The Hugo of streaming?

SamS posted:

Brill - you have been busy. Good to know that the Zerozone is working as expected and that you are getting good results from the IR. 

So now all that's needed is either the 1.4 board upgrade or UltraRendu to let us know it the IR becomes redundant , which I really hope it would. As mentioned above I don't want to be tempted by more boxes in the chain. 

I tried the uR with/without Iso Regen. In my setup my conclusion is that the IR can be considered redundant as I could not come to any definite preference.

My preference at the moment is to keep the mR/LPS-1/USPCB/IR combo intact in one setup and use a TP 7/2 for the uR in another. I quite like the TP 7/2>uR (a bit to my surprise) but a lot more listening to come before definite conclusions!

OK. I have earthed both my LPSU cases, and used the spare Swenson loom connector to attach the SBooster that I also use - yes, there is a further small improvement.

I have just bought an ART PB4x4 Pro to try with my HiFi items in my rack.

M

ART PB4x4 Pro:
Changed my mind on this. I am going to follow the John Swenson advice, a very simple PDU + an isolator. His advice:

Contrary to all "it makes sense to me" thoughts on the subject the way cut down on leakage loop noise with the DAC and pre/power amps is to have the tightest coupling you can get in the AC domain. Since a leakage loop goes through the AC main the higher the impedance in the mains side the higher the noise voltage generated between the boxes. I know the power conditioner is trying to suppress noise on the mains, but the methods frequently used actually increase the impedance between outlets thus increasing the noise from leakage loops.

So to test this hypothesis, try taking the power conditioner out of the system and just use a very simple power strip, no filters, nothing fancy, just outlets connected by wires. This will give a very low impedance between the AC to each power supply, which should cut down on the noise generated by leakage loops. Everything you now have connected to the power conditioner should go into the simple power strip, including all the digital stuff.

and:

The isolation transformer I'm using is a Topaz model, it is a very special transformer. It has extremely low inter-winding capacitance (.005pf according to the manufacturer). Most transformers have two mechanisms that transfer AC from one side to the other: magnetic and capacitive. The magnetic part is low frequency (it is what the 50/60Hz mains signal uses) and the capacitive is high frequency. The combination means that a "normal" transformer lets a lot of high frequency crud through.

The PDU I have bought, via the bay, is a simple UK plug 19" rack jobby with no switch or LEDs - for a princely £25. I know need to find a low inter-winding capacitance isolation transformer, any suggestions/experience?

There are Topaz transformers 2nd hand in the states, non in the UK that I have found. The transformers I have seen don't mention inter-winding capacitance.

In the meanwhile I will use the new strip to power: HiFi LPSUs.

Leaving my rack strip to power: Switch; Nas; LMCs; and, Servers.

The theory here being that where the HiFi does interface with the other items it is via CAT5 cables, and so galvanically isolated. Once I have a suitble isolation transformer in place then any route via AC will also be blocked.

Cheers,

M

If you are willing to buy new, I believe JS mentioned that the direct descendant of the Topaz is the  Eaton Power-Suppress 100 series. They seem to have worldwide distribution.

I tried the ZeroZone 9V/2.7A on the LPS-1/uR but cannot get it to boot up properly (not enough juice?!). It does power the combo once booted. It has no issues with the LPS-1/mR.

i thought that my network with 2 fmc converters, optical fibers and 2 linear ps for my serve and fmc, plus an acoustic revive isolator before my audio switch was already too much complicated.   But vs yours, it is plug and play....

No critic from myself,  just a share.....

I bet someone somewhere thought life would get a lot simpler with 0s and 1s!

Hi FR,

Trying to improve the quality of power through my system has risen dramatically for me sice I cured a lot of my ills by attending to my grounding in my system, all for four pieces of wire. These enhancements are, in HiFi terms, dirt cheap.

Been listening to my system tonight, I don't know if it was the changes I put in over the last couple of days just settling in, or reaching some sort of equilibrium, but iot is sounding REALLY good.

Had to have some work done on my LP12 and got that back this evening, thanks Mike. My immediate thought was, 'The LP12 is still better, apart from the bass'. However, on longer listening I think my digital and vinyl just sound different. Digital is far more 3D and transparent. Vinyl via the LP12 sounds far more Linn/Naim, a bit more wall of sound, denser. I rather like the fact that I can have the best of either world!

