Quadraspire bamboo vs Fraimlite

I've been looking back through threads on the quadraspire bamboo racks but couldn't find any with a comparison to Fraimlite (as opposed to full fat Fraim). Was wondering if anyone had tried both? I was also wondering if anyone had compared the Q4 evo bamboo with the SVT bamboo? 

Original Post

We had a demo of bamboo SVT verses the full Fraim by Alester Kelli (Quadraspire product designer). His view is that the former beats or competes with the latter. It certainly acquits itself well. Perhaps the Fraim is more incisive and detailed whereas the bamboo SVT is smoother. Either way, it cured me of Fraim envy and I'm very happy with my Quadraspire. Also, it's smaller and looks much nicer. The bronze cones are very good, by the way.

Keith

Thanks very much for your reply, Keith. Did I see on old threads that you previously had q4 and experimented with bamboo shelves? I was also wondering about the difference between that and the SVT. The smaller rack would suit my space better but the big price difference suggests the larger rack is much better? 

The SVT is a step up on the Q4 (in performance, as well as looks). The bamboo is a further step up on the SVT, but a smaller step in my view. The brass isolation spikes for the top shelf lifts the performance again.  I've no experience of Framelite but one thing I particularly like about Quadraspire racks is their low maintenance.  

Thanks everyone for your thoughts comparing these racks. It is very difficult to demo or even see them when you live outside the UK! I currently have a Fraimlite but am considering a change because it doesn't fit at all in the living room where the system is. Hopefully one of the Quadraspires will give me similar performance. 

Geko - could I ask if you can describe what you mean by 'typical Naim sound'? I had assumed Fraim would add more clarity and space between notes?

I have three SVT racks and couldn't wish for better - certainly this side of sensible money. I did consider Fraims but was limited by the width of the space I had for them. The SVTs are also less of a dust trap. I also installed an SVT bamboo wall shelf in place of my old Target for my LP12. This one is supposedly optimised for the LP12 as it does way with the brass collars. It certainly looks less agricultural than the Target and is a perfect visual match for the racks.

The Q4 will not sound as good as a Fraimlite. If you do make the change only do it if you can get the SVT. I've been really pleased with mine, and I've had full Fraim in the past. The SVT is a doddle to set up, doesn't go out of tune, is easy to keep clean and with the bamboo version at least, has much better build quality than the SVT shelves. If you have a good source it's worth getting the bronze upgrade - it sounds better and to me looks better too. The spikes are expensive though. 

Hungryhalibut posted:

The Q4 will not sound as good as a Fraimlite. If you do make the change only do it if you can get the SVT. I've been really pleased with mine, and I've had full Fraim in the past.... 

Nothing like hands on Experience, some will prefer the 4 legged support rack, whilst the physics will support the Tri- pod support racks!

Many Moons Ago, I recall my Friend an Authorized Linn Dealer, explaining the idea support rack.

No Rack, imagine your LP 12 suspended in mid air, not connected to the Floor or Wall.

The Latter appears Trump the Former, being isolated from vibrations and movements, by heavier moving creatures.

Light weight high rigidity support racks, vs Heavy Cement Blocks, and Marble Slabs!

My Sound Factory Tri-pods Support Racks served me well over the last 2 decades.

But the Advantages of Naim's Fraim, forced me to pull the Trigger on it's Little Brother, which can be upgraded to reference standards!

No surprise that some will prefer the Three legged support rack vs the Four Legged Support Rack!

YMMV

Allante93!

PS. As far as looks, I always preferred showcasing the gear.

Black Boxes, Black Shelves, Black spacers, and Naim's logo Gleaming in the Dark, Suspended in mid air! 

 

 

Hi AI17,

Yes, the Fraim seems to add more of an 'edge' to everything, kind of more dynamic with less smear and a very solid underpinning bass that makes it very easy to hear exactly what's going on in the mix but sometimes, at very load volumes, it's almost too much and I miss that slightly romantic, slightly warmer and slightly more coloured sound I had with the Q4.

In reality I expect the Fraim is not really adding much to the sound, so you just hear a more characteristic 'Naim' sound from the system as a whole?   

Apologies for the question but anyone using the av version of these with a TV and naim on it? Which version you recommend 

recommendation and pics appreciated 

they are expensive but can start with 2 levels and add a third later. 

Thanks in advance 

Be aware that access to some non-Naim devices is restricted by the center rear post on the Fraim.  I have a FraimLite and can't access the USB input on my new Autender N10 streamer.

Also the power cord for my Aavik amp plugs in the center requiring that I have to mount it on the top shelf.

i had a Q4 but I think the FraimLite is sturdier.  

Bud

Access to some Naim products is also compromised by the central rear leg, e.g. NAC52.

Although I am a Fraim user myself, I do think it is grossly over priced.  There's only so long that you can argue that the development costs need to be recouped. Thereafter it's just a cash cow. Until the market dries up that is. Actually I wonder where it fits on a Boston Consulting Group growth/share matrix?

My new quadraspire bamboo svt arrived today so I thought I would come back to this thread and answer the question I started it with: how does the quadraspire rack compare to a Fraimlite? 

