NDX and Chord Hugo

Posted by: Foxman50 on 18 April 2014

I have been contemplating adding a DAC to my NDX/XPS2 to see (or should that be hear) what it can bring to the party. And so thought it about time i made inroads into Having a few home demos. After looking around at products that are within my budget i came across the Chord Hugo DAC.

 

Although it is meant to be a portable headphone unit, it can be used as a full line level fixed DAC.

 

The dealer lent me a TQ black digital coax lead, which have twist grip plugs. This was required as the present batch of Hugo's have a case design fault that wont allow any decent cable to fit, soon to be rectified. Thankfully the TQ just manages to hang on to the coax port.

 

Once all connected and gone through the minimal setup procedure of the Hugo, what does the red LED mean again, i left it to warm up for half an hour.

 

Poured a beer and sat down for an evenings listening.

 

What was that, where did that come from, that's what that instrument is. OMG, as my little'n would say, Where is it getting all this detail from.

 

After spending last night and today with it, all i can say is that it has totally transformed my system from top to bottom. I never considered my NDX to be veiled or shut in, not even sure that's the correct terms. All i can say is its opened up the sound stage and space around instruments. Everything I've put through it has had my toes, feet and legs tapping away to the music.

 

Even putting the toe tapping, the resolution the clarity to one side, what its greatest achievement for me has been in making albums that I've had trouble listening too enjoyable now.

 

One added bonus is that it has made the XPS redundant. I cannot hear any difference with it in or out of the system.

 

While i thought a DAC may make a change in the degree of the jump from ND5 to NDX, i was not prepared for this. Anyone looking at adding a PSU to there NDX may want to check this unit out first.

 

For me this has to be the bargain of the year.

 

Posted on: 23 April 2014 by sjbabbey

Anyone audition the Hugo with an ND5 with or without an XP5? I'd be interested as it would save a fortune compared to upgrading to an NDX or NDS and PS555.

 

Posted on: 23 April 2014 by Foxman50
Originally Posted by sjbabbey:

Anyone audition the Hugo with an ND5 with or without an XP5? I'd be interested as it would save a fortune compared to upgrading to an NDX or NDS and PS555.

 

Sj this is kind of a guess but i doubt there would be any difference between an ND5 on the Hugo and the NDX i have with it. As i say this is a guess, but get a home demo of one and try it out

 

Graeme

Posted on: 23 April 2014 by Foxman50
Originally Posted by lovethatsound:
Well after all the hype about the chord hugo dac I thought I'd try 1 out on my hdx with xps, now I love the sound of my hdx so this hugo dac has got 2 be good, I've had it on for 3 hours now and it has totally blown me away , lets just say it won't be going back.

You may well want to try it without the XPS on your HDX as well. I could not tell any difference when disconnecting it on my NDX. 

 

Graeme

Posted on: 23 April 2014 by sjbabbey

Sounds like a good idea. it could be a very versatile upgrade to my ND5/XP5 combo and a great headphone amp which I could run from the digi output of my upstairs UQ2.

Posted on: 23 April 2014 by Kevin Richardson
Originally Posted by Jude2012:
Originally Posted by oscarskeeper:
 

Great to hear that the transport or server does not affect the SQ, in your experience 

 

So... now with the Hugo nothing matters?  Before Hugo everything matters.  Now nothing.

Posted on: 23 April 2014 by Foxman50
Originally Posted by sjbabbey:

Sounds like a good idea. it could be a very versatile upgrade to my ND5/XP5 combo and a great headphone amp which I could run from the digi output of my upstairs UQ2.

See my above post about the power supply. It could go towards the cost. Mine will be on flee bay very soon.

Posted on: 23 April 2014 by Jan-Erik Nordoen
Originally Posted by Kevin Richardson:
Originally Posted by Jude2012:
Originally Posted by oscarskeeper:
 

Great to hear that the transport or server does not affect the SQ, in your experience 

 

So... now with the Hugo nothing matters?  Before Hugo everything matters.  Now nothing.

Not my experience here. I'm finding substantial differences between the U/S into the Hugo via optical S/PDIF, the MacBookPro via USB, and a Panasonic Bluray player via optical. The U/S is the clear winner in involvement with the music, and that's with basic optical cable. I had previously dismissed optical as a less than optimal solution, but my experience here is encouraging to the point that I've ordered a Wireworld Supernova 7.

