Qb needs dropping out of the window?

I bought the Qb about a year ago....all good for about 10 minutes?? Ok slight exaggeration but you get the drift...

More often then not, I open the Apple iPad an access the Naim app only to see ‘room can not be found ‘ ...... 

My dear wife has given up on it completely and gone back to the trusted and proven Roberts Radio.

About 3 weeks ago, the Qb gave up the ghost.... tried everything to make it work....but  nothing worked.

Spoke to my dealer, who requested I send it back...

A couple of days ago a brand new Qb arrived.... 

setting up should take about 5 minutes....???

An hour later after numerous attempts with ‘room  cannot be found ‘ .... eventually success... it’s up an running...... 

Next day..... it’s back too ‘room cannot be found ‘

turn off an on, reboot, check for any software upgrades  ect ect .... it’s still ‘room cannot be found ‘

Saturday morning, it’s still ‘room cannot be found’..

Do I pack it up before throwing out of the window or throw it out as it is?....

Original Post
Johnell posted:

Definitely sounds like a network issue.  Connecting to my 172 was flaky over wireless but an ethernet cable cured the problem. 

Edit: Our posts crossed.  If the cable is impractical can you try a wireless repeater close to the Atom?

I am using a wireless repeater... 

the Qb is only about 15ft away from router..

the only solution I think, would be to send a cable through wall and back in.... 

the other problem is no ports available on the router?

Sadly wireless networks are difficult for the average person to troubleshoot and are less than reliable for 101 different reasons. There is a tendency to think if you have a rock solid wireless experience (and it certainly can be reliable if the stars are aligned), that it is because you have done it right whilst others have done it wrong. The truth is, you can do everything right but there are just some limitations imposed by circumstance (the building you are in, other sources of RF like microwaves and older digital phones, how densely populated your immediate area is - my mobiles devices have been known to detect 64 wifi networks with moderate to high signal strength at home before) that will just confound your efforts.

The most aggravating pattern being that connectivity fails for one device and seems to work flawlessly for everything else. But I assure you, Naim products are not the only ones to suffer.

We have about 15 wireless devices at home. Anything that can be wired up is, but tablets and phones and stuff accumulate. A couple months ago, my wife's iPad refused to connect. No matter what we did, it claimed that the router rejected the password. As the resident IT person at home, I got the blame. She wanted to sling it out the window. The settings were correct. The other devices, including other iPads worked fine. The log on the router showed no connection attempts at all. 

The problem them intermittently fixed itself a month ago and then recently completely stabilised. Now, it could just as easily have been any other device in the home but the problem picked out that one item. Throughout all this it was fine with other networks out of the home. To top it off, I have the tools, training and knowledge to analyse the issue deeper and it is often what I do all day in my day job anyway but with a bunch of kids and operating in an already sleep deprived state, I could not be arsed. The average Joe stands no chance.

I had another device that would lose signal and report that no networks were available for a variable 20-40 minute period every night for some time between 11pm and 1am which I also never got to the bottom of.

For everything that matters go wired. Even with a wired network, there are enough things to muck up without bringing wifi protocols into the mix.

 

feeling_zen posted:

Sadly wireless networks are difficult for the average person to troubleshoot and are less than reliable for 101 different reasons. There is a tendency to think if you have a rock solid wireless experience (and it certainly can be reliable if the stars are aligned), that it is because you have done it right whilst others have done it wrong. The truth is, you can do everything right but there are just some limitations imposed by circumstance (the building you are in, other sources of RF like microwaves and older digital phones, how densely populated your immediate area is - my mobiles devices have been known to detect 64 wifi networks with moderate to high signal strength at home before) that will just confound your efforts.

The most aggravating pattern being that connectivity fails for one device and seems to work flawlessly for everything else. But I assure you, Naim products are not the only ones to suffer.

We have about 15 wireless devices at home. Anything that can be wired up is, but tablets and phones and stuff accumulate. A couple months ago, my wife's iPad refused to connect. No matter what we did, it claimed that the router rejected the password. As the resident IT person at home, I got the blame. She wanted to sling it out the window. The settings were correct. The other devices, including other iPads worked fine. The log on the router showed no connection attempts at all. 

The problem them intermittently fixed itself a month ago and then recently completely stabilised. Now, it could just as easily have been any other device in the home but the problem picked out that one item. Throughout all this it was fine with other networks out of the home. To top it off, I have the tools, training and knowledge to analyse the issue deeper and it is often what I do all day in my day job anyway but with a bunch of kids and operating in an already sleep deprived state, I could not be arsed. The average Joe stands no chance.

