ND5XS2

Johnrtaylor posted:

The NDX 2 screen can be turned off but as the tracks change it will briefly show the album cover, the buttons can also be turned off.

Yes, not 100% perfect but it does this when configured using the remote to do so.  Have tested on a demo NDX 2 machine.

I heard a ND5 XS 2 today and I was very impressed with what I heard. To me it sounded crisp and coherent and easily worth it's price tag. I very nearly paid for one on the spot but have decided to leave it until after Christmas now as the silly season for me will get in the way. I heard the ND5 XS 2 playing FLAC files from Tidal as well as locally ripped and stored, all was very good and enjoyable with a very low noise floor, more so than what CD is capable of, I thought.

In the flesh I thought it looked very smart indeed, clean, and understated. 

Bravo Naim!

Stephen Tate posted:

I heard a ND5 XS 2 today and I was very impressed with what I heard. To me it sounded crisp and coherent and easily worth it's price tag. I very nearly paid for one on the spot but have decided to leave it until after Christmas now as the silly season for me will get in the way. I heard the ND5 XS 2 playing FLAC files from Tidal as well as locally ripped and stored, all was very good and enjoyable with a very low noise floor, more so than what CD is capable of I thought.

In the flesh I thought it looked very smart indeed, clean, smart and understated. 

Bravo Naim!

Yes, it's a fine machine on its own without an external PSU.  I've been very tempted as it's in a different league to my Nova, though I'm actually playing lots more vinyl recently and considering optimising standalone pre-amp/power for my vinyl first.

Alley Cat posted:
Stephen Tate posted:

I heard a ND5 XS 2 today and I was very impressed with what I heard. To me it sounded crisp and coherent and easily worth it's price tag. I very nearly paid for one on the spot but have decided to leave it until after Christmas now as the silly season for me will get in the way. I heard the ND5 XS 2 playing FLAC files from Tidal as well as locally ripped and stored, all was very good and enjoyable with a very low noise floor, more so than what CD is capable of I thought.

In the flesh I thought it looked very smart indeed, clean, smart and understated. 

Bravo Naim!

Yes, it's a fine machine on its own without an external PSU.  I've been very tempted as it's in a different league to my Nova, though I'm actually playing lots more vinyl recently and considering optimising standalone pre-amp/power for my vinyl first.

What are you running the NDS XS2 with to say it’s a different league to the Nova? With a NAIT XS2, it’s the same price, so that’s would be an interesting price for price comparison.

French Rooster posted:

perhaps the dealer managed to make the nd5xs2 sound bad, in order to sell the ndx2.  

Of course i can’t be sure and believe what you heard.   But normally the differences should be more on details, spaciousness, dynamics than warm and harsch.

Curious?       Or the ndxs2 was not burned in....

I tend to agree, something doesn’t sound right with the demo. The ND5XS2 is all about optimised SQ at the possible expense of convenience  and ease of use... Naim are very impressed with its SQ for its design envelope... one of the best they have been able to achieve at that budget apparently.. I can’t believe they would release a product that sounded harsh... harsh usually relates to poor electronics, interference such as RFI  and/or poor setup.

Simon-in-Suffolk posted:
French Rooster posted:

perhaps the dealer managed to make the nd5xs2 sound bad, in order to sell the ndx2.  

Of course i can’t be sure and believe what you heard.   But normally the differences should be more on details, spaciousness, dynamics than warm and harsch.

Curious?       Or the ndxs2 was not burned in....

I tend to agree, something doesn’t sound right with the demo. The ND5XS2 is all about optimised SQ at the possible expense of convenience  and ease of use... Naim are very impressed with its SQ for its design envelope... one of the best they have been able to achieve at that budget apparently.. I can’t believe they would release a product that sounded harsh... harsh usually relates to poor electronics, interference such as RFI  and/or poor setup.

