.... ask him! that would be very kind of you...

Alonso posted:
Adam Gr posted:

I believe he is using the ATC SIA2-150 integrated amplifier, but then he was talking about possibly upgrading - to what I’m not sure - I assume a pre and power amp.  I will ask him if you like?

Ah. yes.... ask him! that would be very kind of you...

My brother said:

To be honest i'm likely to be a bit bit lazy about the upgrade.  I trialed a number of intergrated amps inc. Roksan, Musical Fidelity, Rega and Leema (and the ATC pre-power combo) before i settled on the ATC.
 
To us there was no contest in terms of clarity and neutrality and we realised of course that the ATC amps would have been designed to drive thier own speakers.
 
On this basis my upgrade would be to their 300W CA2/P2 pre-power amp combo, but one reservation which he might like to know, the combo is slightly brighter and more analitical than the intergrated.  As ever, really on your ears.

 

Adam Gr posted:
I have learned the NAP250 has it's own PSU and it’s the 282 that needs powering with a 24V DC supply.  The NAP250 and above don't have a 24V supply going back to the pre, so I would need a Flatcap/Hicap to power a 282.  The NaitXS2 has a 24V supply, so this would initially power the 282.  I also need a 5-5 SNAIC lead to make the connection.

FC and HC come with a Snaic 5.

A Snaic 4 will be needed to connect XS2 to either FC or HC, or direct to a NAC282.

(NAP250 come with a Snaic 4).

Richard or someone will correct me if I've got it wrong.

C.

The XS manual shows that to connect and power a 282 requires a 5-5 Snaic lead.

I’ve always thought that preamp out would be much better named preamp in, as the signal is coming in from the preamp when the XS is in power amp mode. The opposite applies to power amp in. It would better be called power amp out, as in preamp mode the XS is sending a signal out to a power amp. 

Hungryhalibut posted:

The XS manual shows that to connect and power a 282 requires a 5-5 Snaic lead.

I’ve always thought that preamp out would be much better named preamp in, as the signal is coming in from the preamp when the XS is in power amp mode. The opposite applies to power amp in. It would better be called power amp out, as in preamp mode the XS is sending a signal out to a power amp. 

Hi

Thanks for your message which reconfims what I thought following advice from Naim support - that I need 5-5 SNAIC lead to connect an XS2 as a power amp to a 282 pre-amp.  I agree it isn’t clear which is why I asked Naim to clarify.  Everyone including Naim and you have been very helpful.

Thanks Adam

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