 

How goes your quest for sonic perfection ?

Posted on: 23 April 2014 by Foxman50
Originally Posted by Jan-Erik Nordoen:
Originally Posted by Kevin Richardson:
Originally Posted by Jude2012:
Originally Posted by oscarskeeper:
 

Great to hear that the transport or server does not affect the SQ, in your experience 

 

So... now with the Hugo nothing matters?  Before Hugo everything matters.  Now nothing.

Not my experience here. I'm finding substantial differences between the U/S into the Hugo via optical S/PDIF, the MacBookPro via USB, and a Panasonic Bluray player via optical. The U/S is the clear winner in involvement with the music, and that's with basic optical cable. I had previously dismissed optical as a less than optimal solution, but my experience here is encouraging to the point that I've ordered a Wireworld Supernova 7.

 

How goes your quest for sonic perfection ?

Jan-Erik

 

Are you able to test the same source into various inputs on the Hugo, not sure what outputs your U/S has. Certainly my Blu ray player does not sound as good as the NDX into the Hugo using the same coax input.

 

Graeme

Posted on: 23 April 2014 by Jan-Erik Nordoen

The Bluray player and the U/S were tested into the same S/PDIF input using the same optical cable.

 

The U/S' output is via coaxial or optical S/PDIF, but no USB, so I can't compare this input on the Hugo. The U/S also outputs via ethernet ; now if only the Hugo had a streamer section...

Posted on: 24 April 2014 by sjbabbey
Originally Posted by Foxman50:
Originally Posted by sjbabbey:

Sounds like a good idea. it could be a very versatile upgrade to my ND5/XP5 combo and a great headphone amp which I could run from the digi output of my upstairs UQ2.

See my above post about the power supply. It could go towards the cost. Mine will be on flee bay very soon.

I'm not sure I'd want to get rid of the XP5 if indeed I did decide to go for the Hugo. The suggestion seems to be that the Hugo is not entirely source agnostic. If the XP5 powers both the digital and analogue sections of the ND5 would it still not have a beneficial effect on SQ?

Posted on: 25 April 2014 by Foxman50
Only you can decide by  listening. I personally couldnt hear a difference with xps in or out of the chain.

Graeme
Posted on: 26 April 2014 by lovethatsound
Well I've took the xps off the hdx and it has made no difference 2 the sound, as far as I know the xps only provides power 2 the dac of the hdx as it does with all other naim eequipment.the chord hugo is in dac only mode and sounds fantastic, I could say it sounds very analogue, not like other dacs ive heard before, I really don't know how chord as done this, but this dac is a giant killer.
Posted on: 26 April 2014 by Evil Weasel

Interesting thread.... I tried out a chord Qute and dac v1 with my cd5xs and preferred the Qute which was better balanced and seemed to be even more detailed. Timing was excellent on Qute. I am waiting for Hugo to come into stock at dealer and can't wait to hear it!!!

What should my expectations be after hearing the Qute?

Thanks

Ben

Posted on: 27 April 2014 by Jonn
Originally Posted by oscarskeeper:

I said I’d make a few more comments when I had time, so here it is for anyone who’s interested…

 

In short, I think the Hugo is fantastic. Having earlier commented that I wasn't sure whether I preferred it to an Ndac/555, I'm pretty sure now that I do. I have to say that I'm rather surprised and frankly somewhat confused by this, not least because I like the Naim sound so much and have done for so long. The idea that such good sound could come from such a tiny little thing is rather difficult to get your head round when you're used most reasonably high-end kit, never mind Naim with its power supplies and chunky cables.

 

Being analytical about the sound, the only area in which I think the Ndac shades it is in terms of ultimate bass extension. The Hugo produces plenty, but the naim combo ultimately it has just shade more heft and weight.

 

Overall however, my impression has not been that there is anything particularly striking about particular aspects of the Hugo sound, but that I have simply found myself thinking "just one more track" in a way that I have not really done with digital since moving my CDS3 on. As other people have commented, there is something about the sound that is very non-digital in the way that it sounds unforced, natural and fluid. The best way I could describe it would be as being akin to a KDS with some added, more Naim-like drive and solidity. It really is that good.