If we’re talking about the same demo here, that was one almighty mullet of a system, using a £2k streamer/DAC into a £19k amp and £10k speakers (252/300/SCM50), which despite the earlier protestations of some others, I still maintain is not the way to show off the talents of an XS level source. I have a suspicion that it will sound just fine in a proper, balanced system. 

ChrisSU posted:

If we’re talking about the same demo here, that was one almighty mullet of a system, using a £2k streamer/DAC into a £19k amp and £10k speakers (252/300/SCM50), which despite the earlier protestations of some others, I still maintain is not the way to show off the talents of an XS level source. I have a suspicion that it will sound just fine in a proper, balanced system. 

Hi Chris,

I completely agree with your logic here too. Although I must say (still unbalanced but not ridiculously so) I did hear the ND5 XS 2 - NAC272-XPS-250DR into Dynaudio Emit 20 speakers yesterday and it sounded mighty fine to these ears, very hard to fault, so nice and arguably this can still be in the context of a mullet system. I shall be buying one with confidence, no worries as far as i'm concerned. Even my dealer was wowed and they have had the ND555 & NDX2 in their store for quite some time now..

I could of done a comparison side by side with a NDX but to me the ND5 XS 2 sounded so good that i'm not really that bothered now, whether the NDX at nearly the same price is better on not, after reflecting on things it's now become irrelevant in the context of my own system.

ChrisSU posted:
Simon-in-Suffolk posted:
French Rooster posted:

perhaps the dealer managed to make the nd5xs2 sound bad, in order to sell the ndx2.  

Of course i can’t be sure and believe what you heard.   But normally the differences should be more on details, spaciousness, dynamics than warm and harsch.

Curious?       Or the ndxs2 was not burned in....

I tend to agree, something doesn’t sound right with the demo. The ND5XS2 is all about optimised SQ at the possible expense of convenience  and ease of use... Naim are very impressed with its SQ for its design envelope... one of the best they have been able to achieve at that budget apparently.. I can’t believe they would release a product that sounded harsh... harsh usually relates to poor electronics, interference such as RFI  and/or poor setup.

If we’re talking about the same demo here, that was one almighty mullet of a system, using a £2k streamer/DAC into a £19k amp and £10k speakers (252/300/SCM50), which despite the earlier protestations of some others, I still maintain is not the way to show off the talents of an XS level source. I have a suspicion that it will sound just fine in a proper, balanced system. 

On the other hand, good speakers driven by good amplification should be capable of revealing exactly what a source is like, and enabling a true comparison of different sources. Maybe there was some issue with the room, or something not working right. 

Stephen Tate posted:
ChrisSU posted:

If we’re talking about the same demo here, that was one almighty mullet of a system, using a £2k streamer/DAC into a £19k amp and £10k speakers (252/300/SCM50), which despite the earlier protestations of some others, I still maintain is not the way to show off the talents of an XS level source. I have a suspicion that it will sound just fine in a proper, balanced system. 

Hi Chris,

I completely agree with your logic here too. Although I must say (still unbalanced but not ridiculously so) I did hear the ND5 XS 2 - NAC272-XPS-250DR into Dynaudio Emit 20 speakers yesterday and it sounded mighty fine to these ears, very hard to fault, so nice and arguably this can still be in the context of a mullet system. I shall be buying one with confidence, no worries as far as i'm concerned. Even my dealer was wowed and they have had the ND555 & NDX2 in their store for quite some time now..

I could of done a comparison side by side with a NDX but to me the ND5 XS 2 sounded so good that i'm not really that bothered now, whether the NDX at nearly the same price is better on not, after reflecting on things it's now become irrelevant in the context of my own system.

I’ll be interested to hear your findings if you make the comparison, Stephen. I might even consider ‘upgrading’ my NDX1 to an ND5XS2, but that would be with an external DAC. 