First things first. The quadraspire was well packaged and is beautifully finished. It is simple to put together but not quite as easy to stack the gear compared to the Fraimlite (where the levels can be lifted on and off one at a time). No problem with cable dressing and the burndies and SL interconnect are all off the floor (5 levels with 14cm columns). Colour wise, the bamboo matches quite well with my cherry ATC speakers, in case that helps others. I found it difficult to tell how light or dark it would be from photos online. 

So on to the big question - how does it sound? The first thing is that the two racks do sound different! My first impressions were that the QS sounds a bit darker but also smoother compared to the Fraimlite. However I also thought it was a little more congested. Not a big difference though, and this was after the system had been turned off while I built the new rack.  I then added the bronze upgrade spikes and was surprised at the difference they make. Fine details are easier to hear and the vocals stand out better in the mix. The bass lines are easier follow.

IMHO the quadraspire rack with the bronze upgrade is at least as good and in some ways better than the Fraimlite. My overall impression is that the music sounds smoother and  more relaxed. The sound with the Fraimlite is more forward and a bit sharper.  Both sound good and I am switching to the quadraspire mainly because I prefer the look.

Just my impressions, in my room, of course, but I hope they might help others considering these racks where a demo is not an option (as in my case).  

Finally, thanks again to everyone who posted in response to my questions. I'm really happy with the new rack!

 

 

 

 

I'm so pleased to read that you are happy with it; it's a bit worrying recommending something to someone who can neither see not hear it before taking the plunge. It's also interesting to read of your direct comparison to the Fraim Lite. The SVT bamboo is a jolly good rack, and for relatively sensible money too. 

tonym posted:

I agree the rear Fraim support's inconvenient at times, but with a bit of ingenuity you can remove it & replace with a suitable bolt.

I just rotated the support 90 degrees and now have access to both the USB and optical ports on the back of my Aurender N10 streamer.  It's not very nice looking but can't be seen.

Bud

AI17 posted:

My new quadraspire bamboo svt arrived today so I thought I would come back to this thread and answer the question I started it with: how does the quadraspire rack compare to a Fraimlite? 

First things first. The quadraspire was well packaged and is beautifully finished. It is simple to put together but not quite as easy to stack the gear compared to the Fraimlite (where the levels can be lifted on and off one at a time). No problem with cable dressing and the burndies and SL interconnect are all off the floor (5 levels with 14cm columns). Colour wise, the bamboo matches quite well with my cherry ATC speakers, in case that helps others. I found it difficult to tell how light or dark it would be from photos online. 

So on to the big question - how does it sound? The first thing is that the two racks do sound different! My first impressions were that the QS sounds a bit darker but also smoother compared to the Fraimlite. However I also thought it was a little more congested. Not a big difference though, and this was after the system had been turned off while I built the new rack.  I then added the bronze upgrade spikes and was surprised at the difference they make. Fine details are easier to hear and the vocals stand out better in the mix. The bass lines are easier follow.

IMHO the quadraspire rack with the bronze upgrade is at least as good and in some ways better than the Fraimlite. My overall impression is that the music sounds smoother and  more relaxed. The sound with the Fraimlite is more forward and a bit sharper.  Both sound good and I am switching to the quadraspire mainly because I prefer the look.

Just my impressions, in my room, of course, but I hope they might help others considering these racks where a demo is not an option (as in my case).  

Finally, thanks again to everyone who posted in response to my questions. I'm really happy with the new rack!

 

 

 

 

Al17, thanks for the feedback I've just ordered a SVT2 in Bamboo with SVT Bronze upgrades to replace my 15 year old original Quadrshire rack dealer has quoted about three weeks for delivery.

We auditioned the SVT + bronze cones verses the full fat Fraim. The latter is slightly punchier and detailed, whereas the Quadraspire is more organic. If sound quality is the only consideration then the Fraim wins, but not by a huge margin. If you take cost, appearance and practicality into consideration then the the SVT is a clear winner.

Keith 

Geko posted:

I've gone from a bamboo Q4 to a full fat Fraim, and whilst the Fraim adds more of that typical Naim sound it is very high maintenance. The lowly bamboo Q4 has a lovely organic sound, which even now I sometimes miss.

I'm thinking of maybe getting 2 Fraim racks for a system I'm considering buying, pending a demo and trade-in estimation for my current system.  I'm interested to know what it is about the Fraim that makes it high maintenance?  I used to have Mana stands and they were a pain maintenance-wise, followed by Townsend Seismic Sinks, which were even worse. I'd value your insights on what needs maintaining on a Fraim stand, beyond the intitial set-up.  Thanks

After about three months you need to take it apart and tighten everything up. Then do it again after another six months. After that, an annual tightening will keep it working properly. You need to get the glass the right way up and the spikes in the middle of the cups. And dusting is tricky. Sounds good though. 

My dealer recommends that you must tighten the all the hardaware  (spikes and nuts) on a regular basis. And when he says tight he means tight. Of course then there's the glass tuning to make sure it the right way up and the right way round. Getting the cone spikes in the centre of each lower inserts also helps. Then when you have everything set up you need to ensure that glass is central on all the ball bearings. And within a week you'll need to buy a special mop to keep all the glass free of dust.

Get it all correct and you are rewarded with a very neutral and dynamic sound, somewhat similar to the Mana sound but even better. Get it wrong and it can sound pretty mediocre.

By comparison the Quadraspire is simple plug & play. I've owned both, so know them well.

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