 

The other very pleasing aspect for me is that it means everything I need for digital listening (i.e. my HDX and the Hugo) fits on one fraim shelf rather than on three. As far as I can tell, the Hugo is completely support agnostic and does not to my ears sound any different whether sat on various bits of Naim, on its own shelf, on the floor or held in my hand. This being so, I can't really see the point of having it sat on a separate shelf. That said, if you are going to use it as more of a digital preamp and therefore would need to use and access the controls, the situation might then be different.

 

It appears similarly indifferent to the input used and source. I've tried it with various combinations of spdif, optical and usb from a Macbook and Mac Mini, NDX and HDX. Although i won't pretend my "testing" was in any way scientific, I could not hear any difference between the various options. No idea whether it would be different with hi res music, as I've not got any! 

The designer of the Hugo, Rob Watts, has said that the Hugo is very close in sound quality to the much more expensive Chord QBD 76 and that the flagship DAC is being redesigned as a result, to quote:

 

"The QBD 76 has 16 elements on the pulse array, not 4 on Hugo, and has balanced outputs. But of course it is seriously rivalled by Hugo, so I am currently working on its replacement, which will feature all of the improvements made over the last 7 years that have gone into Hugo."

Posted on: 27 April 2014 by Jan-Erik Nordoen

We gave the Hugo a second in depth test this weekend into the 82/Hicap/250. Absolutely stunning on Fred Pellerin's disc "Silence", but it lost the plot on Leonard Cohen's "Old Ideas". Through the Hugo, it was as though Leonard was singing from his head - there was no heart or soul in it. Switching to a bare CDX, Leonard was back in all his glory, and we were transfixed. Same pattern on many other albums tested ; the Hugo excels on certain recordings, showing a depth that is very, very alluring. I heard my speakers doing things in the bass that they have never done before. But the Hugo is inconsistent, and that for me, is a fatal flaw. The CDX on the other hand is consistently involving, the sound may not be as pretty, but it trumps the Hugo in emotional connection with the music. 

 

The Hugo's focus is on the sound, whereas Naim focusses on the structure of the music. I know which approach I prefer.

Posted on: 27 April 2014 by analogmusic
Thanks for posting this.
 
I was seriously considering purchasing a Hugo, until I read your post.
 
I will stay with my DAC V1 for now.
 
Naim can be trusted to deliver a product without these annoying inconsistencies and fatal flaws.
 
At this level of what the Hugo costs (1250 GBP) that is not something I can accept.
 
 
 
Originally Posted by Jan-Erik Nordoen:

We gave the Hugo a second in depth test this weekend into the 82/Hicap/250. Absolutely stunning on Fred Pellerin's disc "Silence", but it lost the plot on Leonard Cohen's "Old Ideas". Through the Hugo, it was as though Leonard was singing from his head - there was no heart or soul in it. Switching to a bare CDX, Leonard was back in all his glory, and we were transfixed. Same pattern on many other albums tested ; the Hugo excels on certain recordings, showing a depth that is very, very alluring. I heard my speakers doing things in the bass that they have never done before. But the Hugo is inconsistent, and that for me, is a fatal flaw. The CDX on the other hand is consistently involving, the sound may not be as pretty, but it trumps the Hugo in emotional connection with the music. 

 

The Hugo's focus is on the sound, whereas Naim focusses on the structure of the music. I know which approach I prefer.

 

Posted on: 27 April 2014 by GregU

I find one to be more ephemeral, the other ethereal.  One focuses on the music, the other on the sound.  One is transparent, the other is music agnostic.  While the former shines with open recordings, the later plays to the strength of music.

 

My God man, cannot people ever say "I like this one better"

 

No  The answer is no

Posted on: 27 April 2014 by Foxman50
Originally Posted by GregU:

I find one to be more ephemeral, the other ethereal.  One focuses on the music, the other on the sound.  One is transparent, the other is music agnostic.  While the former shines with open recordings, the later plays to the strength of music.

 

My God man, cannot people ever say "I like this one better"

 

No  The answer is no

I like the Hugo better than my NDX/XPS . While not perfect as i mentioned above, its 90% in favour of Hugo for me at least.