ChrisSU posted

If we’re talking about the same demo here, that was one almighty mullet of a system, using a £2k streamer/DAC into a £19k amp and £10k speakers (252/300/SCM50), which despite the earlier protestations of some others, I still maintain is not the way to show off the talents of an XS level source. I have a suspicion that it will sound just fine in a proper, balanced system. 

I think we are talking about my demos of a month ago and yesterday ChrisSU both of which featured humbler amplification and speakers.

French Rooster posted:

I think if someone wants to have a musical and well balanced system, without being tempted by upgrading, the nait5i with nd5xs2 is a good choice.  Just relax, enjoy, and not think of anything to improve in the future.

Hell yeah!

>said in a raised (Samuel Jackson) type of voice<

Chris, I do disagree.. one of the qualities of the 252 DR I find (and have written about it severeal tines on the forum) is that it shows off the abilities of any source attached to it.. the concept of a ‘mullet’ system simply doesn’t exist with it.. low end or top end sources sound the best they can.. if a source is sounding harsh it is either very poor (unlikely for a Naim product) or something is awry

Simon-in-Suffolk posted:

Chris, I do disagree.. one of the qualities of the 252 DR I find (and have written about it severeal tines on the forum) is that it shows off the abilities of any source attached to it.. the concept of a ‘mullet’ system simply doesn’t exist with it.. low end or top end sources sound the best they can.. if a source is sounding harsh it is either very poor (unlikely for a Naim product) or something is awry

Fair comment, Simon, but a little disappointing that the ND5XS2 in that system was found to be quite poor by, as far as I was aware, everybody who heard it. Even the NDX1 (bare) did not receive the same lukewarm reception. 

Nothing wrong with the sound of a ND5 XS 2. I heard one recently through NAC272 - XPS - 250DR - Dynaudio Emit20 speakers. Sounded lovely. People are either expecting way too much (I doubt it because the unit exceeded my expectations)  or, like some are saying, something was wrong in the set up they heard it in (more likely).

peter11 posted:

what i want to know is,, how an nd5xs2 + nait xs2 compares with a nova?

i mean they  are about the same price

and the nd5xs2 uses the same dac chip as the nova

Other than perhaps total speaker power, I would expect the ND5XS2 plus Nait xs2 to significantly outperform the Nova. The ND5XS2 has some of the same benefits as the ND555 ... albeit less of the usability bits such as a display and buttons but more of the SQ benefits, and is decoupled and separated from the amp.. Naim look at physical separation and physical decoupling  of  components as the ideal in terms of SQ and strive for it in their higher end devices.. obviously they recognise the consumer benefit of integration and consolidation but know it comes at a cost in terms of SQ, and so they strive to keep that SQ hit to a minimum.

I went for another demo of the ND5 XS 2 yesterday. This time comparing the Nait 5si to the Nait XS 2. The speakers were the same as the previous demo, Rega RX1's, the closest my dealer had in stock to my Roksan TR-5's.

Started with the Nait 5si and after around 30-45 minutes it really came on song. The more I listened the more I wanted to hear.

Next was the Nait XS 2, which for full disclosure is available at ex display price so within reach of my budget. 

I'm sure you'll be as puzzled as my dealer with my findings but "my ears, my money"...I didn't think performance wise it was much better than the 5si. In fact I found it extremely tiring to listen to. I found myself turning it down and not enjoying it at all. It just left me cold and knackered to be frank. 

I do think the speakers were the weak link. I'll be taking my speakers to the next demo. I really hope the next demo is more successful. Hopefully going next Saturday. 

Cheers 

Rob

 

BLACKMASS posted:

I went for another demo of the ND5 XS 2 yesterday. This time comparing the Nait 5si to the Nait XS 2. The speakers were the same as the previous demo, Rega RX1's, the closest my dealer had in stock to my Roksan TR-5's.

Started with the Nait 5si and after around 30-45 minutes it really came on song. The more I listened the more I wanted to hear.

Next was the Nait XS 2, which for full disclosure is available at ex display price so within reach of my budget. 

