1st week with my new system (500-DR, n272, Focal Scala V2 Utopia)

Timmo1341 posted:

3’ into the room is a huge incursion HH, particularly if it’s a living room rather than a dedicated listening room - surely no ‘normal’ speaker needs that amount of space?

There’s no such thing as a ‘normal’ speaker! They all vary so much, and every room is different. Some speaker/room combinations may need that and more, in other rooms the same speakers may be best closer to the wall, while some speakers need to be tight up against the wall. 

Timmo1341 posted:

3’ into the room is a huge incursion HH, particularly if it’s a living room rather than a dedicated listening room - surely no ‘normal’ speaker needs that amount of space?

Well, quite, and that’s why I use my SL2s, which sit happily 9cm from the wall. Those Focals are absolutely massive, and they need space if they are to sound as they should. One would hope that those buying a £20,000 set of speakers has a room large enough to accommodate them. You cannot squeeze a quart into a pint pot. When I heard the Scala Evos at Nam they were positioned as I described, and they delivered a huge soundstage and amazingly solid bass. I didn’t like the sound - they are not my cup of tea at all - but they certainly sounded mightily impressive. 

Has anyone asked the OP if the SuperLumina DIN to 500 are correct on their L/R colour coding going into the 500? I have no idea if it makes a difference but do think both DIN outputs will be outputting stereo but at the other end the correct L/R cable needs to go into the 500. (I think).

I've never plugged a 272 into a 500, and have not previously thought of using the two DIN outs from a 272 to a power amp as the 500 (and 300) most often would have a power supply of some description doing the dual out work into the colour coded input. 

Just a thought.

I'm intrigued to know why you originally decided on the 272 when the rest of the system is in a different league?

Was it financial or space/box count?

cdboy posted:

Has anyone asked the OP if the SuperLumina DIN to 500 are correct on their L/R colour coding going into the 500? I have no idea if it makes a difference but do think both DIN outputs will be outputting stereo but at the other end the correct L/R cable needs to go into the 500. (I think).

I've never plugged a 272 into a 500, and have not previously thought of using the two DIN outs from a 272 to a power amp as the 500 (and 300) most often would have a power supply of some description doing the dual out work into the colour coded input. 

Just a thought.

If the din to XLR leads are connected the wrong way round, there will be no sound. They are mono leads. So it’s not that. 

Praggers posted:

I'm intrigued to know why you originally decided on the 272 when the rest of the system is in a different league?

Was it financial or space/box count?

Reading the original post it implies the whole package was bought, second hand, from one previous owner.

Timmo1341 posted:

Praggers posted:

I'm intrigued to know why you originally decided on the 272 when the rest of the system is in a different league?

Was it financial or space/box count?

Reading the original post it implies the whole package was bought, second hand, from one previous owner.

Or new from a distant dealer, he's a long way beyond the Pale.

What was the previous system ?  20 years out in the wild is a long time.

Personally I don't want to hear big bass unless it's on the recording.

Could be worth trying the speakers set along the long wall and having them as large monitors firing at close proximity.

just spent an afternoon at the Tate Modern, with an installation in the turbine hall.  A vast vast space, which at one end has a bank of mega subwoofers and some ridiculous watt mega amp.  Standing at some considerable distance on one of the bridges, a most weird wobble took over my entire self. Interesting to observe but maybe not something I would want to experience every time I took a listening session.

No, that was just someone behind you doing a 'ki push' on you! 

yeti42 posted:

Timmo1341 posted:

Praggers posted:

I'm intrigued to know why you originally decided on the 272 when the rest of the system is in a different league?

Was it financial or space/box count?

Reading the original post it implies the whole package was bought, second hand, from one previous owner.

Or new from a distant dealer, he's a long way beyond the Pale.

The words were “All equipment is less than 1 year old, and the original owner...”, so one original owner, and that does not suggest a dealer - however no indication as to whether it sounded right in the previous owner’s room. 

But unless the 272 has no bass that is not the cause of the present problem, however less than perfect it may or may not be as a source and preamp.

Timmo1341 posted:

Praggers posted:

I'm intrigued to know why you originally decided on the 272 when the rest of the system is in a different league?

Was it financial or space/box count?

Reading the original post it implies the whole package was bought, second hand, from one previous owner.

This is correct. I bought the whole system from one previous owner. Perhaps I should have been more aware that a $7,000 streamer would not work well with a $34,000 amp?! Improper synergy (or something like that) they say...

