HDX backup.

Hi,

At present, my HDX acts as a ripper / server to my NDS, the music being ripped to, and stored on a NAS.

I plan to have the ageing 2 X 400 Gb drives replaced with larger drives, and have the music copied to the new drives.

Once done, the plan is to rip to the new internal drive, with the second one acting as a backup.

My question is, having achieved the above, is there any way of additionally backing up to the NAS, simply as insurance against HD failure?

Thanks chaps.

Original Post

I'm not sure if I understand what you're asking here, are you saying you want an additional backup as well as the NAS? If so, the answer is yes, you can just use a USB hard drive to back up from the NAS, rather than the HDX internal drive. How exactly you do this will depend on the NAS you're using.

The idea is that music will be ripped to the first of the new drives, and backed up to the second one.

What I'd like to do is, in addition, add any new rips to the existing ones on the NAS, simply as a second back up of everything.

I'm guessing that I'll be able to do this manually, simply copying them across via my MacBook, but wondered if there was any way of configuring things on the HDX so that it would automatically save an "extra" copy to the NAS, as well as the prime copy to the second HDX internal drive.

ChrisSU posted:

Just re-reading your post, the current 2TB internal drive is a single one, so your backup will have to be to an external NAS.

That's how I ran my HDX, 2TB internal drive backing up to a Synology 115j, then periodic copying from the 115j to a USB attached hard drive which I kept offsite.

The HDX has a 'back up to external NAS' program if I recall. I used it when I sold mine to move music to my Networked NAS which served the new NDS. It all worked very well-although I had lots of stored music and it does take a while I found you could interrupt it  and it would resume fine. I decided this was simpler than saving the HDX as a CD ripper only.

I think details are in the HDX instruction manual.

My networked NAS has 2 drives making continuous back ups etc

Bruce

dave marshall posted:

The idea is that music will be ripped to the first of the new drives, and backed up to the second one.

What I'd like to do is, in addition, add any new rips to the existing ones on the NAS, simply as a second back up of everything.

I'm guessing that I'll be able to do this manually, simply copying them across via my MacBook, but wondered if there was any way of configuring things on the HDX so that it would automatically save an "extra" copy to the NAS, as well as the prime copy to the second HDX internal drive.

I don't think you can upgrade the 2 400GB drives to 2TB, I think you get a single 2TB drive.

ChrisSU posted:

Just re-reading your post, the current 2TB internal drive is a single one, so your backup will have to be to an external NAS. Once the initial backup is done, an automatic incremental backup happens every night to the NAS.

Chris, the new setup will consist of 2 X 2Gb internal drives, but I can't elaborate further on this, otherwise I'll be on thin ice, as far as forum rules are concerned. 

dave marshall posted:
ChrisSU posted:

Just re-reading your post, the current 2TB internal drive is a single one, so your backup will have to be to an external NAS. Once the initial backup is done, an automatic incremental backup happens every night to the NAS.

Chris, the new setup will consist of 2 X 2Gb internal drives, but I can't elaborate further on this, otherwise I'll be on thin ice, as far as forum rules are concerned. 

I see! I guess you'll just have to try it out for yourself then, I have no idea how the Naim software will cope with what you're going to do. Good luck!!

ChrisSU posted:
dave marshall posted:
ChrisSU posted:

Just re-reading your post, the current 2TB internal drive is a single one, so your backup will have to be to an external NAS. Once the initial backup is done, an automatic incremental backup happens every night to the NAS.

Chris, the new setup will consist of 2 X 2Gb internal drives, but I can't elaborate further on this, otherwise I'll be on thin ice, as far as forum rules are concerned. 

I see! I guess you'll just have to try it out for yourself then, I have no idea how the Naim software will cope with what you're going to do. Good luck!!

Hopefully, not "The Sound of Silence" ...................... fingers crossed. 

My HDX has internal drive (or drives?) which is where my music is stored.

I have 3 NAS drives in various locations around the house, including one in the garage, slightly remote from the house.
The HDX is configured to automatically back-up or copy my rips onto these NAS drives. If I later add a new ripped CD, it is incrementally backed up to these drives, so I never have to think about doing anything.

I do however periodically check that the NAS drives are still working correctly, just in case...

blythe posted:

My HDX has internal drive (or drives?) which is where my music is stored.

