NDX and Chord Hugo

Posted by: Foxman50 on 18 April 2014

I have been contemplating adding a DAC to my NDX/XPS2 to see (or should that be hear) what it can bring to the party. And so thought it about time i made inroads into Having a few home demos. After looking around at products that are within my budget i came across the Chord Hugo DAC.

 

Although it is meant to be a portable headphone unit, it can be used as a full line level fixed DAC.

 

The dealer lent me a TQ black digital coax lead, which have twist grip plugs. This was required as the present batch of Hugo's have a case design fault that wont allow any decent cable to fit, soon to be rectified. Thankfully the TQ just manages to hang on to the coax port.

 

Once all connected and gone through the minimal setup procedure of the Hugo, what does the red LED mean again, i left it to warm up for half an hour.

 

Poured a beer and sat down for an evenings listening.

 

What was that, where did that come from, that's what that instrument is. OMG, as my little'n would say, Where is it getting all this detail from.

 

After spending last night and today with it, all i can say is that it has totally transformed my system from top to bottom. I never considered my NDX to be veiled or shut in, not even sure that's the correct terms. All i can say is its opened up the sound stage and space around instruments. Everything I've put through it has had my toes, feet and legs tapping away to the music.

 

Even putting the toe tapping, the resolution the clarity to one side, what its greatest achievement for me has been in making albums that I've had trouble listening too enjoyable now.

 

One added bonus is that it has made the XPS redundant. I cannot hear any difference with it in or out of the system.

 

While i thought a DAC may make a change in the degree of the jump from ND5 to NDX, i was not prepared for this. Anyone looking at adding a PSU to there NDX may want to check this unit out first.

 

For me this has to be the bargain of the year.

 

Posted on: 28 April 2014 by lovethatsound
Yes I will be moving my xps on, the hdx and the hugo work together brilliantly.
Posted on: 29 April 2014 by Fokkelman

Wow! I'm a bit shocked by the reviews. I own a NDS/555PS DR and thought it to be the best for the price. But, I will certainly demo the Hugo.... makes me wonder if Naim is overpriced for what it delivers.

Posted on: 29 April 2014 by cat345

IMO, the Naim dac was not overprice when it came out but things move fast with digital.

Posted on: 29 April 2014 by Aleg

Get a more than decent software player and all could be different again.

Posted on: 29 April 2014 by Foxman50

Wat , Aleg would you kind enough to outline the front end setup you use. I would like to try out computer audio, probably via a mac mini at least to start with, but am wondering the best, or cost effective, solution. Could you state

 

1. hardware ie mac mini, windows nuc, etc

2. software, ie jriver, itunes

3. connection to dac, ie optical, usb

 

and anything ive missed. I'd like to use the ipad to control in a similar fashoon to using nstream to select music, but not sure if this is possible. many thanks

 

Graeme

Posted on: 29 April 2014 by Aleg
Originally Posted by Foxman50:

Wat , Aleg would you kind enough to outline the front end setup you use. I would like to try out computer audio, probably via a mac mini at least to start with, but am wondering the best, or cost effective, solution. Could you state

 

1. hardware ie mac mini, windows nuc, etc

2. software, ie jriver, itunes

3. connection to dac, ie optical, usb

 

and anything ive missed. I'd like to use the ipad to control in a similar fashoon to using nstream to select music, but not sure if this is possible. many thanks

 

Graeme

Graeme

 

as requested ;-)

 

1. Home built audioPC in fanless chasis based on ASUS Q87M with i7-4770T, 16 GB RAM, picopsu160xt with linear psu, SSD with JCAT  sata cable

Windows Server 2012 R2 in minimal server mode, OS, registry and WASAPI MMCSS optimisations,

Acousense GISO GB LAN filter, AQ Cinnamon, Netgear GS108 with linear psu, home built NAS.

2. MQn minimal software player, now in version 2.98 avx non-fast

3. JCAT USB3 card, JCAT USB cable, Sonicweld Diverter HR2, NAIM DC1

Naim DAC + XPS-2

 

AudioPC is headless and controled from iPad via remote desktop app.

 

Cheers

 

Aleg

Posted on: 29 April 2014 by Foxman50
Originally Posted by Aleg:
Originally Posted by Foxman50:

Wat , Aleg would you kind enough to outline the front end setup you use. I would like to try out computer audio, probably via a mac mini at least to start with, but am wondering the best, or cost effective, solution. Could you state

 

1. hardware ie mac mini, windows nuc, etc

2. software, ie jriver, itunes

3. connection to dac, ie optical, usb

 

and anything ive missed. I'd like to use the ipad to control in a similar fashoon to using nstream to select music, but not sure if this is possible. many thanks

 

Graeme

Graeme

 

as requested ;-)

 

1. Home built audioPC in fanless chasis based on ASUS Q87M with i7-4770T, 16 GB RAM, picopsu160xt with linear psu, SSD with JCAT  sata cable

Windows Server 2012 R2 in minimal server mode, OS, registry and WASAPI MMCSS optimisations,

Acousense GISO GB LAN filter, AQ Cinnamon, Netgear GS108 with linear psu, home built NAS.