JeredH posted:

.

 

This is correct. I bought the whole system from one previous owner. Perhaps I should have been more aware that a $7,000 streamer would not work well with a $34,000 amp?! Improper synergy (or something like that) they say...

Yet you should be able to hear it at the best it can do, even if that is not as good as other streamers and preamps. Maybe the 272 simply doesn’t go down in the bass, which I would finf surprising - however if you get something like REW to check out your system you will soon discover what is going on. Even without a microphone you can set it up to output any given frequency, or to ramp through, and you can do that through just one speaker and move it and yourself around, listening for peaks and troughs around - if nothing brings the bass out anywhere, simply rolling off well above where it should there is something very wrong in one of the components, but if you discover the bass is audible (at a similar or louder level compared to higher frequencies) with speaker or listening in one part of room and opposite in another, that is the toom effect that you must explore with positioning/layout. 

It can be tedious (some say fun, but I never found it so, just wanting to listen to music!), but it is well worthwhile taking the time.

JeredH posted:

Timmo1341 posted:

Praggers posted:

I'm intrigued to know why you originally decided on the 272 when the rest of the system is in a different league?

Was it financial or space/box count?

Reading the original post it implies the whole package was bought, second hand, from one previous owner.

This is correct. I bought the whole system from one previous owner. Perhaps I should have been more aware that a $7,000 streamer would not work well with a $34,000 amp?! Improper synergy (or something like that) they say...

Perhaps you should, but you weren’t, and nothing can change that. I can reassure you that the 555PS raises the performance of the 272 massively. Of course a ND555 and 552 would be better, but at a very significant cost. Get the power supply, set it all up properly, make sure you are streaming at least CD quality from your NAS and it will be great, I’m sure. And I can assure you that the 272 can do bass. 

As a 272/555DR owner I agree with HH the 272 can deliver bass and I use a 250DR into Tab 10 Sig speakers !

With setup you have it warrants the 555DR.

Strange that you have no bass? Doubt that a power supply will change that drastically. Quality of bass and sound in general but amount? 

My guess would be setup and positioning. I have no experience of your particular gear but in my experience finding the right speaker position is easiest starting without toe-in (your picture indicate rather strong toe-in). I try to listen for timing and openness in the sound first. Toe-in is for me step two. Step three slight position adjustment after toe-in. 

As other have indicated doing this without proper feet in place might partly be a waste of time... Good luck!

Last time I had n272 it had bass. I listen to some club/techno/dub. I had nap200 back then so I assume nap500 has at least 300 more bass.

Olek_K posted:

Last time I had n272 it had bass. I listen to some club/techno/dub. I had nap200 back then so I assume nap500 has at least 300 more bass.

Yes - the NAP numbers directly relate to the numbers of basses.  The 500 has 300 more than the NAP 200.

Bart posted:

Olek_K posted:

Last time I had n272 it had bass. I listen to some club/techno/dub. I had nap200 back then so I assume nap500 has at least 300 more bass.

Yes - the NAP numbers directly relate to the numbers of basses.  The 500 has 300 more than the NAP 200.

Ah, that explains why I like my 3 x 250's as that setup makes 750 basses. 250 more than a 500 amp. :-)

So what about the Statement? Infinite basses?

Innocent Bystander posted:

So what about the Statement? Infinite basses?

Well it's called the S1, so 1 bass...

J Saville posted:

Do the Scala v2s not come with floor protectors in the spike box? The Evos do...

You shouldn't require any toe-in with them, as long as you can get close to an equilateral triangle between them and your seating position you should be fine. 

You certainly have a good foundation in terms of electronics, particularly if you're getting a 555PS. That lines you up nicely to go ND555 and 552 pre-amp down the road.

No, the spike box only has spikes & two tools. 

Tonight I eliminated toe-in and sound stage opened up a lot; much better! I pulled speakers 3' off the wall and moved my listening seat back, and I'm not convinced this is gonna work with the behemoth V2 loudspeakers.  Until I get some things to reduce reflection in this room, I still have a lot of placement work. The television will be a long-term killer. The thick curtains are helping, but the low ceiling is harsh, the quartz walls in the wet bar result in reflection from one side of the room, and I still haven't put them f'ng speakers on spikes.  Right now all the bass is trapped along the entire wall behind the speakers. I get some bass collection in the back corner of room, but not as much as I'd expect.  I'm not looking for overwhelming bass, just an even dispersion from what I think these speakers can produce. I'm wondering how this 500 really matches up. Man I wish I could've auditioned the 500 with Focals before I took the plunge. Part of my purchase was sold on the fact Focal voiced these V2's with their Naim 500. dammit. 