I have 3 NAS drives in various locations around the house, including one in the garage, slightly remote from the house.
The HDX is configured to automatically back-up or copy my rips onto these NAS drives. If I later add a new ripped CD, it is incrementally backed up to these drives, so I never have to think about doing anything.

I do however periodically check that the NAS drives are still working correctly, just in case...

Hi Blythe,

This is exactly what I have in mind, once my reconfigured HDX is back in use.

It will automatically perform a back up to the second internal drive, but I'm looking to do as you do, and obtain a further back up to my existing NAS.

I'm guessing that the ability to do this is buried somewhere within device settings on the HDX, but since it's away at the mo' that's all I'm doing ........ guessing.

If you could point me in the right direction as to how you achieved this, I'd be most grateful,

Thanks,

Dave.

dave marshall posted:
ChrisSU posted:

Just re-reading your post, the current 2TB internal drive is a single one, so your backup will have to be to an external NAS. Once the initial backup is done, an automatic incremental backup happens every night to the NAS.

Chris, the new setup will consist of 2 X 2Gb internal drives, but I can't elaborate further on this, otherwise I'll be on thin ice, as far as forum rules are concerned. 

Hi,

If you have us update a 2x400 or 2x500GByte HDX to 2TB you will get a 1x2TB unit - there has never been a 2x2TB HDX ... I'm not sure what you're referring to about 2 x 2Gb internal drives (2Gb is even smaller than the SSD drives we use in the SSD variants) or why you would be on thin ice as far as forum rules are concerned unless you're suggesting modifying units which is obviously a no-no on here.

By default the original twin drive HDXs back up to the second internal drive but you can use the backup functionality to back up to an external drive instead if you wish which you could then restore once you had your unit updated.

Cheers

Phil

Reading the thread for the first time, I think everyone is misreading what Dave Marshall is saying in his original post. I think he is saying that he is using his HDX as a ripper and storing the music on a NAS that has two 400 MB drives and which he wants to upgrade to two larger drives. Then he wants to put all of his music on one of those drives and have it backup automatically to the second one. I think he is asking whether if the HDX rips new albums to the first, he can automate the addition of those rips to his backup drive.

The answer is yes, but it's done by using the RAID capabilities in the NAS not by setup in the HDX.

I don't think he is talking about upgrading the internal drive in his HDX which is what most of the replies addressed!

But maybe it's me that misunderstands.

best

David

David Hendon posted:

Reading the thread for the first time, I think everyone is misreading what Dave Marshall is saying in his original post. I think he is saying that he is using his HDX as a ripper and storing the music on a NAS that has two 400 MB drives and which he wants to upgrade to two larger drives. Then he wants to put all of his music on one of those drives and have it backup automatically to the second one. I think he is asking whether if the HDX rips new albums to the first, he can automate the addition of those rips to his backup drive.

The answer is yes, but it's done by using the RAID capabilities in the NAS not by setup in the HDX.

I don't think he is talking about upgrading the internal drive in his HDX which is what most of the replies addressed!

But maybe it's me that misunderstands.

best

David

David - The original HDX has / had 2 x 400Gb drives. Dave is upgrading those to the 2x 2Tb. It looks like he then wants to use one internal drive in the HDX as the main store, backup to the 2nd internal drive and then for good measure back this up to the NAS. (I think

james n posted:
David Hendon posted:

Reading the thread for the first time, I think everyone is misreading what Dave Marshall is saying in his original post. I think he is saying that he is using his HDX as a ripper and storing the music on a NAS that has two 400 MB drives and which he wants to upgrade to two larger drives. Then he wants to put all of his music on one of those drives and have it backup automatically to the second one. I think he is asking whether if the HDX rips new albums to the first, he can automate the addition of those rips to his backup drive.

The answer is yes, but it's done by using the RAID capabilities in the NAS not by setup in the HDX.

I don't think he is talking about upgrading the internal drive in his HDX which is what most of the replies addressed!

But maybe it's me that misunderstands.

best

David

David - The original HDX has / had 2 x 400Gb drives. Dave is upgrading those to the 2x 2Tb. It looks like he then wants to use one internal drive in the HDX as the main store, backup to the 2nd internal drive and then for good measure back this up to the NAS. (I think

James ........... that's it exactly .............. sorry if I was less than clear in my original post, and the typo of "Gb" when I  meant "Tb" probably didn't help much either. ( and trying to stay within forum rules, at the same time).