2. MQn minimal software player, now in version 2.98 avx non-fast

3. JCAT USB3 card, JCAT USB cable, Sonicweld Diverter HR2, NAIM DC1

Naim DAC + XPS-2

 

AudioPC is headless and controled from iPad via remote desktop app.

 

Cheers

 

Aleg

Clearly i missed a lot . Many thanks Aleg, Think your solution is a bit much for me though. Did you notice a difference with your LAN filter.

 

Graeme

Posted on: 29 April 2014 by Aleg
Originally Posted by Foxman50:
Originally Posted by Aleg:
Originally Posted by Foxman50:

Wat , Aleg would you kind enough to outline the front end setup you use. I would like to try out computer audio, probably via a mac mini at least to start with, but am wondering the best, or cost effective, solution. Could you state

 

1. hardware ie mac mini, windows nuc, etc

2. software, ie jriver, itunes

3. connection to dac, ie optical, usb

 

and anything ive missed. I'd like to use the ipad to control in a similar fashoon to using nstream to select music, but not sure if this is possible. many thanks

 

Graeme

Graeme

 

as requested ;-)

 

1. Home built audioPC in fanless chasis based on ASUS Q87M with i7-4770T, 16 GB RAM, picopsu160xt with linear psu, SSD with JCAT  sata cable

Windows Server 2012 R2 in minimal server mode, OS, registry and WASAPI MMCSS optimisations,

Acousense GISO GB LAN filter, AQ Cinnamon, Netgear GS108 with linear psu, home built NAS.

2. MQn minimal software player, now in version 2.98 avx non-fast

3. JCAT USB3 card, JCAT USB cable, Sonicweld Diverter HR2, NAIM DC1

Naim DAC + XPS-2

 

AudioPC is headless and controled from iPad via remote desktop app.

 

Cheers

 

Aleg

Clearly i missed a lot . Many thanks Aleg, Think your solution is a bit much for me though. Did you notice a difference with your LAN filter.

 

Graeme

Definitely, it is very good in removing noise from the ethernet line. There was much more ease to the sound and the cliché "blacker backgrounds".

 

not all LAN filters are equal though. I used an Acoustic Revive before and that took a lot of the dynamics out of the music and the Acousense GISO is doing a much, much better job. The GISO has been developed to be used in a professional recording studio (Acousense is foremost a record label and they built it for own use) to filter all the ethernet lines.

 

cheers

Aleg

Posted on: 29 April 2014 by Foxman50

Im glad you mentioned the Revive, i had been looking into one of these recently, not exactly cheap and seem to be many fake ones around. Will look at the GISO. Thanks for the tip.

 

Graeme

Posted on: 29 April 2014 by Harry
Originally Posted by Aleg:
 
I used an Acoustic Revive before and that took a lot of the dynamics out of the music 

 

Also my finding. It was a significant backward step but easy to sell on, which was to its credit. 

Posted on: 29 April 2014 by analogmusic

No Din output on a teac or on a Chord Hugo.

 

 

 

 

Posted on: 29 April 2014 by Foxman50
Wat
 
Thank you very much for your thorough post. Very interesting indeed. I think this is why im finding computer audio very daunting, its because it is so configurable.
 
Still youve given me a lot of things to look into. Many thanks
 
Graeme
Posted on: 29 April 2014 by Foxman50
Originally Posted by analogmusic:

No Din output on a teac or on a Chord Hugo.

 

 

 

 

I don't use or need DIN outputs 

Posted on: 30 April 2014 by Jude2012
Greame, I use a similar front end as @Wat (Mac Mini and V1 with Audivarna).  This is simple configuration and I am obviously happy with SQ and have done all the tweaking, other than replace the PSU or HDD in the mini.

Regarding the Hugo, I am curious but not that bothered with auditioning it (yet).

Jude :-)
Posted on: 30 April 2014 by Foxman50
Originally Posted by Jude2012:
Greame, I use a similar front end as @Wat (Mac Mini and V1 with Audivarna).  This is simple configuration and I am obviously happy with SQ and have done all the tweaking, other than replace the PSU or HDD in the mini.

Regarding the Hugo, I am curious but not that bothered with auditioning it (yet).

Jude :-)

Hi Jude

 

When you say you've done all the tweaking, is there a web page outlining this. Im being a bit lazy here as i have'nt looked, but am wondering how you know what to tweak.

 

Do you connect via USB to the V1, is USB the best solution?

 

Graeme

Posted on: 30 April 2014 by Foxman50
Originally Posted by Wat:

 [@Analogmusic, you forgot to mention Hugo is the wrong colour ].

 

 

Wrong colour but it has any colour LED you could want, not just grotty green

 

Posted on: 30 April 2014 by Foxman50

Wat

 

Can i ask how you found out which settings, or should that be, how to configure the settings in Audivarna.

