252 or CD555 ?

wenger2015 posted:

252 missing Burndy has finally arrived...... system now up and running..... 

i suppose it’s now a question of giving it 2or 3 days to settle in....

its going to be interesting to directly compare with the 282....

Go on play some music but wait a few days before telling us. Playing music is the best exercise for your boxes. Put the CDX2 on loop.

Phil

Filipe posted:

wenger2015 posted:

252 missing Burndy has finally arrived...... system now up and running..... 

i suppose it’s now a question of giving it 2or 3 days to settle in....

its going to be interesting to directly compare with the 282....

Go on play some music but wait a few days before telling us. Playing music is the best exercise for your boxes. Put the CDX2 on loop.

Phil

Yes, that’s exactly what I’m going to do.....I have just put a TQ system preparation disc on first ....

I am really looking forward to the next few days 

I think putting a CD Player onto continuous play for a few days is a rubbish way of burning anything in other than the CD Player. How about using an FM Tuner or Internet radio as the source, at least they don't wear out.

Ray

thebigfredc posted:

I think putting a CD Player onto continuous play for a few days is a rubbish way of burning anything in other than the CD Player. How about using an FM Tuner or Internet radio as the source, at least they don't wear out.

Ray

I don’t do streaming....

Just have a listen and stop fannying around. What’s your first impressions?

Wot Drewy said. Come on Wenger, spill the beans!

Is the 252 brand new or a  demo unit  If its the latter it should only me matter of hours not day I would imagine..

Wenger - Give it a good long time to make the right decsion. One thing to do is make sure the Burndy and the 'digital PSU' cable run close together from the SC to the 252. Enjoy the demo. 

It’s a new 252 so I think unfortunately time is needed for everything to come on ‘song’.....

i could not resist a brief listen of one of my favourite albums ....Fink.....Hardbeliver 

my initial impression is it does come across as  presenting the music effortlessly , controlled and composed.....

But I think to give the 252 a proper examination..... and proper comparison with the 282 (which is a terrific pre) then time will be required .....

what a great hobby this is.....

Wenger, you tease!

Loving this...keep it coming Wenger....the New Year?

Whenever I endeavour to report my views, I always try and be as honest as possible..... which can be difficult if an expensive purchase has just been made....... and we want to convince ourselves we haven’t wasted are hard earned cash............

on this occasion no purchase has been made as yet, my dealer has said I can keep the 252 as long as necessary to decide if i wish to trade up or not....so it’s what I call a win win situation 

Two things I have concluded very quickly, 1) the 252 is certainly not boring......

2)  i also understand why the 252 is often described as being  ‘grown up’ ..... the 252 has a maturity and level of musical insight that is staggeringly good....

I have also realised how important it is not to disregard the pre amp in ones quest for ‘musical heaven ‘ ..........

so far  so good.....

Take your time we are just jesting with you, enjoy and get back to us.

I think the Gunners have just matured somewhat! 

(Teasing you now Wenger)

nigelb posted:

I think the Gunners have just matured somewhat! 

(Teasing you now Wenger)

I have a feeling the 252 is gunner be good ...

Keeping my fingers (and toes) crossed. I do like my 252

I also keep the 282 and it gets to play every day. Now that I know both of them well, 252 gets chosen for critical listening every time.

Filipe posted:

yeti42 posted:

I also have a turntable above a 552, it's not a Linn and has no metal subchassis but a larger motor. I can hear no difference in ND555 replay whether it's on or off. With the 552 a shelf lower the system lost the spring in its step, probably from proximity to the 500ps on the adjacent rack. Moving the superline from above the 500 head unit up a shelf to below the preamp did make an improvement in LP replay so I've put the ND head unit where it used to be. I've not heard any effect on LP replay from putting the ND in standby compared to leaving it on, even with an active feed to it, doesn't mean there isn't one but it's not obvious whereas swapping plug order on the block has a very noticable effect on the whole system. This with passive NBLs, active might be a tad more revealing.

Most of us have restraints on how we can set up our systems, be they aesthetic, children, space or financial but there's usually room to optimise within those restraints.

@Yeti42 I can’t quite visualise your Racks. Also please could you describe your plug ordering?Thanks. 

Like your description of the sound loosing the spring it’s step. Can become flat footed even!

Phil

On the left from the top:                                   On right, all std level

                                                                            NAD tuner

Turntable on Fraim Lite std level shelf

                                                                           DVD5 

552 on Fraim std level

                                                                          500ps

SL on Fraim std level

                                                                          555ps

ND555 on Fraim medium shelf

                                                                         552ps

500 on Fraim base                                        SC

This puts the top of the top of the 500ps level with the bottom of the 552, The DVD5 will get a digital cable to the 555 when I get round to ordering one or I may just give up on it. Connecting it to the pre amp degrades the sound of either the 555 or the whole system depending on the ground setting of the 555. The NAD tuner would be a NAT 01 but for the continued threat of the end of FM and the need for a monster aerial, it and the DVD5 are on Fraim Lite shelves.

