ND5 XS 2 user review

Following the “source first” principle, ND555+5si > ND5XS2+552/500

I think that an ND5XS2 potential buyer should demo it in an XS or SN2 context

M

some were impressed by the nd5xs2 performance.     If you compare a porsche carrera to a mclaren 720s,  you will find the porsche a bit sad and uninvolving.   So better not listen to an nd555 if you plan to buy an nd5xs2.

French Rooster posted:

some were impressed by the nd5xs2 performance.     If you compare a porsche carrera to a mclaren 720s,  you will find the porsche a bit sad and uninvolving.   So better not listen to an nd555 if you plan to buy an nd5xs2.

Really, no risk at all, I will not listen to neither, NDX2 and ND555.

Like I did till now with Keel/Ekos.

M.

Chag... posted:

OuYang posted:

I am also waiting ND5XS2 to compare with Roon Bridge + nDAC. My amp is Nait XS and source is Roon. I actually don't need full function network player like ND5XS2/NDX2, but Naim seems not to release new pure DAC anymore.

While I haven't listened to ND5XS2 or NDX2 for that matter (but I did listen to ND555), I would probably go S/H ND5 and nDAC instead of brand new ND5XS2. 

Chag - 

Yesterday retailer give me the price of NDX2 and ND5XS2, NDX2 is twice as expensive as ND5XS2 so it is not an option for me.

For the price of new ND5XS2, add some budget I can buy S/H nDAC with a good Roon Bridge like LUMIN U1 MINI. I like the combination of ND5XS2 and Nait XS, one for digital and one for analogue, simple and clear. But the price is higher than I expected.

So I still have no attempt at describing the performance of an ND5 XS2 – strange, on a forum where the ability to put sound into words reaches sometimes Beckett heights in terms of surrealism – but just the result of comparisons in which the smallest of the series has been compared to all its bigger and costlier siblings. Strange! I would have sweared that any dealer was trying to sell the smaller and less costly of the streamers... And then, how many posters often praise balance within setups: and yet, it was OK for many to compare an ND5 XS2 into a system made for streamers four times the cost of the basic one.

I will have to listen to one by myself and, for the Nth time, take notice of how threads seem to become vague and take detours when something of your actual interest is concerned.

hungryhalibut posted:

The purpose of these demos is to show the differences in the streamers. If you start changing amps and speakers at the same time, nobody can judge what is doing what. Of course the ND5 and NDX are out of their depth, but hopefully prospective purchasers will have more meaningful demonstrations at their leisure. 

The purpose of these demos could also be to show the relative performance of systems, with gear paired with its natural matches (as you often preach). So, I too believe that an ND5 XS2 should have been inserted in an XS chain, with perhaps a residual pair of S-400s or with one of the various Focals that Naim, until not long ago, still quoted in the regretted 'suggested systems' pages. 

If you go to have a test drive of a Toyota IQ – a splendid little car – and the dealer makes you drive a Lexus – also made by Toyota – what do you think the opinions will be about the IQ? So what if I am interested in an IQ and don't give a s*it about a Lexus?

I haven't heard one, but logic would say that given how good the Nova is, an ND5 XS2 is going to be pretty good with a NAIT XS2 for the price. These are pretty good systems, and there is a demising return as you go higher up for a significant jump in price I believe.

I mostly leave dealer demos with a big question- and exclamationmark above my head. The questionmark because I don't know what I've heared: was it the room? the amp? the source? the recording? tidal or wav? ... and the exclamationmark because I'm really happy with what I have and I can keep the money in the pocket.

Massimo Bertola posted:

 – strange, on a forum where the ability to put sound into words reaches sometimes Beckett heights in terms of surrealism –

Max, I will never forget this beauty by your hand:

https://forums.naimaudio.com/t...56#69708705615633556

Carlos Kleiber could have said this in his rehearsals.

Massimo Bertola posted:

hungryhalibut posted:

The purpose of these demos is to show the differences in the streamers. If you start changing amps and speakers at the same time, nobody can judge what is doing what. Of course the ND5 and NDX are out of their depth, but hopefully prospective purchasers will have more meaningful demonstrations at their leisure. 

The purpose of these demos could also be to show the relative performance of systems, with gear paired with its natural matches.

 

Yes, it could, however in this case it wasn’t. The purpose is to show what you get for the extra money. A demo of a natural match system with an ND5 against one with NDX2 or ND555 is something else entirely, requiring three different sets of amplification and three different sets of speakers. As I said, these demos are just tasters, and purchasers will arrange with their dealers demonstrations in suitably copacetic systems. There is no value in saying scenario X should also be scenario Y, when it was only ever intended to be X. 

I would love to know the logic behind making the ND5 XS 2 non-PSU-upgrade-able.  My ND5 XS benefited hugely from a PSU upgrade so it would have be nice to also have this option on the ND5 XS 2.

Reminds me a bit of the 172 XS which from what I gather was not a very popular product.

I think there is a lot of nonsense appearing in this thread recently. If you hear two streamers on the same amplifier and loudspeakers and the more expensive one sounds better, it’s because it is better, as one would hope.

It’s absurd to say that the cheaper one sounds worse because the amplifier and loudspeakers were too good for it, and to believe that if only it had been matched with cheaper amplifier and speakers it would suddenly magically sound better, as good as the more expensive one on the more expensive amplifier and speakers perhaps?

These comparative demos are interesting because they give some insight into whether given your circumstances it may be worth paying more and getting a better one. But they shouldn’t be how you decide which one to buy.