 

Graeme

Posted on: 30 April 2014 by analogmusic

the Hugo cannot be upgraded by XPS 

Posted on: 30 April 2014 by Foxman50
Originally Posted by analogmusic:

the Hugo cannot be upgraded by XPS 

Ah but XPS just stands for Xpensive Pointless Supply. And who needs one of those, certainly not Hugo

Posted on: 30 April 2014 by natnc

Hugo has an upgraded power supply, Duracell!

 

Posted on: 30 April 2014 by George J

One thing that worries me about anything with a built in and rechargeable battery is that to change the battery - and all batteries wear out in the end - would constitute a repair job.

 

I wish the rechargeable cycle lights and something like the Hugo were equipped with a opperator-removable rechargeable battery, so that the battery may be exchanged without a visit to the repair shop.

 

Just two penneth worth.

 

ATB from George

Posted on: 30 April 2014 by Jan-Erik Nordoen
Originally Posted by Foxman50:
Originally Posted by analogmusic:

the Hugo cannot be upgraded by XPS 

Ah but XPS just stands for Xpensive Pointless Supply. And who needs one of those, certainly not Hugo

The fellow who runs the Aum Acoustics web site seems to think otherwise. He describes a power supply that solves the problem of a certain thinness to the Hugo's sound, which he ascribes to the use of batteries.

 

"This lack of body is probably due to Hugo's power coming solely from its internal lithium battery supply. Batteries just don't float my boat (never have and never will) and always have a somewhat thin sound compared to a properly designed power supply. There is nothing like a super high quality transformer based power supply with a traditional bridge and cap bank to make an audio component sounds its best."

Posted on: 30 April 2014 by Jan-Erik Nordoen

Some other interesting snippets :

 

"As a battery drains, the amount of chemical compound available to produce electricity drains. That means there's an exponential decay on the amount of power a battery can produce. So a battery at 100% will have far more capability of producing fast transients than a battery at low charge.

 

Batteries have a substantial amount of high frequency ripple. This means there is a large AC component to their DC output voltage.

 

The battery's chemical reaction will generate different types and frequencies of noise. The chemical reaction changes as the battery drains. That means the spectrum of noise changes as well. The change in load also impacts the way the battery is draining, which will alter the chemical reaction and thus the noise produced.

 

As a battery drains so does the output current and the output voltage. As these elements change the voltage will become less stable and the transient response slower.

 

So ultimately you are creating a non-constant source that has varying spectrums of noise, that is constantly changing, and produces the exact noise we want to get rid of."

 ...

 

"A well design transformer based power supply, on the other hand, can be built to a much higher bandwidth that functions consistently. This type of power supply can filter the incoming AC noise, eliminate ripple to exceptionally high frequencies, and have much higher slew rate and current output than a battery supply. This means their sound will always be consistent and their potential much greater."

Posted on: 30 April 2014 by analogmusic
Indeed, and until Chord sort this out, the Hugo is product with a major design flaw.
 
 
Originally Posted by George J:

One thing that worries me about anything with a built in and rechargeable battery is that to change the battery - and all batteries wear out in the end - would constitute a repair job.

 

I wish the rechargeable cycle lights and something like the Hugo were equipped with a opperator-removable rechargeable battery, so that the battery may be exchanged without a visit to the repair shop.

 

Just two penneth worth.

 

ATB from George

 

Posted on: 30 April 2014 by analogmusic
Indeed.
 
How polite Naim are to allow Foxman to keep posting negative posts about Naim.
 
If he likes the Chord so much as he says he would be too busy listening to music on it.
 
But anyway - it's good to hear both sides, and certainly I remain unconvinced that a battery powered DAC can equal or beat an XPS power supply with NDAC or NDX.
 
Whatever... as I keep saying, there are many, many Me too DAC's out there.
 
So what?
 
 
 
 
Originally Posted by Jan-Erik Nordoen:

Some other interesting snippets :

 

"As a battery drains, the amount of chemical compound available to produce electricity drains. That means there's an exponential decay on the amount of power a battery can produce. So a battery at 100% will have far more capability of producing fast transients than a battery at low charge.

 

Batteries have a substantial amount of high frequency ripple. This means there is a large AC component to their DC output voltage.

 

The battery's chemical reaction will generate different types and frequencies of noise. The chemical reaction changes as the battery drains. That means the spectrum of noise changes as well. The change in load also impacts the way the battery is draining, which will alter the chemical reaction and thus the noise produced.

 

As a battery drains so does the output current and the output voltage. As these elements change the voltage will become less stable and the transient response slower.

 

So ultimately you are creating a non-constant source that has varying spectrums of noise, that is constantly changing, and produces the exact noise we want to get rid of."

 ...

 

"A well design transformer based power supply, on the other hand, can be built to a much higher bandwidth that functions consistently. This type of power supply can filter the incoming AC noise, eliminate ripple to exceptionally high frequencies, and have much higher slew rate and current output than a battery supply. This means their sound will always be consistent and their potential much greater."