Hi Brilliant,

Brilliant I have read that the relevant Eaton PSUs are not available in the UK, but I will double check. I have sent off a couple of emails today questioning a couple of firms about their balanced transformers and their inter winding capacitance.

I will report back.

M

I think this ground shunt trick has been just about the biggest improvement in my system(s). It’s like rediscovering music for the first time again. I have pretty bad tinnitus and this has taken a real load off. Problem is now I just want to loaf and listen all the time. 

Hi Charles,

The one that really worked for me was working out the grounding in my main system, which included getting rid of all the SMPS. The grounding in my 'back-end' systems is more subtle but worthwhile, using the JS grounding loom  ;-D

M

Brilliant posted:

 

I tried the ZeroZone 9V/2.7A on the LPS-1/uR but cannot get it to boot up properly (not enough juice?!). It does power the combo once booted. It has no issues with the LPS-1/mR.

 

The ZeroZone directly on the uR is just about the equal of the LPS-1 from what I am hearing- another pleasant surprise. It is staying put! I have the JS GND-shunt on it as well. I guess it points to how more robust to these ps the uR is compared to the mR!

Grounding
Sorting this out has had a huge impact on my system. A quick recap:

pa = pre-amp
ps = LPSU

In my system I ran wires from:
ultraRendu > pa
Singxer-F1 > pa
Border Patrol DAC > pa
uR ps > pa

This exercise rid my system of the hard sibilence I kept hearing, improved the transparency (detail) and THE BASS.

Three days ago I repeated this exercise on my back-end components in the loft:

js = John Swenson Earthing Loom (link above)
pg = plug
cs = case

LPSU for LPS-1 cs > pg [powers RPi3 and USB3 hub]
LPSU for StarTech REX cs > pg
LPSU for StarTech LEX js > pg

Two additional non-HiFi SMPS js > pg

Improved the transparency (detail) and THE BASS.

Yesterday I re-organised my rack in the loft:

All PSUs on one shelf.
Routed signal and powercables to minimise cross-over.
Signal handling components shelf two below PSUs.

Improved the transparency (detail) and THE BASS.

Next step:
Bought a cheap BT 4A 1kva isolating transformer as an experiment.
Bought a simple 6 plug rack PDU.
Move three LPSU plugs onto PDU + related earthing plug.

In instituting these changes there is always a settling in period, BUT the bass has immediately become clearer, faster and more impactful. As this has cleaned up so had everything else.

Funnily enough at Church we have just invested some money in the audio side of things, this included a screen for the drum kit. This means that what is heard now come through the PA system. This has cleaned up the sound immensely bringing things into balance; not dissimilar to my HiFi!

M

I know, amazing tweak. I’m a bit confused about the first part of wires to the pre-amp. Could you elaborate? 

My system sounds unbelievable now. I feel a bit bad for anyone, no matter the level of gear, who hasn’t done this ground tweak yet on their network. Even with a $10k streamer/DAC it’s only going to be garbage in/garbage out (though very nice sounding garbage). DAC’s treat “noise” as it it’s music - how could it differentiate otherwise. 

Next for me is the rendu 1.4 board upgrade, and maybe add a couple of LT3045 regulators here and there esp as I can just slot them in with the already made ground shunts. 

The uR does not just give more of the mR allowing a more natural sonic, it also edges it in  'musicality' , more captivating. More music please!

I think that some interesting things have come out of this exercise for me:

1. That the quality of power & noise into your server has a very direct bearing on what you hear through your system
In my case a Raspberry Pi 3. LPS-1 + R-Core LPSU > etc
Putting in a 0.5A 5v LT3045 made the sound VERY clean, but made the RP unstable and robbed the music of dynamics.
I have ordered a 1A 5v LT3045.

2. Ensuring that everything in your main HiFi is properly grounded is essential (see above)

3. Ensuring everything in your digital backend is also grounded is essential, although not as evident as (2)
In my case that uincludes putting all the HiFi elements onto the same Power Distribution Unit (PDU)
PDU = as simple as possible, no filters or lights.
Put in place a simple Isolation Transformer (IT) to protect the digital back end from mains borne rubbish.

So, having done everything else what was the effect of the IT?