So, really, all I'm after is how to automate this second back to the NAS. 

Thanks chaps for all your replies thus far.

It does seem as if I will be able to achieve a second back up to the NAS after all, and I'll investigate this once I have the HDX back in service.

It's quite difficult to visualise the theory of this, with the HDX awol at the mo', but I'm sure the manual will reveal all when the time comes.

james n posted:
David Hendon posted:

Reading the thread for the first time, I think everyone is misreading what Dave Marshall is saying in his original post. I think he is saying that he is using his HDX as a ripper and storing the music on a NAS that has two 400 MB drives and which he wants to upgrade to two larger drives. Then he wants to put all of his music on one of those drives and have it backup automatically to the second one. I think he is asking whether if the HDX rips new albums to the first, he can automate the addition of those rips to his backup drive.

The answer is yes, but it's done by using the RAID capabilities in the NAS not by setup in the HDX.

I don't think he is talking about upgrading the internal drive in his HDX which is what most of the replies addressed!

But maybe it's me that misunderstands.

best

David

The original HDX has / had 2 x 400Gb drives. Dave is upgrading those to the 2x 2Tb. 

Hi,

As there has never been a 2 x 2TB HDX then if that is the case it won't be being updated to 2 x 2TB by us and hence would fall foul of the modification rule.

If it is being updated to a 1 x 2TB by us then its fine.

Best

Phil

dave marshall posted:

Thanks chaps for all your replies thus far.

It does seem as if I will be able to achieve a second back up to the NAS after all, and I'll investigate this once I have the HDX back in service.

It's quite difficult to visualise the theory of this, with the HDX awol at the mo', but I'm sure the manual will reveal all when the time comes.

I'm still confused about what you want to do! So you are going to store your music inside the HDX and back up to a NAS and you want to further back up to another NAS or another drive in the same NAS?

As I said before, if you have two drives in a NAS then you can have the NAS do the backup from the first to the second automatically (eg by using RAID). I suspect that you can also get your NAS to automatically backup to a second NAS, but how you do that would depend on the NAS software. 

Best

David

dave marshall posted:

Thanks chaps for all your replies thus far.

It does seem as if I will be able to achieve a second back up to the NAS after all, and I'll investigate this once I have the HDX back in service.

It's quite difficult to visualise the theory of this, with the HDX awol at the mo', but I'm sure the manual will reveal all when the time comes.

Hi,

Yes, as I wrote above...

"By default the original twin drive HDXs back up to the second internal drive but you can use the backup functionality to back up to an external" <NAS> "drive instead if you wish which you could then restore once you had your unit updated."

If the unit comes back to us to be updated then we would also transfer the music over to the new drives for you if that was requested...

Cheers

Phil

dave marshall posted:
james n posted:
David Hendon posted:

Reading the thread for the first time, I think everyone is misreading what Dave Marshall is saying in his original post. I think he is saying that he is using his HDX as a ripper and storing the music on a NAS that has two 400 MB drives and which he wants to upgrade to two larger drives. Then he wants to put all of his music on one of those drives and have it backup automatically to the second one. I think he is asking whether if the HDX rips new albums to the first, he can automate the addition of those rips to his backup drive.

The answer is yes, but it's done by using the RAID capabilities in the NAS not by setup in the HDX.

I don't think he is talking about upgrading the internal drive in his HDX which is what most of the replies addressed!

But maybe it's me that misunderstands.

best

David

David - The original HDX has / had 2 x 400Gb drives. Dave is upgrading those to the 2x 2Tb. It looks like he then wants to use one internal drive in the HDX as the main store, backup to the 2nd internal drive and then for good measure back this up to the NAS. (I think

James ........... that's it exactly .............. sorry if I was less than clear in my original post, and the typo of "Gb" when I  meant "Tb" probably didn't help much either. ( and trying to stay within forum rules, at the same time).

So, really, all I'm after is how to automate this second back to the NAS. 

It's part of the standard functionality of Naim servers that they have an automatic backup to a separate NAS. The only thing you need to worry about is weather this function survives your 'upgrade'.