I had another device that would lose signal and report that no networks were available for a variable 20-40 minute period every night for some time between 11pm and 1am which I also never got to the bottom of.

For everything that matters go wired. Even with a wired network, there are enough things to muck up without bringing wifi protocols into the mix.

 

I am definitely not an expert.... but I stubbornly like to try and work things out...

I feel somewhat reassured after reading your post...

So thank you, your comments our much appreciated 

You can set your router to dish out IP addresses, or you can fix them. The former is called DHCP (Google it) and is the standard setting, and what you should use unless you know how to fix the addresses manually, which I imagine you don’t. So don’t worry. Under DHCP, addresses will change from time to time, but it doesn’t matter. 

Wireless extenders can be a nuisance, as while they extend the range they reduce the signal strength. For the Qb, a wire is the best way to get it working reliably, as you have found. 

I use a wi fi bridge to connect my Uniti to the network via a wired connection.  As I indicated in a previous post, it is notoriously unreliable.  It can go for days without any bother, then fail twice within one day.  I've never been able to work it out.  I'm considering a wired connection throughout the house.

Wenger, it sounds like you have wireless network issues.  I've moved this to the Streaming Audio room for you.

FWIW, I had terrible network problems and blamed all the wrong stuff.  In the end I bit the bullet and bought an Airport extreme and Airport expresses as wireless bridges and things have been much, much more reliable ever since.

Wireless Repeaters/Extenders are as much use as an ashtray on a motorbike. This is why you are having problems. Chuck it in the wheelie bin.

I have a single network cable running from the BT Hub upstairs into a "Network Switch" hidden from sight in the living room. This switch has 8 ports for my streamer, TV etc  I also have a WAP (Wireless access point) that my Qb connects to. Works perfectly every time, played two albums this morning glitch free.

A Netgear GS108 switch will should give you enough ports to have the Qb wired.  If you want wireless you'll need a WAP - again a Netgear should be fine.

You could also have your ISP move the router/incoming connection to a more suitable place.  Both BT and Virgin will do this, for a fee obviously.

Richard Dane posted:

Wenger, it sounds like you have wireless network issues.  I've moved this to the Streaming Audio room for you.

FWIW, I had terrible network problems and blamed all the wrong stuff.  In the end I bit the bullet and bought an Airport extreme and Airport expresses as wireless bridges and things have been much, much more reliable ever since.

Interestingly my WiFi signal is the best it’s ever been? 

Which makes it all the more frustrating...

ursus262 posted:

I use a wi fi bridge to connect my Uniti to the network via a wired connection.  As I indicated in a previous post, it is notoriously unreliable.  It can go for days without any bother, then fail twice within one day.  I've never been able to work it out.  I'm considering a wired connection throughout the house.

This is SOOO not a good idea... it really is frakensteining things.. use either Wifi or Ethernet, but don’t kludge them together using an Ethernet connection to the streamer and then using a Wifi link some where in the connection back to the router or the media server/NAS.

Naim optimise it’s parameters depending on whether Ethernet or Wifi... by doing this as you describe you have tricked the streamer into Ethernet dynamics, but actually giving it the dynamics of Wifi..this WILL not be reliable and dropouts and disconnections will be highly likely... though not assured of course.

If you do need to use a Wifi link in this way you SHOULD configure a dedicated point to point Ad-Hoc Wifi link using two dedicated standalone Wifi access points.. but most consumer equipment doesn’t offer this functionality.

I do think so many issues are caused by in appropriate connecting bits of consumer network equipment together without really understanding the impact... others include Wifi extenders, fibre media converters on Ethernet segments, and home hub powerline adapters etc... no wonder some of our performance Naim equipment struggles in such circumstances... it’s kind of like feeding a badly scratched  CD into a CDP and wondering why the CD sometimes skips or stops altogether... but yes sometimes you may get lucky and it will play through.....

I am not sure that is going to be that relevant, most consumer access points usually only change at startup.. when it will listen to local interference or activity on specific channels... and choose an optimum one within the limitations of its design.

The best way is to implement overlapping cooperating Wifi access points that are Ethernet connections offering a low power multi zone Wifi... perhaps put an access point in each of the floor hall/landing .. and wire each of them back to a switch. Enable as an ESSID.. and you almost certainly will have reliable high density Wifi... Ubiquiti offer such devices... avoid mesh setups and extenders/repeaters if you can for streaming...

I had similar connectivity issues with my QB. Sent it back to Signals who tested it and all was fine there. Came back to Asgaard, and kept getting dropouts and no plays, especially on BBC, whether ethernet or wifi.

Theory was that the BBC buffering of digital broadcasts was struggling with local demand at the exchange and that there was little w e could do.