I'm sure you'll be as puzzled as my dealer with my findings but "my ears, my money"...I didn't think performance wise it was much better than the 5si. In fact I found it extremely tiring to listen to. I found myself turning it down and not enjoying it at all. It just left me cold and knackered to be frank. 

I do think the speakers were the weak link. I'll be taking my speakers to the next demo. I really hope the next demo is more successful. Hopefully going next Saturday. 

Cheers 

Rob

 

intresting,, had a pair of TR-5 few years back,,the tweeter is magical at their pricerange!,,

according to what hifi,  the Regas :

  • " need a considerable shot of energy from the rest of your system" ,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,maybe thats why the more bounceier nait 5si sounded more apealing?
BLACKMASS posted:

I went for another demo of the ND5 XS 2 yesterday. This time comparing the Nait 5si to the Nait XS 2. The speakers were the same as the previous demo, Rega RX1's, the closest my dealer had in stock to my Roksan TR-5's.

Started with the Nait 5si and after around 30-45 minutes it really came on song. The more I listened the more I wanted to hear.

Next was the Nait XS 2, which for full disclosure is available at ex display price so within reach of my budget. 

I'm sure you'll be as puzzled as my dealer with my findings but "my ears, my money"...I didn't think performance wise it was much better than the 5si. In fact I found it extremely tiring to listen to. I found myself turning it down and not enjoying it at all. It just left me cold and knackered to be frank. 

I do think the speakers were the weak link. I'll be taking my speakers to the next demo. I really hope the next demo is more successful. Hopefully going next Saturday. 

Cheers 

Rob

 

Hey Rob,

i'll certainly be interested in your findings. Although the 5SI is bottom ladder Naim integrated I think many on this forum (who have probably never heard one) underestimate it's music making. I'm not saying it's better than XS2 and it quite rightly should not be, but....

BLACKMASS posted:

Not sure if you've read my post wrong or I've read your post wrong? I haven't listened to the Naim gear with my Roksan's yet. I will be next though.

no ive understand that,,,just thinking regarding whathifis rewiev on the rega speakers ,,that might explain why you favoured the 5si

and that your roksans might more justify the qualitys of the xs2

how ever looking forward to your conclusions,,,,

im going myself this week to audition the same combo,,mostly comparing them vs the nova

im currently an owner of the Atom,and have compared it at home against the nova

finding that though its better,not worth the twice the money

very exited to find out if maybe the nd5xs2+xs2 is?

Bought my ND5xs2 last Saturday and I am very impressed. On top of the second fraim shelf with 252/300 it sounds great! Don‘t you scream please but I just stream apple music via AirPlay with my iPhone and for that it‘s a fantastic machine. Makes a lot of fun. And optical it looks great without an display on the top of the classic boxes. 

Had my third demo of the ND5 XS 2 Saturday morning. Having used the shops Rega RX1’s on the last two demos I decided to take my Roksan TR-5 speakers along with me. The same Chord Shawline speaker cable was used as previous demos, the only addition being the Chord speaker jumpers. Interconnect was the DIN lead which comes with the ND5 XS 2, as previously used on both demos.  

We started off with the Nait 5si. I liked it and there was an improvement over the Rega RX1’s. The Rega’s sound quite thin and hard compared to the Roksan’s. I still wasn’t wowed or convinced though.  

 After half an hour we swapped it out for the Nait XS 2. The Roksan’s revealed more of a difference, notice I didn’t say ‘improvement’. There was a bit more bottom end and everything seemed a bit more defined but after five minutes, maybe less I was turning the volume down and found it very fatiguing (something I found on the last demo with the Rega’s). I also started to notice sibilance, which I haven’t come across before. I was really struggling to listen to it. It was just too much and not enjoyable at all. I was not engaged at any point either.

