Allo DigiOne Signature

T38.45 posted:

I have the Shiit Eitr, very happy with the SQ (running Audirvana+itunes> USB--Shiit-SPDIF). Could I be happy with  it until the end of days? YES!

Yes, the Eitr is very good but how does it compare to the DigiOne Signature? Both offer S/PDIF outputs, require a power supply and cost about the same. Of course, the Eitr can be used with any USB class 2 device whereas the DigiOne is a specific RPi hat. Still, I think that it would be interesting to compare the two devices with the Eitr connected to a USB port of its hosting RPi.

RX8R3Rod posted:

Great to hear, Michael, hope you really enjoy it! ???????? Do let us all know how you get on.

Got mine today. 

After an initial network connectivity problem it works fine (via Roon).

(It received an IP address via DHCP but I couldn’t ping or ssh into it. After unplugging BOTH power sources and plugging-in again, clean first and dirty second, it worked.) 

I powered the previous DigiOne via USB from my nDAC and wanted it to use as clean source. Unfortunately the Signature has another connector. Don't know which type this is and if there is an adaptor from Micro USB to the DigiOne Signature power input. I ordered the battery pack for powering the clean side. But after reading elsewhere that it consumes about 65 mAh and lasts only about two days I won't use it. Currently the dirty side and clean side are powered by the power supplies Allo ships. Dirty from a standard wall outlet, clean from a Netzleiste PLUS.

Despite of the initial networking problem and having a hard time removing the protective film it is and sounds great. A little more resolution, better timing. 

Now waiting for a home demo to compare it to the NDX2. 

Hi Michael, thanks for posting!

I think the connector is a USB C type?

Great to hear you found the Signature an improvement - it really does somehow seem to time better, doesn’t it?

It should make a really interesting comparison to the NDX2.

It might perhaps be worth giving the battery pack a quick try when it arrives? It would seem to be (amongst) the best-sounding power source for the clean side just now, and should let you hear what the Sig can really do.

But regardless, please do tell how you get on when comparing the Sig to the Naim, or vice-versa. ????

michael1702 posted:

RX8R3Rod posted:

Great to hear, Michael, hope you really enjoy it! ???????? Do let us all know how you get on.

...

I powered the previous DigiOne via USB from my nDAC and wanted it to use as clean source. Unfortunately the Signature has another connector. Don't know which type this is and if there is an adaptor from Micro USB to the DigiOne Signature power input. I ordered the battery pack for powering the clean side. But after reading elsewhere that it consumes about 65 mAh and lasts only about two days I won't use it. Currently the dirty side and clean side are powered by the power supplies Allo ships. Dirty from a standard wall outlet, clean from a Netzleiste PLUS.

Despite of the initial networking problem and having a hard time removing the protective film it is and sounds great. A little more resolution, better timing. 

Now waiting for a home demo to compare it to the NDX2. 

I am using a DigiOne coonected to a Naim DAC via DC1 BNC/BNC cable. The DigiOne is powered by a ifi iPower. The ifi is  grounded as explained in John Swenson's thread "SMPS and grounding" in the UpTone Audio CA Forum.

I am interested in how you power your DigiOne from the nDAC. Have you used a USB-A to micro-USB cable? If so, have you used the front or the rear USB port of the nDAC?

If you think that the USB ports of the nDAC are clean sources of 5V DC power for the clean side of the DigiOne Signature, you could simply use a USB-A to USB-C cable. I am not sure that the nDAC is a good source for the Signature, however. I also am not sure that is a good idea to have an Allo SMPS plugged into the Netzleiste PLUS if this is used to power the nDAC or other sensitive equipment: SMPS PSUs typically inject electrical noise back into the mains.

I am also considering ordering a Signature and I am interested in you comparisons. How do you plan to compare the Signature to the NDX2? Are you going to compare [Ethernet > NDX2] to [Ethernet > Signature > nDAC] or are you planning to connect the Signature to the S/PDIF input of the NDX2? Have you already compared NDX2 and nDAC?

No matter what you'll do, please let us know your findings!

Yes, I powered the DigiOne (which is also connected via DC1 BNC/BNC cable) with a USB-A to micro-USB cable using the rear USB port of the nDAC. A USB-A to USB-C cable is on its way. 

Thanks for the hint with the SMPS plugged into the Netzleiste PLUS. I will try with another outlet. 

Yes, I am planning to compare [Ethernet > NDX2] to [Ethernet > Signature > nDAC]. For me connecting the Signature to the S/PDIF input of the NDX2 makes no sense because I only want one box. 

Haven't heard the NDX2 yet. (Btw., I wish there would be a NDX2 without a display because I don't think it's necessary and it would make it better priced). 

michael1702 posted:

Yes, I powered the DigiOne (which is also connected via DC1 BNC/BNC cable) with a USB-A to micro-USB cable using the rear USB port of the nDAC. A USB-A to USB-C cable is on its way. 