Since then, Plusnet have solved a problem at their end and the BBC have changed something, and all is ticket boo...for now!

3 Airport extremes...

Simon-in-Suffolk posted:

I am not sure that is going to be that relevant, most consumer access points usually only change at startup.. when it will listen to local interference or activity on specific channels... and choose an optimum one within the limitations of its design.

The best way is to implement overlapping cooperating Wifi access points that are Ethernet connections offering a low power multi zone Wifi... perhaps put an access point in each of the floor hall/landing .. and wire each of them back to a switch. Enable as an ESSID.. and you almost certainly will have reliable high density Wifi... Ubiquiti offer such devices... avoid mesh setups and extenders/repeaters if you can for streaming...

What's wrong with Mesh? Since the demise of Apple's wifi provision. I was think ing that this might have to be my next course...

Simon-in-Suffolk posted:

I am not sure that is going to be that relevant, most consumer access points usually only change at startup.. when it will listen to local interference or activity on specific channels... and choose an optimum one within the limitations of its design.

 

I thought these new fangled smart hubs continually monitor channel usage, and switch if appropriate.

Although, logically if your wifi useage is high, the hub will sense this and switch channel.

Switching off auto and manually selecting channels isn’t as complicated as rewiring the whole house. No great loss if it doesn’t work, simply revert to auto.

Running the Ethernet cable out through the wall, along the outside of the house and then in again through the wall is a fine solution.  You can get outside Ethernet cable, but unless it’s very exposed probably anything will be fine. Don’t bend it too tight and you want water to run off the cable and not into the holes in the wall, which you can seal with gunk as well.

As has already been said you can use a small Ethernet switch to give you more ports from your router. There are a number of forum members who have gone for a used Cisco switch on the grounds of sound quality, but personally I find the Netgear GS105 at about £20 on eBay or Amazon is fine and anyway you don’t have to put your Qb cable into the switch. You could use the switch to free up a router port for the Qb. The GS105 is completely plug and play. There is no configuring of anything involved.

best

David

David Hendon posted:

Running the Ethernet cable out through the wall, along the outside of the house and then in again through the wall is a fine solution.  You can get outside Ethernet cable, but unless it’s very exposed probably anything will be fine. Don’t bend it too tight and you want water to run off the cable and not into the holes in the wall, which you can seal with gunk as well.

As has already been said you can use a small Ethernet switch to give you more ports from your router. There are a number of forum members who have gone for a used Cisco switch on the grounds of sound quality, but personally I find the Netgear GS105 at about £20 on eBay or Amazon is fine and anyway you don’t have to put your Qb cable into the switch. You could use the switch to free up a router port for the Qb. The GS105 is completely plug and play. There is no configuring of anything involved.

best

David

... I have limited time due to work commitments, so i like the idea of a permanent fix...... when I get to sit down i like things to work...

hence the reason for Sky Box, my home office printer and Qb all potentially ‘ out of the window ‘...

I have my Sky box and my laser printer connected to Netgear switches and they all just work all the time.

Personally I wouldn't go anywhere near ethernet over mains. I always regard it as the last resort of the desperate. (The only time I ever resorted to it I was desperate. It wasn’t an audio application and it did work, albeit not particularly well, but I wasn’t happy with it being there,)

best

David

David Hendon posted:

I have my Sky box and my laser printer connected to Netgear switches and they all just work all the time.

Personally I wouldn't go anywhere near ethernet over mains. I always regard it as the last resort of the desperate. (The only time I ever resorted to it I was desperate. It wasn’t an audio application and it did work, albeit not particularly well, but I wasn’t happy with it being there,)

best

David

Quick question,  is the Netgear GS105 a managed or unmanaged switch?

wenger2015 posted:
Willy posted:

Need one of these in the attic, and of course the associated cabling.

Willy.

Please explain more..... it may prevent me from having one of those ‘outer body experiences’ ...

Wenger,

It's one (of two) cabinets containing a 16 port gigabit Ethernet switch. There are multiple runs of Cat6 cable to pretty much every room in the house from one (or other) of these switches. My office/music room has 4 Ethernet sockets. The standalone workshop in the garden has wired Ethernet, even the new log cabin is wired.

Bottom line is that in our older house with 60cm+ thick walls wifi is a bit unreliable, even with four access points, so anything that can be cabled is.

The cabling to each room has been installed incrementally, generally scheduled when redecorating so I'm immediately painting over where I've tracked the wall to install cable.

Regards,

Willy.

PS In addition to the patch panel (at the bottom) where the cabling comes in, and the switch (above it with the lights on) there's also a small Linux server (top left) and a hard disk drive (top right) in the cabinet.

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