Brexit or Bust !!

Adam Meredith posted:

Huge posted:

Debs, you can tell the elephant's got sense though - it's female!

Weird - I could have sworn I saw a cock between its legs.

Listening to the debate in the House of Commons this afternoon feels like groundhog day.  A number of MPs, including Conservatives, pointing out the weaknesses in the letter of reassurance from the EU;  the overwhelming majority of MPs speaking negatively towards the PM's draft deal; and the PM remaining unmoved by the many offers from Opposition MPs of co-operation to find a way forward if her deal is voted down tomorrow.   Meanwhile another resignation with a government whip (a Brexiteer) saying he can't the PM's draft deal.  It's like watching a car-crash in slow motion.   

“Even though large tracts of Europe and many old and famous States have fallen or may fall into the grip of the European Parliament and all the odious apparatus of  Juncker’s rule, we shall not flag or fail. We shall go on to the end. We shall fight in France, we shall fight on the seas and oceans, we shall fight with growing confidence and growing strength in the air, we shall defend our island, whatever the cost may be. We shall fight on the beaches, we shall fight on the landing grounds, we shall fight in the fields and in the streets, we shall fight in the hills; we shall never surrender, and if, which I do not for a moment believe, this island or a large part of it were subjugated and starving, then our Empire beyond the seas, armed and guarded by the British Fleet, would carry on the struggle, until, in God's good time, the New World, with all its power and might, steps forth to the rescue and the liberation of the old”.

911gt3r posted:

“Even though large tracts of Europe and many old and famous States have fallen or may fall into the grip of the European Parliament and all the odious apparatus of  Juncker’s rule, we shall not flag or fail. We shall go on to the end. We shall fight in France, we shall fight on the seas and oceans, we shall fight with growing confidence and growing strength in the air, we shall defend our island, whatever the cost may be. We shall fight on the beaches, we shall fight on the landing grounds, we shall fight in the fields and in the streets, we shall fight in the hills; we shall never surrender, and if, which I do not for a moment believe, this island or a large part of it were subjugated and starving, then our Empire beyond the seas, armed and guarded by the British Fleet, would carry on the struggle, until, in God's good time, the New World, with all its power and might, steps forth to the rescue and the liberation of the old”.

That's the spirit, Peter. 

Well Mike, there were worse times ahead then, compared to what we are facing now.  ATB Peter

911gt3r posted:

Well Mike, there were worse times ahead then, compared to what we are facing now.  ATB Peter

Very true, Peter, though at least we knew who was on each side then!   

MDS posted:

911gt3r posted:

Well Mike, there were worse times ahead then, compared to what we are facing now.  ATB Peter

Very true, Peter, though at least we knew who was on each side then!   

And then we (possibly) had little choice but to do something.

Now... it's a crisis of our own making.  

MDS, I have sent you an email ( using your 2013 address hoping it’s still active) ATB Peter

911gt3r posted:

MDS, I have sent you an email ( using your 2013 address hoping it’s still active) ATB Peter

It is, Peter, and I've just replied to you. Mike

Nice to have the Churchillian spirit cited as the forum nears its end. He was of course an outsider, a dissenting voice who was mocked and derided for most of his Parliamentary career and was proven right regarding the threat of Germany.

I am not sure its relevance to this debate though.

thebigfredc posted:

Nice to have the Churchillian spirit cited as the forum nears its end. He was of course an outsider, a dissenting voice who was mocked and derided for most of his Parliamentary career and was proven right regarding the threat of Germany.

I am not sure its relevance to this debate though.

He also needed liberal quantities of alcohol to get through it all. Perhaps there's a parallel there? 

Nice to have the Churchillian spirit cited as the forum nears its end. He was of course an outsider, a dissenting voice who was mocked and derided for most of his Parliamentary career and was proven right regarding the threat of Germany.

I am not sure its relevance to this debate though.

Dear FredC. Noone can judge us tonight.... we can all let the child still residing in us out, whoop whoop ????????ATB Peter

911gt3r posted:

Nice to have the Churchillian spirit cited as the forum nears its end. He was of course an outsider, a dissenting voice who was mocked and derided for most of his Parliamentary career and was proven right regarding the threat of Germany.

Perhaps quite relevant:

"Events in Europe throughout the twentieth century compelled Churchill to retain a strong focus on the Continent during his political career. This extended from the early twentieth century when Churchill fought to reinvigorate Britain’s Navy as a reaction to the rising threat in Germany, to his integral role in the Second World War where he took swift and decisive action to combat Hitler’s armies which were sweeping across Europe. 

Nonetheless, it was in the wake of this war that Churchill delivered what were perhaps his most heartfelt and focused speeches on Europe, first in Zurich and later in The Hague. It is these speeches that reveal Churchill’s admiration for and understanding of Europe, and his belief that the only way to rebuild and recover after the devastation of war was through unity and a common purpose."

I thought Churchill made another important speech about Europe in the USA when he coined the expression 'the Iron Curtain', foreseeing the grim prospects for those countries finding themselves within the USSR and the coming cold war with the West.