Thanks for the hint with the SMPS plugged into the Netzleiste PLUS. I will try with another outlet. 

Yes, I am planning to compare [Ethernet > NDX2] to [Ethernet > Signature > nDAC]. For me connecting the Signature to the S/PDIF input of the NDX2 makes no sense because I only want one box. 

Haven't heard the NDX2 yet. (Btw., I wish there would be a NDX2 without a display because I don't think it's necessary and it would make it better priced). 

Thanks for the clarifications! I am looking forward to read your findings about Signature+nDAC vs. NDX2. I am not sure that powering the clean side of the Signature with the USB port of the nDAC is a good idea. The port can certainly provide enough current for the clean side of the Signature but I have no idea how good or how bad it is. It is a very interesting idea though and being able to power the Signature through the nDAC would be very convenient: thanks for mentioning this possibility!

Tomorrow my great naim dealer will visit me with three black boxes (NDX2, 252, SCDR). 

I want to test: 

• Digione Signature, nDAC, XPS vs. NDX2, XPS
• 282, SC vs. 282, SCDR
• 282, SC vs. 252, SCDR

Any track suggestions for testing are welcome. 

Hope you have a great time! ????????

Best to stick to music that you know, enjoy yourself.

michael1702 posted:

Tomorrow my great naim dealer will visit me with three black boxes (NDX2, 252, SCDR). 

I want to test: 

• Digione Signature, nDAC, XPS vs. NDX2, XPS
• 282, SC vs. 282, SCDR
• 282, SC vs. 252, SCDR

Any track suggestions for testing are welcome. 

Enjoy the comparisons! May I also suggest that beside comparing

* Ethernet > Digione Signature > nDAC

and

* Ethernet > NDX2

you also try

* Ethernet > NDX2 > nDAC

? I understand that very few NDX2 perspective owners will buy the streamer just to use it as a transport. On the other hand, the NDX2 has a S/PDIF output and thus can be connected to DACs with S/PDIF inputs. Why should Naim have provided a S/PDIF output if the NDX2 was not meant to be used as a transport?

I do not have any concrete track suggestion but I was lucky enough to have a long ND555 demo last week (thanks again to my dealer!). It was not meant to be a comparison and I just spent about three hours listening to a fantastic system. I had my music with me.

What I found most impressing is that pieces that I find to be "difficult" or "potentially problematic" in my system were sounding absolutely natural in the ND555 system. Thus, I suggest that, among others, you pick up one or two tracks that you consider to be problematic and try them on the demo systems.

Problematic for me are most always sequences of symphonic music: fortissimo sequences with a lot of high pitched instruments can become a pain because of lack of separation or perhaps even distorsion. But also certain interpretations of Vivaldi can sound tiring on my system. Conversely, I have never felt any problems with jazz or with vocal music, included opera.

It very much depends on your system and speakers of course but, if you happen to have a track that you know very well and that you find problematic for some reason, just try it on the demo systems. Good luck! Have fun and, please, report your findings.

That’s a great point re using a couple of ‘difficult’ tracks IMHO.????????

And with the Signature comparisons I do wonder if it might be worth using the battery option into the ‘clean’ Signature input if you can?

I’ve been experimenting some more and at least in my system it really makes a difference.

LiPo 18650 batteries clearly work better for me than ifi iPower alone (ie no use of iFi Nano or Micro USB 3.0), which was clearly better (in my system, anyway) than the Allo SMPS when fed into the ‘clean’ input.

However over the last couple of days I’ve been experimenting with taking a feed from a 9v iPower, regulating it to 5V and filtering with some nice Panasonic and WIMA caps. This might (still trying to draw a conclusion) be even better than the battery power (it does seem to have more drive), and I think my next step is to try a spare 12v iPower then double-regulate and filter it down to 5v, with plenty of parallel bypass.

That might be a disaster, ... but then it might not ????

Either way, it seems that even with all the steps Allo have taken to isolate the Signature and filter it’s input, etc the power supply still makes quite a difference ... so might be worth considering in your comparisons?

Have fun! ????

RX8R3Rod posted:

And with the Signature comparisons I do wonder if it might be worth using the battery option into the ‘clean’ Signature input if you can?

 

I tried it yesterday and it sounds great! 

Have you noticed too that using the Allo SMPS switches the right/left channels when not using the adapter included with the battery pack? Strange... 

Hi Michael, it’s really quite a pleasant surprise, isn’t it? ????

Are you using 2 batteries or 4? I’ve only tried 2 so far, but I suspect 4 may be better ..

I haven’t noticed that (how weird is that effect?) but currently one of my ears is blocked so I’m sort of listening in mono ???? so that probably explains why. As soon as I am restored to 2 functioning ears I should notice. 

Have fun with the demo!! ????????

Allo doesn't seem to make a version with optical output -- am I right about that?

Bart posted:

Allo doesn't seem to make a version with optical output -- am I right about that?