Not dissimilar to an LT3045, but across the board. Most notably:

1. Cymbals now ring true - and for a looooooong time;

2. Mass violins now sound true, not always the case before; and

3. As always, the bass gets more defined, and this in turn means that other details are revealed.

LPS-1

This is a good PSU, it is still improved by a LT3045 - so, I feel that a cheapish Chinese R-Core PSU + LT3045 is better than an LPS-1 .....as long as you are not concerned by leakage current, and I am yet to be convinced (N.B. not cynical or disbelieving, just need to actually hear it) .

M

Brilliant posted:

..

I have been running the UltraRendu for a day or so. When I got it I could not get it to show on the LAN. After several hours of frustration I decided to try the mR 2.5 SD and it worked! The only difference is that the GUI reports it an mR. I guess it was corrupted! The underlying s/w (mR or uR) is apparently the same. Hopefully a replacement Ultra SD 2.5 will shortly be on its way, having talked to Sonore about it.

..

B.

QA alert!

The new SD card did absolutely nothing! The uR is going back to Sonore for service. Bummer!

Brilliant posted:

The uR does not just give more of the mR allowing a more natural sonic, it also edges it in 'musicality' , more captivating. More music please!

In case it is taken out of context - the 'musicality' diff is really slight and obviously subjective. I am listening to a favorite album via the mR(1.3)/ZeroZone/Iso Regen/LPS-1/USPSCB, and struggling with the (bold) statement's certainty above, that is how slight the difference is, IME.

Hi Brilliant,

Sorry about the uR. Mine was DOA, Jesus and Mertin at Vortexbox sorted it out for me, worked flawlessly since.

M

Hi M,

Thank you. It is on its way to Small Green Computer to have its f/w re-flashed. I should have it back next week!

B.

I got the uR back and it is feeding the DAC-V1  beautifully! There is something about it that the mR misses, it is like a disappearing act - impressive!

Hi B,

Yes, I agree.

M

Uptone USPCB A to B

Well, this was a surprise - at least to me.

My chain moved from (simplified):

LPS-1 > RP3 > CISCO Swtch > FMC > FMC > Netgear Swtch (LPSU) > EMO70HD > ultraRendu > mR USB Adapter > AQ Jitterbug > Adapter > IFI Prfr 2 >

To:

LPS-1 > LT3045 5v (0.5A) > RP3 etc

As doumented above this was superbly transparent and rid my HiFi of nearly all traces of digital edge. Unfortunately 0.5A is woefully underpowered, and the RP3 struggled to function, and the music was robbed of a certain amount of .......balls.

Removing the LT3045 restored heft, and a bit of edge. I have three 5v 1A cards en-route.

As I was experimenting with the chain I decided to remove the AQ Jitterbug and hear whether is was still needed after all the work I have done on my grounding/earthing/isolation. Answer: YES. Removing it added a degree of dynamics at the cost of edge ......at least for Qobuz.

Now I find that the StarTech files are pretty consistently BETTER than Qobuz, and less prone to edge.

In the meanwhile I thought I would take an outside shot on the Uptone USPCB A to B. This was fit into the above chain as follows:

-(AQ Jitterbug & USB adapter)
+(Uptone USPCB A to B)

Result:
Initially there was a touch more edge, this reduced and reduced over the following three hours. What was apparent immediately was a step up in tonality and timbre.

Interestingly, the Uptone is now doing a great job of removing the edge which I hate, such that I am happy to live without the AQ jitterbug. I also find the soundstage is more obviously layered front to back.

I am REALLY looking forward to how things sound when I cab slot in the new 1A LT3045.

Verdict: I think the Uptone USPCB A to B is a slam dunk if you have either the mR or uR. Superb VFM.

M

Hi M,

I agree too about the USPCB!

Did you ever look into the 'ethernet bridge' ?  You could have the RP3 after your EMO, direct into the uR. Probably the biggest punch against that 'digital edge' IME. It needs an extra USB port  and some code I guess.

ATB.

B.

Brilliant posted:

Hi M,

I agree too about the USPCB!

Did you ever look into the 'ethernet bridge' ?  You could have the RP3 after your EMO, direct into the uR. Probably the biggest punch against that 'digital edge' IME. It needs an extra USB port  and some code I guess.

ATB.

B.

If the RP3 serves local files to the uR, it should be possible to directly connect the uR to the RP3's Ethernet port and use the RP3's wireless interface for control. I have done it the other way round (the RP3's wireless interface acts as an access point for mobile devices).

Good point NBPF! Worth a test.