Anyway I’m going to stop following this thread now.

best

David

And I thought I had only asked for the mere opinion of someone who had heard the ND5 XS2 in its natural habitat... Mike Sullivan, thanks for a sensible reply and for having understood the simple meaning of my question. I also got a lecture on which I'll have to reflect, since it doesn't seem to contain the slightest trace of doubt or uncertainty.

David, who wrote this?

It’s absurd to say that the cheaper one sounds worse because the amplifier and loudspeakers were too good for it, and to believe that if only it had been matched with cheaper amplifier and speakers it would suddenly magically sound better, as good as the more expensive one on the more expensive amplifier and speakers perhaps?

I couldn't find any of these assumptions or conclusions in the last bunch of posts. But perhaps it's my clumsiness with the English language. Anyway, I too will stop following this thread and will patiently wait to be able to listen with my ears to an ND5 XS2, in the real world.

Bye.

wrc posted:

I would love to know the logic behind making the ND5 XS 2 non-PSU-upgrade-able.  My ND5 XS benefited hugely from a PSU upgrade so it would have be nice to also have this option on the ND5 XS 2.

Reminds me a bit of the 172 XS which from what I gather was not a very popular product.

I suppose – my opinion only – that the logic behind it could be a), to avoid stuffing in it features that wouldn't have added significantly to the performance which, judging by the lack of a display too, could be very good already and betray a very pondered design meant to mark a significant step over its predecessor and, b) to further expand the gap to the NDX2, whose predecessor, in my opinion, was one of the weak points in Naim group of streamers and at risk of finding itself redundant. And yes, I have heard it, and heard it well. So, my idea is that Naim has made the ND5 XS2 as good as possible and, at the same time, has conjured up making it seem less than it is to favor the NDX family, which has always had an unfavorable cost/performance ratio.

But, as usual, let's wait for more authoritative and informed opinions than mine.

I will have another go Massimo. At Audio show east Naim played a ND5 XS2 and NDX2 into SN2 with hi-cap and Kanta 3. On the first day they did the usual demo music and A to B comparisons, the NDX2 as David said in his post sounds more authourative and gave more detail,, but they both sounded very musical. The following day I spent some time talking with Mike and the guys from a Naim, the plan was just to play good music that most people would have heard and enjoyed. They played the ND5XS2 while we chatted and listened it’s a great player, very enjoyeable to listen to. It was the most musical room at the show and I slipped in and out a number of times, could not tell you what player was being used, because it did not matter....both sounded really good in that system, set up in that room. A number of other members have commented on how good the Naim room was, many not going in to details of what was playing. I am surmising that they too just enjoyed the music, as it was a respite from Hifi demos in other rooms. I would certainly demo this product if I had a Supernait or similar amp. I also find it difficult to find the words to explain how music-in different systems sound. But sometimes just saying it’s musical and enjoyeable should be enough. I know some on the forum want more detail and people like DB are great at providing that and we should be thankful for all posts.

Very clear, thanks. Musicality is presently very plainly my only concern – on the taken-for-granted basis of Naim's standard high technical quality – and that is why I so promptly swapped my SN for a NaitXS2, to make an example.

Having run after detail for years like Achab after Moby Dick has not made my life better, and while I agree that we should be thankful for all posts, unless one is just promoting or contradicting or provoking, I'd say that contributions can be useful and immediately applicable and convenient, or they can turn your life in a hell of 1/8th torque paranoia.

I think the subject of the ND5 XS2 has been covered at length. Thanks for your clarification. It's now between me and the small box without a display.

M.

I can't to wait to hear one myself and if it fits my ears I shall be pairing it with a Naim 5si. I have no intention of upgrading my amp as the 5si to my ears is 'easily' good enough.

Can the ND5 XS 2 be used as uPnP server, as the ND555 and the new Uniti range?

https://forums.naimaudio.com/t...sb-v-server-mode-usb

Mike, I’m intrigued. I know the Unitis can do this, but I wasn’t aware that the new streamers could. To be specific - can you plug in a USB hard drive and then stream from the streamer to other streamers? If so, that sounds really simple for people. But somehow I don’t think you can. 

whoops,   sorry groveling apologies,  completely misunderstood the question,  I've deleted that post.       

hungryhalibut posted:

Mike, I’m intrigued. I know the Unitis can do this, but I wasn’t aware that the new streamers could. To be specific - can you plug in a USB hard drive and then stream from the streamer to other streamers? If so, that sounds really simple for people. But somehow I don’t think you can. 

The ND555 can for sure, also as a uPnP server for itself (see the thead linked above and https://forums.naimaudio.com/t...56#76469591920328856).

M.

So with the new streamers there is no need for a wired network and server (NAS or other)? Now you can attach a usb disk and control streamer  with wifi? Is this right?

The UPnP server has certainly been included in the ND555 as well as the Unitis, so I assume the new ND5 and NDX would have it too. Maybe best to confirm with Naim as their documentation is limited. It’s a nice feature to have, and being UPnP, it works with non-Naim streamers too. 

charnik posted:

So with the new streamers there is no need for a wired network and server (NAS or other)? Now you can attach a usb disk and control streamer  with wifi? Is this right?

You still need a network connection, although the improved WiFi performance compared to old models means that wired Ethernet may not be essential. Also, I think the jury is still out on how well this function can support a large music library. It does work fine on my Atom with a drive containing about 600 CD rips.