I remain stuck on my original though - these speakers are too big for this room.  I went for arena sound, in a room that's a lounge.  As one said, I'll keep the babies in the water. For now. I really want to explore my hometown EgglestonWorks.  Since I do not have a Focal dealer anywhere near me, I should source options from another rich, more native source.  We also have Halford Loudspeakers. 

For all you non-Focal peeps, if you could pair any speaker with 500/n272 w/ 555PS, what you be listening to? 

Also, any other recc's on room treatments? I'd like to explore more. 

edit: non-focal. I shouldn't use the word naysayers around these parts

TOBYJUG posted:

What was the previous system ?  20 years out in the wild is a long time.

Personally I don't want to hear big bass unless it's on the recording.

Could be worth trying the speakers set along the long wall and having them as large monitors firing at close proximity.

just spent an afternoon at the Tate Modern, with an installation in the turbine hall.  A vast vast space, which at one end has a bank of mega subwoofers and some ridiculous watt mega amp.  Standing at some considerable distance on one of the bridges, a most weird wobble took over my entire self. Interesting to observe but maybe not something I would want to experience every time I took a listening session.

Previous system was a NAD AVR-716 integrated amp. I bought it in 1998 along with some Klipsch Q-50s and I bought a second set of speakers (PSB), and this system got me through my last two houses.  The disco kid inside me added a Velodyne 12 for a few years, but I never got into surround or home theatre.

I enjoy bass because I built custom cabinets for a car stereo shop for a few years in the 1980s, and the thrill of tuning a cabinets was always so much fun and seemingly in my DNA. I enjoyed plugging speaker numbers into softwares on a 3.5" floppy and generating cabinet sizes.  I would play with all types of cabinets...sealed, ported, rear bandpass and all those fun designs used inside of cars. Haha this led to mastering hyperbaric chambers by using the interior of the car itself as part of the enclosure. The 1980's were great, especially for American rap and deep hitting bass hehe.

The concept of Focal using Naim amps is intriguing to me.  Can anyone point me to a thread in these forums where this topic of Naim/Focal pairing was tested/explored/discussed?

edit: I've never been to the UK, and my 15 year is telling me he wants to go to school there. Suddenly I want to visit this installation in Tate Modern. #bucketlist

hungryhalibut posted:

That room looks lovely and spacious to me. When I heard Focal Scalas at Naim, they were much further from the back wall. Can you try them about 3’ away, and pointing virtually straight ahead. Toeing then in as much as you have will give a smaller, less expansive sound. Spikes are really important, and should come in the box. Naim make Fraim Chips to protect your floor, but in the meantime coins will do the job. You really cannot assess the sound with the speakers sitting on those trolleys. Just use then to get the imaging right. Have the speakers firing straight ahead and toe them in just enough to get a stable central image on vocals. When right, you shouldn’t be able to tell exactly where the speakers are - the music should inhabit the room. Keeping doors shut helps a lot. 

When I auditioned the Sopra 3's they were at least 6 feet off the wall, and in a room twice the size of mine.  Certainly a dedicated listening position, which will be hard to obtain given my room is a functional "livinglistening" room. And full wetbar. =]

I can't wait to spike them. Need to get the young lady to help me hoist these behemoths so I don't toss a disc in my wretched back.

Room treatments are an absolute necessity. My low ceiling is deflecting the Scala V2 so much.  Ugh. And the wet bar forms this quartz cubby-hole that swirls high frequencies. Oh well, fine tuning shall be fun & I'll enjoy the Scala ride, no matter how longer or short it may be.  Thanks again everyone for the help. And the ribbing....i like pain.

Exit stage left to the wet bar I’d suggest....

My media room is around 5m x 3.5m and with a low ceiling, whereas the lounge is a big open plan space. I moved my previous system from the lounge to the media room with Totem Hawk speakers, and the performance was better with the more contained accounting space of the smaller room. I now have a Nova with Totem Forest Sigantures in the lounge and it really hums - but I tried them in the media room, and the Forests need more air to shift than the smaller room has and bass bounces with the lower ceiling. So I think room size and ceiling hieghts can be a factor, and those focals are very big and will want a lot of air to shift?