Phil Harris posted:
james n posted:
David Hendon posted:

Reading the thread for the first time, I think everyone is misreading what Dave Marshall is saying in his original post. I think he is saying that he is using his HDX as a ripper and storing the music on a NAS that has two 400 MB drives and which he wants to upgrade to two larger drives. Then he wants to put all of his music on one of those drives and have it backup automatically to the second one. I think he is asking whether if the HDX rips new albums to the first, he can automate the addition of those rips to his backup drive.

The answer is yes, but it's done by using the RAID capabilities in the NAS not by setup in the HDX.

I don't think he is talking about upgrading the internal drive in his HDX which is what most of the replies addressed!

But maybe it's me that misunderstands.

best

David

The original HDX has / had 2 x 400Gb drives. Dave is upgrading those to the 2x 2Tb. 

Hi,

As there has never been a 2 x 2TB HDX then if that is the case it won't be being updated to 2 x 2TB by us and hence would fall foul of the modification rule.

If it is being updated to a 1 x 2TB by us then its fine.

Best

Phil

Yes Phil - understood. I was just clarifying the original post as we were drifting into different interpretations. To be fair, Dave did say further up about new twin drives and forum rules so i think we are all clear on that aspect 

David Hendon posted:
dave marshall posted:

Thanks chaps for all your replies thus far.

It does seem as if I will be able to achieve a second back up to the NAS after all, and I'll investigate this once I have the HDX back in service.

It's quite difficult to visualise the theory of this, with the HDX awol at the mo', but I'm sure the manual will reveal all when the time comes.

I'm still confused about what you want to do! So you are going to store your music inside the HDX and back up to a NAS and you want to further back up to another NAS or another drive in the same NAS?

As I said before, if you have two drives in a NAS then you can have the NAS do the backup from the first to the second automatically (eg by using RAID). I suspect that you can also get your NAS to automatically backup to a second NAS, but how you do that would depend on the NAS software. 

Best

David

Hi David,

These quotes summarise what I'm after, which is to secure a second back up to an external NAS.

 

james n posted:

"David - The original HDX has / had 2 x 400Gb drives. Dave is upgrading those to the 2x 2Tb. It looks like he then wants to use one internal drive in the HDX as the main store, backup to the 2nd internal drive and then for good measure back this up to the NAS. (I think)."

"James ........... that's it exactly .............. sorry if I was less than clear in my original post, and the typo of "Gb" when I meant "Tb" probably didn't help much either. ( and trying to stay within forum rules, at the same time).

So, really, all I'm after is how to automate this second back to the NAS."

 

It does seem that this ought to be possible, from the replies received so far ................ but any discussion as to the planned upgrade of the HDX most certainly breaks forum rules, which I've tried to avoid by limiting things to the procedure involved in achieving this extra backup.

 

dave marshall posted:

It does seem as if I will be able to achieve a second back up to the NAS after all, and I'll investigate this once I have the HDX back in service.

My guess is that you are trying to avoid the high cost of disc replacement/service by Naim. An alternative way to do this would be continue using an external NAS for storage, as you can then back this up to one or more relatively inexpensive USB hard drives. The cost of disc failure then remains low, weather it's the NAS or USB drive that fails at any point in the future.

It does seem intuitively right to me to use the internal storage rather than just leaving it unused, but then you lack the flexibility to do the above, which is probably a cheap, easy DIY fix.

Phil Harris posted:
dave marshall posted:
ChrisSU posted:

Just re-reading your post, the current 2TB internal drive is a single one, so your backup will have to be to an external NAS. Once the initial backup is done, an automatic incremental backup happens every night to the NAS.

Chris, the new setup will consist of 2 X 2Gb internal drives, but I can't elaborate further on this, otherwise I'll be on thin ice, as far as forum rules are concerned. 

Hi,

If you have us update a 2x400 or 2x500GByte HDX to 2TB you will get a 1x2TB unit - there has never been a 2x2TB HDX ... I'm not sure what you're referring to about 2 x 2Gb internal drives (2Gb is even smaller than the SSD drives we use in the SSD variants) or why you would be on thin ice as far as forum rules are concerned unless you're suggesting modifying units which is obviously a no-no on here.

By default the original twin drive HDXs back up to the second internal drive but you can use the backup functionality to back up to an external drive instead if you wish which you could then restore once you had your unit updated.