After three demos I still wasn’t happy with either Naim amp. My dealer had mentioned the Exposure 2010 over the years. He’d said what a great match the amp was with my speakers. I wasn’t against trying the Exposure but I do have a ‘thing’ about components matching, so the 2010S2D was at a disadvantage from the off…

Firstly the interconnect was changed to the Shawline (RCA to RCA) to match the speaker cable. This is worth noting for later…

 The 2010S2D was fitted and within seconds the heavens opened and the waves parted. Hallelujah! Everything sprung into life. It was if the whole system had a shot of adrenaline and jumped into technicolour. The sound was fuller and became a lot more rhythmical. This showed off what the streamer was really capable of. For the first time I was excited and revealed to be completely honest.

After I’d listen to it for a while I told my dealer and he wasn’t surprised at my findings. He made the comment he thought I was trying to like the Naim and he hit the nail on the head. I’d gave the Naim amps a fair crack at the whip but try as I might they didn’t float my boat.

We swapped back to the Nait 5si keeping the Shawline interconnect in place. There was a definite improvement in detail retrieval but it still lacked the energy and engagement of the 2010 by some margin. However I was surprised how much the Naim DIN interconnect was holding the 5si back.

There were only two things holding the 2010 back. Obviously it didn’t match the Naim streamer and the demo unit was in a Silver finish and had retina piercing Blue LED’s. Thankfully the Black 3010 (the 2010 wasn’t available in the shop) had Red LED’s which are far more comfortable on the eye. Placing them side by side I can live with the mismatch boxes.

So there’s a few things to raise an eye brow or two. All three amps did sound different. I didn’t go for either Naim amp and changing the interconnect did make a big difference.

 I’ll be going for the ND5 XS 2 and 2010 very soon. 

 Cheers

Rob

Hi all,

Last weekend I went to my Naim dealer for a demo of the superuniti nova vs the nait xs2 + nd5 xs2. What a difference in favour of the seperates!! I heard them on Spector D7's with Chord company DIN interconnect and chord company speaker cable (epic). The XS2 and ND5 Xs2 were not connected to an extra power upgrade of any kind.

In Holland it's only €100,- difference in price and the uniti's looks are more modern to me. But I buy these for the quality of sound. 

The ND5 Xs2 / xs2xs2 combo gave a better stereo image, more detail and especially with a test track of O-Zone - jazz variants, it was very clear to me as to the dealer, that the nd5 xs2 was faster in pace. 

In my journey what to buy I also listened to Moon's neo ace with their mind 2, Hegel 190, Rega elicit r, Rega elex-r and even Primare. 

But the first time I heard the Naim Nait XS2 it was spot on for me. I found a youtube demo from Linn' DSM selekt where it performed better then the Nova, but was also €1000,- more expensive. So I did not go for Linn. That's also the reason I did not listen to the SN2.

Now I can't wait till I can pick them up at my dealer. I have a relative unknown speaker brand at the moment. Phonar Vertitas P3.5's which have been enhanced by a audio engineer in Holland. I also use a subwoofer from Phonar that's also tuner on these speakers. Those are upgraded next year I hope.

In short: I did only hear the nd5 xs2 and the one in the nova from Naim, because my budget did not allow a step higher. So my reference are the other streamers of other brands available at the moment in Holland and the uniti nova. For me the nd5 xs2 stands out way above the forementioned streamers.

 

I'm immensely curios as to why an external PSU upgrade option was removed from the ND5xs2. It seems like such a great device would have added appeal if users knew they could add a PSU or a Naim DAC. One is not possible and the other is no longer current so clearly not intended. 

Are PSUs being repositioned as Classic series only items now?

My recall of the forum visit was that  the ND5xs2 PSU question was not raised,  but I did get the impression from the description of product hierarchy that it was intended to be partnered with Nait amps.   (my own assumption is)  it’s designed to keep the price at a level commensurate with that range where PSU’s are not so popular / de rigueur & hence no display & PSU burndy plug

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