No -- and I believe to recall that Allo said that adding an optical output comprised the sound quality. I think this was mentioned in a video by the Dutch guy on YouTube -- Hans B-something.

Timo posted:

Bart posted:

Allo doesn't seem to make a version with optical output -- am I right about that?

No -- and I believe to recall that Allo said that adding an optical output comprised the sound quality. I think this was mentioned in a video by the Dutch guy on YouTube -- Hans B-something.

Thanks Timo.  I seem to be pretty engaged with Roon, which leaves me a bit on an island with my Qute2.  Trading it towards an Atom may be the solution; a lot of money merely to add Roon and I'm not sure Atom + NAP100 will sound that different than Qute2+NAP100.  But again, I'm pretty engaged with Roon.

I tried Allo DigiOne as Roon Endpoint (with DietPi as OS) -- it worked well. The Qute has an S/PDIF input, right? Not sure whether the Signature version would be worthwhile into the Qute. 

Timo posted:

I tried Allo DigiOne as Roon Endpoint (with DietPi as OS) -- it worked well. The Qute has an S/PDIF input, right? Not sure whether the Signature version would be worthwhile into the Qute. 

Silly me - yes it has both optical and co-ax RCA. I'll just use the DigiOne with DietPi.

michael1702 posted:

RX8R3Rod posted:

And with the Signature comparisons I do wonder if it might be worth using the battery option into the ‘clean’ Signature input if you can?

...

Have you noticed too that using the Allo SMPS switches the right/left channels when not using the adapter included with the battery pack? Strange... 

Ooops, that seems really strange! Perhaps worth reporting to Allo? Thanks for the info, nbpf

RX8R3Rod posted:

Are you using 2 batteries or 4? I’ve only tried 2 so far, but I suspect 4 may be better ..

 

Using 4 and will try USB power from nDAC tomorrow - but heard the NDX2 today. 

Here we go... 

As good as the Allo DigiOne Signature sounds, there has to be a difference for 17 x the price. And there definitely is:  a finer resolution and more details. It just fits to the whole system it's made for. 

Using the Signature again we switched the SC for the SCDR. Definitely a difference with more separation and more "drive/power". 

Next adding the 252. After a few seconds I felt "at home". Just more "atmosphere", warmth. Hard to describe. More of a feeling of relaxation, "being settled". 

The return of NDX2. Maybe shouldn't have done this. ;-) The system to go for. Great and everything as it should be. More resolution, details again but with the added 252/SCDR benefits. 

I know I should go source first but I like the 252/SCDR very much. But the "problem" is that the offer is really great and rather rare. I would get them in exchange for my 282/SC for the price of a NDX2 (with returning my nDAC). They are like new (got DRed/new potentiometer a few months ago before the user heard the  new Kudos and my dealer told him to try the 552 with it. ;-)

Currently listening to the DigiOne Signature/252/SCDR which sounds really nice. But now I know the way to go. No, not 552 but 252/NDX2. 

michael1702 posted:

Here we go... 

As good as the Allo DigiOne Signature sounds, there has to be a difference for 17 x the price. And there definitely is:  a finer resolution and more details. It just fits to the whole system it's made for. 

Using the Signature again we switched the SC for the SCDR. Definitely a difference with more separation and more "drive/power". 

Next adding the 252. After a few seconds I felt "at home". Just more "atmosphere", warmth. Hard to describe. More of a feeling of relaxation, "being settled". 

The return of NDX2. Maybe shouldn't have done this. ;-) The system to go for. Great and everything as it should be. More resolution, details again but with the added 252/SCDR benefits. 

I know I should go source first but I like the 252/SCDR very much. But the "problem" is that the offer is really great and rather rare. I would get them in exchange for my 282/SC for the price of a NDX2 (with returning my nDAC). They are like new (got DRed/new potentiometer a few months ago before the user heard the  new Kudos and my dealer told him to try the 552 with it. ;-)

Currently listening to the DigiOne Signature/252/SCDR which sounds really nice. But now I know the way to go. No, not 552 but 252/NDX2. 

 

Did you compare Allo/NDac vs NDX2? If so, would be interesting to know how Allo and NDX2 (as transport) into NDac compare? This way the Dac “variable” would be taken out of the comparison. 

We talked about but didn't demo NDX2 into the nDAC because my dealer told me (and I believe it too) that the DAC in the NDX2 is better than the nDAC. 

That’s great that you have found what you were really wanting, by the sound (sorry ...) of it. It’s just a shame it involves many pennies, although it sounds like you’ve got a great deal lined up! ????

And please do let us all know how any other tests go! ????????

michael1702 posted:

We talked about but didn't demo NDX2 into the nDAC because my dealer told me (and I believe it too) that the DAC in the NDX2 is better than the nDAC. 

Probably, but I thought about this as an exercise to know better about the transport quality of the Allo DigiOne Signature. Assessing the Allo and NDac against NDX2 doesn‘t necessarily tell you anything about the Allo — maybe it‘s the NDac that drives you towards the NDX2...