Cheers

Phil

This query may be borne out of a recent listing I noticed on flea bay, where some one is offering a service to carry out such drive upgrades on the HDX, which is outside the Naim service, but might tempt some people, but I think it would risk serious issues later in the HDX life with Naim dealership.

Cbr600 posted:

This query may be borne out of a recent listing I noticed on flea bay, where some one is offering a service to carry out such drive upgrades on the HDX, which is outside the Naim service, but might tempt some people, but I think it would risk serious issues later in the HDX life with Naim dealership.

Hi,

Yes, in that case that HDX would no longer be supportable by us as we have not done a 2 x 2TB HDX and have not built support for it into the HDX software.

Cheers

Phil

I am a little confused. See the following from my ns01 System status from the DTC:

(Local Audio) [Online]
Total Size
1,867,728 MB
Value: 1,867,728 MB
Space Free
1,559,379 MB
Value: 1,559,379 MB
CD Quality Albums
1020
Value: 1020
CD Quality Tracks
12188
Value: 12188
Low Quality Albums
41
Value: 41
Low Quality Tracks
605
Value: 605
Albums in Recycle Bin
1
Value: 1
Tracks in Recycle Bin
11
Value: 11
CT-DUO\\backup [Online]
Total Size
2,835,411 MB
Value: 2,835,411 MB
Space Free
2,328,425 MB
Value: 2,328,425 MB
(Local Backup) [Online]
Total Size
1,907,718 MB
Value: 1,907,718 MB

 

I cannot read this in any other way than there is a 2 tb local backup in the unit. This was originally the 1 tb unit, so that may explain it? or that the hdx is diferent from the ns0X models.

Claus

Claus-Thoegersen posted:

I am a little confused. See the following from my ns01 System status from the DTC:

(Local Audio) [Online]
Total Size
1,867,728 MB
Value: 1,867,728 MB
Space Free
1,559,379 MB
Value: 1,559,379 MB
CD Quality Albums
1020
Value: 1020
CD Quality Tracks
12188
Value: 12188
Low Quality Albums
41
Value: 41
Low Quality Tracks
605
Value: 605
Albums in Recycle Bin
1
Value: 1
Tracks in Recycle Bin
11
Value: 11
CT-DUO\\backup [Online]
Total Size
2,835,411 MB
Value: 2,835,411 MB
Space Free
2,328,425 MB
Value: 2,328,425 MB
(Local Backup) [Online]
Total Size
1,907,718 MB
Value: 1,907,718 MB

 

I cannot read this in any other way than there is a 2 tb local backup in the unit. This was originally the 1 tb unit, so that may explain it? or that the hdx is diferent from the ns0X models.

Claus

Hi Claus,

The NS0x servers retained the dual drive layout even as 1TB and 2TB units and had internal backup ... the HDX and UnitiServe 1TB and 2TB units were all single drive with no internal backup.

Cheers

Phil

Sorry to post this here as a whole new thread would perhaps not be worthwhile.

Can your use the current version Apple Airport Time Capsule as a NAS to the HDX for back up only purposes ?

I will be using a router to/from the HDX via a Gigabit Ethernet cable connection then to the Apple device via another Gigabit Ethernet cable.

crackie posted:

Sorry to post this here as a whole new thread would perhaps not be worthwhile.

Can your use the current version Apple Airport Time Capsule as a NAS to the HDX for back up only purposes ?

I will be using a router to/from the HDX via a Gigabit Ethernet cable connection then to the Apple device via another Gigabit Ethernet cable.

You can't use a Time Capsule, you need a proper NAS.

crackie posted:

Sorry to post this here as a whole new thread would perhaps not be worthwhile.

Can your use the current version Apple Airport Time Capsule as a NAS to the HDX for back up only purposes ?

I will be using a router to/from the HDX via a Gigabit Ethernet cable connection then to the Apple device via another Gigabit Ethernet cable.

The Time Capsule shares a single folder on the network and everything you want to store has to go in that folder ... for a backup location the HDX expects to have sole access to the folder being used for backup and if there are other files in there then it will not allow the folder to be specified as a backup location so you want to be using a proper NAS for that functionality and then you can set up a specific "Naim_Backups" folder for use solely for backing up your HDX.

Most decent NASs nowadays offer Time Capsule functionality anyway and so can also give you your rolling Mac backups as well.

Best

Phil

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