I have a dedicated 10 square mm feed to an unswitched double MK socket one of which feeds my home made power block which I won’t detail except to say there’s no star earthing but I’ve compared it to a Musicworks ultra and I’m still using it. Plug order my be more important than with star earthing however. Order is, from the power input, ND555, TTps, SC, 552, 500, DVD5, all powerlines. The NAD goes onto the other wall socket as it has a disasterous effect if plugged into the multiblock. 

[@mention:1566878603909035], Thanks for that. So your power block is daisy chained single or double sockets? You put your sources nearest assuming the 555DR can be considered a source. Perhaps can be thought of as in increasing power order. 

What powerblock ordering had the worst effect?

Phil

They're single MK sockets chained as said. I've tested several different orders over the years and concluded I get the most coherent and musical sound with the signal earth in socket 1, this may be peculiar to a linear chained block and I'd hesitate to say it was optimum for something with star earthing. I tried the power amp first, source last order as advocated by DB and found that it gave greater separation but it led to homing in on detail and missing the whole and when I went back the detail was still there, just less obvious as it fitted in better. Again I have to emphasise this is how I hear it, each will have to make their own minds up in the context of their system. I'd always run the turntable ps on socket 6 but during a recent visit to check on the ND555 my dealer suggested it should be in socket 1 I tried this out and found I lost coherence on all sources though the body of the turntable sound filled out, 555 on socket 1 and TTps on socket 2 gave the best of both worlds. Trying to integrate the DVD5 was informative as it is a signal earth but when the ND is demoted to socket 3 or 4 and set to floating the ND sounded no better than the DVD5 in socket 1, take signal earth out of socket 1 and system coherence suffers, having 2 signal earths just dulls the sound of the whole system so the only way to use the DVD5 is to connect it digitally to the ND555 but my good digital cable is just a bit too short and stiff to leave in place as it has a tenancy to fall out of the RCA digital output socket on the DVD5 (why not a BNC there?)

There are peculiarities about my setup. The floor is boards over battens resting on concrete, the boards are cut in a line on one of the battens (not my doing) so the system has to all be behind that batten rather than bridging the cut, this doesn't leave room for a double row block though I could perhaps hang one on the wall if necessary, a powerigel plus is also a possibility. I have no room for a third stack and the stacks are between the speakers as that's where they'll fit. The alternatives would have the system backing into a window bay or will involve sealing up a fireplace. There is a plasma telly on the wall which almost clears the top of the turntable cover and it's as high as it will go without taking a hacksaw to the bracket so that's where it stays. The system is a compromise but I have reasonable depth, a greater sense of scale since the TTps plug move, great PRATT and excellent emotional communication. The turntable is still my first choice though I'm sometimes buying a CD to rip for some music now even when there's a choice eg Muse on CD, Ry Cooder on vinyl.

[@mention:1566878603909035], I followed DB putting the three power supply plugs at the top and the nDAC powered by 555DR and CDX2 at the bottom. The CDX2 is the primary earth for the system with the nDAC floating. In your system does the ND555 earth through it power supply with no mains plug of its own?

I have switched double MK sockets.

I guess I could see how it sounds reversed.

Thanks for your insights 

All I can say is what works for my system, which I have tried to describe to put it in context, I suspect double sockets won't be quite the same from what I remember of their layout. That others have a different preferance is probably down to the different way their setups react but also may be down to how they listen and for what. I present what I've found with my setup and leave it up to others if they want to experiment, I don't predict everyone will agree with me because I know BD at least doesn't in his system context.  I can add that, when I tried a Naim DAC/555ps on a CDX2 I prefered the 555 directly on the CDX2 so didn't bother with the DAC. I also tried an SL from CDX2 to a 282 but couldn't get it off the floor without tying a loose loop in it, the hiline is a bit stiffer, with either a loop, resting on the carpet or even on an air filled packging cushion the sound was too analytical with the SL. I don't know if it would still be the case with ND555 and 552 but the ND has cleaned me out so the hiline it is for the forseeable. The ND555 is only connected to the mains via its power supply.

[@mention:1566878603909035], Thanks for the description of your setup.

Speakers will take a long time, but I have started moving one speaker (right) for the reason you suggest.

Most significantly I moved the CDX2 plug from bottom (furthest) to top putting the SuperCap DR of the 252 further down. Yes, I think the difference is very noticeable and more musical. As it happens the 555DR powering the nDAC is at the top on the other side. The nDAC is still at the bottom.

First impression of the effect on the Superline was that it improved in a similar way. It’s only day 3 with the Superline powered by HiCap DR (new SNAIC, 4-5 DIN IC, and HiCap DR). Hithertoo I haven’t been in awe, but it’s early days I suppose, and this changes things.

Wenger, I’m more and more amazed at how good the 252 is, that being the point of the thread.

Phil

Wenger, any news on the 282/252 comparison?

Nigelb,

Unfortunately, one of the downsides of working for myself is covering for staff sickness and holidays....

So leave home early back home late......

Since the initial first listen, I have just had brief listening opportunities...... 

what I have heard I have been impressed with........more depth, more detail......more musical insight.....

i am hopeful for an opportunity to listen to some tracks this evening....just have to negotiate the drive home first ?? 

But so far so good as they say....

Hope you get some downtime at Christmas and have a chance to listen to some music.

Seasons greetings to you and yours.

N