 

Graeme

 

 

Posted on: 27 April 2014 by lovethatsound
Well I've been listening 2 the hugo all weekend and I have 2 say the music has been full of emotion, more than my hdx with xps, the chord hugo costs around £1400 it's very small, takes very little power,  and sounds better than dacs ccosting from £5000 2 £6000.i can understand some people being upset by this amazing dac , and not wanting 2 believe how good it, but this hugo dac is a game changer
Posted on: 28 April 2014 by Foxman50
Originally Posted by Jan-Erik Nordoen:

We gave the Hugo a second in depth test this weekend into the 82/Hicap/250. Absolutely stunning on Fred Pellerin's disc "Silence", but it lost the plot on Leonard Cohen's "Old Ideas". Through the Hugo, it was as though Leonard was singing from his head - there was no heart or soul in it. Switching to a bare CDX, Leonard was back in all his glory, and we were transfixed. Same pattern on many other albums tested ; the Hugo excels on certain recordings, showing a depth that is very, very alluring. I heard my speakers doing things in the bass that they have never done before. But the Hugo is inconsistent, and that for me, is a fatal flaw. The CDX on the other hand is consistently involving, the sound may not be as pretty, but it trumps the Hugo in emotional connection with the music. 

 

The Hugo's focus is on the sound, whereas Naim focusses on the structure of the music. I know which approach I prefer.

Jan-Erik

 

Thanks for your update, and i think in part i agree with your comments about Leonard's vocals. I did find something similar myself, but not sure is its just a presentational difference. But i have to say i don't agree with lacking emotion, but that's why we are all different.

 

For me i can have the best of both worlds, running through the Hugo for the majority of albums, but if i find the odd album i prefer through the NDX i can just switch the amp over, as ill be leaving both analogue and coax connected.

 

Graeme

 

 

Posted on: 28 April 2014 by Foxman50
Originally Posted by analogmusic:
Thanks for posting this.
 
I was seriously considering purchasing a Hugo, until I read your post.
 
- Yes nothing like basing your purchasing decisions on a single thread in a single forum. Very wise indeed
 
I will stay with my DAC V1 for now.
 
- I think that is definitely your safest bet
 
Naim can be trusted to deliver a product without these annoying inconsistencies and fatal flaws.
 
- Really. how silly of me i must have forgotten NAIM make the best product in every category at every price point. How did i forget that.
 
At this level of what the Hugo costs (1250 GBP) that is not something I can accept.
 
"This is unacceptable soldier"
 
Graeme
 

 

 

Posted on: 28 April 2014 by analogmusic

I am not a Naim only devotee. But they do get the basics of music which are important to me correctly.

 

The issue is where I live, it's too much of an effort to be able to audition the Hugo.

 

If Chord were to have a 30 days trial period, maybe worth it to listen to it.

 

But I enjoy reading all these giant killer reviews in which a battery operated DAC is able to better NDX/XPS 

Posted on: 28 April 2014 by analogmusic
so a battery operated Hugo is better than HDX/XPS?
 
Are you selling it on then?
 
Originally Posted by lovethatsound:
Well I've been listening 2 the hugo all weekend and I have 2 say the music has been full of emotion, more than my hdx with xps, the chord hugo costs around £1400 it's very small, takes very little power,  and sounds better than dacs ccosting from £5000 2 £6000.i can understand some people being upset by this amazing dac , and not wanting 2 believe how good it, but this hugo dac is a game changer

 

Posted on: 28 April 2014 by Foxman50
Originally Posted by analogmusic:

I am not a Naim only devotee. But they do get the basics of music which are important to me correctly.

 

- I'm not sure any company gets the basics right, i think they all put there own spin on it. We buy equipment to make music sound the way we like it. Its a very individual thing. I have heard many a system i cant stand yet others will say its the dogs. Who can say what the correct presentation is

 

The issue is where I live, it's too much of an effort to be able to audition the Hugo.

 

- This is the biggest issue i think we all have. If only all dealers could stock everything.

 

If Chord were to have a 30 days trial period, maybe worth it to listen to it.

 

- I would have thought a week would suffice, but this would be down to your dealer i guess.

 

But I enjoy reading all these giant killer reviews in which a battery operated DAC is able to better NDX/XPS 

 

- the technology in my NDX is some years old now. Not only that but it is more than just a DAC, so i cant see what is so unbelievable about this. I wouldn't be surprised if the Hugo and DAC in the NDX are of similar value.

 

I will say again, best way to make a judgement is to have a demo. Don't put stuff down without hearing it first. Who knows you may hate the sound of it. I wouldn't be surprised.

 

Graeme

 

Posted on: 28 April 2014 by analogmusic

The problem is that maybe I won't hate the sound of it, but maybe I will not be impressed either

 

many me too average digital sources out there.

 

So what?